WESTERN BOYS

[tonado]

My wife and her sister don't listen to their parents.

[warpedbored]

Interesting observation Jin. I don't have any children of my own but I have observed that many children these days don't have many manners. On the other hand because of the one child policy of China many Chinese children have been labeled little emperors or empresses.

[shadeOgray]

I found this very interesting as my discussions with ting led me to believe they were almost as naughty as US kids but in different ways.

She said China kids have ALLOT of pull, more than they should in family decisions. She says they are often very spoiled. I don't know one way or the other as I have no basis for comparison.

But I can comment on the US kids.

It's my opinion kids in the USA certainly have gone down hill but this is from many reasons and not a single excuse.

1. Kids raising kids and parents with out the tools to raise them. Every parent should take a parenting class.

2. Tree hugging hippies enforcing there views on raising kids allowing for no others and getting it put into law. Now you smack a kid on the butt and you can expect to see a bit of jail time if the wrong people found out.

3. Lack of education, the funding for our education system is in the toilet period.

Ever notice the worst schools are often in lets say the ghetto? Well now your pumping out idiots into society and guess what, now they will produce generally (not everyone so put your pitch forks down) idiots.

4. We lack any kind of general tight traditional beliefs as a nation other than the ability to vote and own a gun.

5. The US is a nation of laws but with every law we are more and more constrained by another's view. We are becoming less free every day with stupid little laws and corruption at the highest levels. Now were told how to raise our children, personally a swat on the butt did me allot of good as a kid but now...

 

Kids in China simply in my "opinion" have these traditional social values for the most part. This in turn generates respect and thats the basis of being civilized. With our respect, installing education in anyone becomes very difficult indeed.

Edited September 22, 2008 by shadeOgray (see edit history)

[Wendy W]

Western parents to soft on children I think.

 

Jin

 

Hell, I've gotten the flyswatter many times from the old man, but mother preferred the wooden spoon across the buttocks.

Heck no... I had a hard leather belt. I couldn't walk for days after I made a mistake... no kidding.

 

sheesh, mine was a bitter memory... my tools was differnt material of belts, slipper,stick. ruler. maybe I was very naughty.

Edited September 22, 2008 by WenDylanforever (see edit history)

[NewDay2006]

It's certainly a difference between cultures and laws.

 

I certainly received my fair share of corporal punishment in my younger life but in today's times it is illegal.

Reminds me of my 27 year old saying to me when he was about 7 or 8... He said dad, when you spank me that is child abuse. I asked him, what do you think will happen, his reply was "they will come and take you(dad) away".... I said no son... "they will come and take you away".... He thought for a minute and said, "dad, you don't abuse me"

 

I feel it is better you get them young, than the jails getting them when they are older.

[Toplaw]

Come on Rob, sounds like you aren't doing your job, Buddy. You don't see me complaining that Eastern girls are undisciplined. I know, I know, I am very lucky with Cici.

 

Maybe Jin would gain some perspective from watching that movie with Goldie Hawn. I think it is called Overboard. Then your boys might look like little angels to her.

 

Jin, for what it is worth, I agree with your observations that parents are sometimes too lax with their children, though I don't know that I agree that it is necessarily a Western characteristic of parenting. I have seen Chinese children in China (especially little boys) whose necks I would wring if they were my child. Ping feels the same way about them. I shudder to think what they will be like when they become teenagers.

 

As one step parent to another, though, I understand what you are going through. It is a delicate situation, but with time, I bet those boys will cater to your every whim.

[IllinoisDave]

Two of life's basic rules are being reinforced here IMHO.

 

1. Over-generalizations are never a good thing.

2. It's not just "ghetto" schools pumping out idiots.

[shaffej7070]

Two of life's basic rules are being reinforced here IMHO.

 

1. Over-generalizations are never a good thing.

2. It's not just "ghetto" schools pumping out idiots.

 

 

Yes. Research and prepare to defend your generalizations. Inner-city kids are not "idiots." Most of the schools are underfunded and not an attractive lure for educators. The government also subsidizes based on attendance, test scores, etc. Plainly put, these kids don't have the opportunities for a proper education that is afforded to those who dwell in middle-class suburbia, where salaries and property taxes are more lucrative. Demographics is the crux determining the child's future.

 

You will learn, shade. Remember, you're exposing your posts to many walks of life who are worlds apart from your inner circle of thought.

Edited September 22, 2008 by yimi386 (see edit history)

[Smitty]

Western parents to soft on children I think.

 

Jin

Not in my experience.

[jim_julian]

I firmly believe that parents, including step-parents, must establish clearly understood boundaries of acceptable behavior for children and young adults still living under your roof. The parents must agree on what will be established and not show any disagreement between themselves in front of the younger ones.

 

If the boundaries are violated then there are logical consequences to be incurred. These logical consequences must be related to the behavior that doesn't conform to the boundary. A simple example might be that if grades suffer, study time becomes mandatory.

 

The young person should also have the right to ask the parents to re-evaluate the boundary as they become older or circumstances change. The parents should consider the request privately and not debate in from of the requester.

 

With this scheme in place you never punish anyone, although they may incur logical consequences to undesirable behavior and there are no surprises.

 

Works for us ...

[IllinoisDave]

I firmly believe that parents, including step-parents, must establish clearly understood boundaries of acceptable behavior for children and young adults still living under your roof. The parents must agree on what will be established and not show any disagreement between themselves in front of the younger ones.

 

If the boundaries are violated then there are logical consequences to be incurred. These logical consequences must be related to the behavior that doesn't conform to the boundary. A simple example might be that if grades suffer, study time becomes mandatory.

 

The young person should also have the right to ask the parents to re-evaluate the boundary as they become older or circumstances change. The parents should consider the request privately and not debate in from of the requester.

 

With this scheme in place you never punish anyone, although they may incur logical consequences to undesirable behavior and there are no surprises.

 

Works for us ...

Nice,well-reasoned post as usual Jim.

[dnoblett]

I know that you meant "Western Boys" but every time I see post title, I think of the Hotel Chain "Westin Inns"

[Guest WenDylan]

I know that you meant "Western Boys" but every time I see post title, I think of the Hotel Chain "Westin Inns"

Wouldn't that be Westin Boys?

[SheLikesME?]

oh i dont mean that just , beating is no good. just westen soft give little ones to much choices, parents must be boss.

 

Jin - don'tI think is bigger problem these days...

This applies to some, not all parents:

1. work too much, make no time to really raise / foster their children.

2. corporal punishment is not legal in many places, so basic fear of 'ass-whupping' not so prevalent as it was in my generation.

3. focus and care not always on the children 100 percent of the time.

 

Now , I'm not perfect either, but I strive for something above today's median in the curve.

This weekend I wrote an email to my wife covering these points. Lil-One and I need her to pay more attention to the child. Wife needed to overcome her fear of not doing a good job so she kind of over extended her hours and emphasis on work. Now she has earned the good reputation but her daughter does not obey her very well. This has given my wife a lot of stress lately. So points 1 & 3 were stressed a lot in my email and