A Reprehensible Case

[Trigg]

Long process?? Adding two years??? I think not. Anyone who has applied for a teaching position has undergone an FBI criminal records check. Total time about one hour. Much like computers have made it easier for us to find our loved ones, they have made these types of check a piece of cake.

 

Buyer Beware?? You can't mean that. How can one openly support the Patriot Act and say something as insensitive as this?? Do you really believe that this Chinese woman knew of anyway to check out her new mate ?? Would a simple disclaimer in the paperwork from our Gov explaining the negative possibilities and how to 'look for yourself' using computer technology be to intrusive??? Only if you have something to hide.

 

Now, as I have stated before, time for talk is done--time to do is here.

 

Trigg

[hypoclear]

Mike you make many good points but again I am not saying make more laws or do I or others I believe would care if the person.. say robbed a bank, cheated on their taxes or was a drunk driver.

 

Why the need for a complete criminal background check? and as for incomplete or incorrect sex registerys.. such is life. How about a mix up on your credit report? Takes years to fix etc etc... I don't hear anyone saying lets close them down!

 

Here is an article from the NY Times.......

OP-ED COLUMNIST

Cambodia, Where Sex Traffickers Are King

By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

 

Published: January 15, 2005

PHNOM PENH, Cambodia

 

Sex trafficking at its worst is the slavery of the 21st century, yet it has become one of the world's growth industries. To understand how brazen it is, step up to the second floor of the Chai Hour II Hotel here in the Cambodian capital.

 

It's like an aquarium: beyond a glass wall are dozens of teenage girls in skimpy white outfits, each with a number. The customer orders a girl by number, and the manager delivers her a moment later to a private room.

 

A Cambodian police report in my hands describes the Chai Hour II as a case "of confinement of human beings for commercial sex" and adds that it is also "a place for trafficking/sale of virgin girls." All told, the report says, 250 girls and women work in the six-floor labyrinth of cubicles.

 

So last month, Cambodia's top-ranking female police officer ordered a raid on the Chai Hour II and rescued 83 girls. They were taken to a shelter run by Afesip, an aid group mainly financed by Spain.

 

But the next day, the trafficking tycoons turned the tables and raided the shelter. About 30 raiders, some wearing military clothing and at least one driving a car with military license plates, broke down the shelter gate, beat up one woman on the staff and took all the girls back to the brothel.

 

Aarti Kapoor, a legal adviser to Afesip, acknowledges that dozens of the girls genuinely wanted to return to the brothel; shame, drug addiction and a desperate need for money keep many in the sex trade. But dozens of others, she says, wanted to stay in the shelter but were forced back anyway.

 

To top it off, Cambodia's top police official reprimanded the female officer who had ordered the raid on the Chai Hour II and even briefly suspended her from her post.

 

We've had narco-trafficking states; Cambodia may be becoming the first sex-slavery state.

 

The U.S. State Department estimates that 600,000 to 800,000 people a year are trafficked across international borders, mostly girls and most of them for the sex industry. Many more, like the girls in the Chai Hour II, are trafficked within a country.

 

As it becomes a global industry, sex trafficking is increasingly controlled by organized crime, like the ethnic Chinese mafias in Asia, and the criminals use their profits to buy government officials. Cambodia had made progress against child prostitution in the last couple of years, but now the sex industry has struck back.

 

The Chai Hour is so bold that it drove some of the girls to the U.S. Embassy for a protest against Western interference. A lawsuit, nominally by the girls themselves (who say they're masseuses and entertainers rather than prostitutes), seeks $1.7 million from Afesip, in an apparent effort to drive it out of the country, and Afesip's staff has received many death threats.

 

"This is very dangerous, and I'm very scared about my security," said Pierre Legros, a founder of Afesip, who has hired eight bodyguards to protect his children. His wife, a Cambodian who also works for Afesip, has twice had guns held to her head.

 

I dropped by the Chai Hour II, explained that I was an American reporter and asked to interview the owner. He was "out." Teenage girls, looking about 15 and older, floated about, but the alarmed managers blocked me from interviewing them. A security goon made it clear that photos were out of the question - but a pimp did politely serve me a cup of tea.

 

The State Department's office on trafficking, to its credit, has been jumping up and down ever since the raid on Afesip occurred. "It's unacceptable - it's egregious," the office's director, Ambassador John Miller, told me this week. "This was government complicity."

 

But nothing will happen unless we get higher-level outrage in Washington and other foreign capitals.

 

President Bush has done more than his predecessors in making sex trafficking an issue, and his State Department has done a first-rate job exerting pressure - but there's so much more that we could do. The Bush administration could put a real dent in sex trafficking if we were to treat it as firmly as we do, say, pirated movies, and this brazen incident in Cambodia would be a fine place to start.

 

In the 19th century, the civilized world recognized that slavery was a moral blot on humanity and rose up against it. So why should we acquiesce in 21st-century slavery, when 15-year-old girls are imprisoned in brothels and sentenced to death by AIDS? Those kids in the Chai Hour II Hotel have nowhere else to turn, and their lives are in our hands.

 

 

E-mail: nicholas@nytimes.com

 

 

Now in regards to this case, would it be possible to convict or charge him with trafficing?

 

It also seems by this article.. that the government does indeed believe it is their job to deal with this. At some point you (and I'm not singeling you out or flaming you) just have to wake up.. admit it.. you are human they are as well and by golly... there is a thing called human respect.. are you for it or against it?

 

That will in most cases by and large dictate your actions.

 

Mark and Bea and Elizabeth

[frank1538]

My final major point is that the US Citizen that has convictions is not prohibited by law from marrying.  

This is the crux. You are absolutely right that a prior conviction is not a prohibition to marriage, and barring a law change of some sort, I would not expect the federal government to become involved with using prior convictions of the USC as a basis for denying a visa application.

 

But, I wonder what other safeguards are supposed to have been built into the visa system. As was pointed out, a bona fide relationship is the central criterion for a marriage based visa. While the emphasis is on determining whether the foreign spouse/fiancee can demonstrate this, with the required documentation that we all supply, it seems that such proof would indirectly extend to the USC as well. I have no idea what process this man went through, but many of us seem to think that there was slippage here - somehow this man was able to provide the woman with enough supporting documentation to get her a visa.

 

Now, I'll be the first to admit that it is entirely possible to provide proof without ever giving a hint of perversion, and the woman involved may have been too naive to have suspected anything during their required face to face meeting.

 

In a less than perfect world, this will happen again and again. It is sometimes the price we pay for not having the government involved in our daily lives. But, this does not keep me from wanting to extend a helping hand to a woman who was apparently duped by an imperfect system.

[mike_m]

I hope you're right Mark. If the prosecutors and court system can add in some kind of charges of international sexual trafficking then maybe this case can be brought to the federal level.

 

If that happens, and the suspect is convicted, then maybe he'll do some serious time.

 

I don't remember the age of the suspect, was it 68 ?. Anyway, if convicted in a federal court it is likely that he will spend the rest of his days behind bars. That's not sufficient punishment in my opinion, but it's probably the best we can hope for.

 

As far as helping the woman and child, I hope to see some way to make a legitimate contribution someday soon. I'll be checking this thread to get the details.

[oregonknl]

Mike M's comments articulately reflect my concerns ----

 

------ this is (and should be) a high profile case, but I expect it to reflect the exception, not the standard of the K visa applicants.......

 

.... ..... although it is certain to add to the public outcry to tar and feather all of us.... speaking of google ---- probably a lot of people distraught about this case are reading with interest the "official" profile of us on the USCIS website right now!

 

It may be of interest to know that the Chinese government does require a criminal background check of all perspective adoptive parents. And it is conducted prior to the filing of any application --- so it does add time to the process.

 

Because the Chinese government only makes placements through approved agencies in the US, they have good control over the background checks -- (fingerprints submitted to the state police, then subjected to the FBI data base for hits). China isn't likely to place a child with a couple if ANY criminal history is discovered. There was a couple using the same adoption agency at the time of my first adoption that came back with a minor drug conviction on their record --- they chose to abandon the process rather than appeal to the CCAA (China's adoption bureau)....

 

Personally, I think China, probably more than any other country has its S**T together in looking out for its orphans..... But that is a whole different issue than what we are discussing here...

[mike_m]

Don, that does beg the question....

 

Would a prior conviction for a sexual offense requiring registration as a sexual predator be considered an 'aggravated felony' ?

 

Per the link you provided the categories checked are:

 

suspected terrorist

potential threat to national security

active want or warrant

aggravated felon

prior deportation

 

If 'aggravated felon' does include the type of conviction that the man had then the existing system should have caught the case. If it didn't then it's a problem with the actual use and execution of the system, not the lack of a system process or procedure...

[hypoclear]

I hope you're right Mark.  If the prosecutors and court system can add in some kind of charges of international sexual trafficking then maybe this case can be brought to the federal level.

 

If that happens, and the suspect is convicted, then maybe he'll do some serious time.

 

I don't remember the age of the suspect, was it 68 ?.  Anyway, if convicted in a federal court it is likely that he will spend the rest of his days behind bars.  That's not sufficient punishment in my opinion, but it's probably the best we can hope for.

 

As far as helping the woman and child, I hope to see some way to make a legitimate contribution someday soon.  I'll be checking this thread to get the details.

There you go Mike that is what i was thinking.

 

If this person was on parole or part of their being released is that they not have contact with childern whether it be thru work et etc. Seems one could.. try and make a case that the federal gov was negligent in letting this child become a member of his household. If he was on parole than how about his parole officer?

 

And this is not to extract a pound of flesh from these people or agencies... but to make a case and point to force the gov to respond.

 

Don seems you have pointed out that there is indeed a system in place and functioning as well as could be expected. Now just add these people to the list and this may not happen again.

 

Than there is the idea of painting a big scarlet P for pervert on their Social Security card/number. Where ever that number is used or asked for the person asking gets a notice that the person is a convicted sex offender and in this case this woman would recieve a notice and NOT be given a visa.

 

So it seems basicly a little or alot of pressure brought to bear could close up a loop hole for someone like this and have no real impact on most people.

 

Mark and Bea and Elizabeth

[Bruce&Ying]

I just sent a letter, similar to the letter I sent to the Danville Police, to WMUR TV, who broadcast the story, asking for their assistance in finding a way to help the woman and her child. I also called the station's seacoast news bureau but no one was there. I did leave a message telling why I was calling and asking for a return call.

 

The Danville Chief of Police hasnt gotten back to me, but it's standard procedure in these small towns that the chief takes the weekends off. We can see if get any response by Monday afternoon, and then think of other options. Maybe the town welfare office? the local church?

 

Another option that occurred to me (thanks to Mark's research) is to send a letter directly to the woman at the address listed for her husband on the sexual offender registry site. Perhaps even a letter in Chinese (written by one of us who can do that) telling her who we are and that we would like to help her. To some degree it's an invasion of her privacy, but...

 

What other peoples' thoughts?

 

 

There have been a lot of thoughtful comments about what went wrong and how it can be fixed. I would still opt for the potential spouse getting a copy of the IBIS report at the earliest possible point in the process, especially if a child is involved, but would not be upset to see a law that prevents those who have been convicted of sexual offenses against children from applying for K2 or K3 visas.

[oregonknl]

Seems to me the best possible route would be to have someone reasonably local who is native Chinese make contact with the woman (someones SO ?) ----

 

------- would not be at all surprised at this point if she were extremely reluctant to trust white Americans offering help ----- particularly from a group of men (mostly) who met their fiancees through the same process she did...

[lassetter]

Can you imagine the screw-ups, foul-ups, and administrative chaos that would result if we saddled our constipated US State Department and the Department of Homeland Security the additional responsibility of checking to see if we had a criminal background? The whole K-1 >>K-4 process would grind to a complete halt!!!

 

If you really want to protect foreign spouses and their children from pedophiles and criminals I think it would be better to put the responsibility on their own governments. For example, I found the Nanning marriage office efficient, friendly, and inexpensive. The lady behind the desk was intelligent and "on the ball." It would have been no problem (for me or her) to have provided them some sort of certificate that stated I was not a felon.

 

The Chinese government seem to be "on the ball", too. For example, compare the efficiency and speed of Passport Control and Security in any Chinese Airport with that of LA or Chicago. Also, I was amazed at how simple it was to obtain a visa at a Chinese Consulate.

 

Rupert

[hypoclear]

Another option that occurred to me (thanks to Mark's research) is to send a letter directly to the woman at the address listed for her husband on the sexual offender registry site.  Perhaps even a letter in Chinese (written by one of us who can do that) telling her who we are and that we would like to help her.  To some degree it's an invasion of her privacy, but...

 

Hi Bruce;

 

Bea and I were just discussing this. She will compose a letter in Chinese and also one in English explaining who she is and will include our contact info here in China as well as where she will be staying in the states.

 

We want to email this directly to you and thought it might be best to forward this on to the chief of police. I certainly don't want this info sent to his house!

 

Aggie a woman from 001 is now living in Ct and Bea will contact her as well as posting the info on 001. There is also another woman, Angel who will be in Philly soon if not already who was very active and of course June who is a member here as well. Hopefully there will be some members of each group who are close by.

 

I have looked on the map and as thought danville is close to the metro Boston area, perhaps there is a Chinese organization there. I would imagine this woman and her daughter would need offers of housing and employment at some point.

 

Mark and Bea and Elizabeth

[hypoclear]

Anyone, Bruce.. interested in writiing to these two organizations in Boston?

 

http://www.cpaboston.org/ and http://www.aaca-boston.org/

 

It seems they both have years of experience and have a better understanding of how to approach local and government officials. They of course would have a good network and I'd assume the knowledge and resources to help this woman as well as directing us in setting up a fund for her and her daughter.

 

Contacting her and knowing she has the support of a firm solid Chinese Community so close by I'm sure would do much to ease her mind.

 

So anyone who is articulate and wants to contact them?

 

Mark and Bea and Elizabeth

[warpedbored]

Can you imagine the screw-ups, foul-ups, and administrative chaos that would result if we saddled our constipated US State Department and the Department of Homeland Security the additional responsibility of checking to see if we had a criminal background?  The whole K-1 >>K-4 process would grind to a complete halt!!!

 

If you really want to protect foreign spouses and their children from pedophiles and criminals I think it would be better to put the responsibility on their own governments.  For example, I found the Nanning marriage office efficient, friendly, and inexpensive.  The lady behind the desk was intelligent and "on the ball."  It would have been no problem (for me or her) to have provided them some sort of certificate that stated I was not a felon.

 

The Chinese government seem to be "on the ball", too.  For example, compare the efficiency and speed of Passport Control and Security in any Chinese Airport with that of LA or Chicago.  Also, I was amazed at how simple it was to obtain a visa at a Chinese Consulate.   

 

Rupert

It takes a cop who pulls you over about 5 minutes.

[MarkLuvsShuPing]

If there's a way to screw it up... 5 mins will turn into 5 months.

 

I prefer the stamp on the passport, not 100% effective, but certainly more efficient than what we have now. Once the girls on 001 and so forth find out about it, most all the girls will check the passports.

 

I agree with something that Jason wrote earlier, basically that USCIS isn't in the law enforcement business, they're job is (supposed to be) to protect us from outside threats of terrorists and illegal immigration. Why would they concern themselves with the citizens who are currently here?

 

While these incidents are sad and terrible when they happen, they need to be policed in some other way than through the visa approval process. I don't think it would be prohibitive for USCIS to send a list of petitioners to law enforcement agencies to make them aware of who's filing for visas, but that should be the end of their involvement. Let the FBI or local cops check it out.

[warpedbored]

I suppose one could take the devils advocate position and say that american women usually don't have the benefit of a prior conviction report either but they do have ample time and resources to. Something foreign brides don't have. Personally I think we should be concentrating our energies on how we can help this woman and child now. As trigg said time to talk is over, time to do is now.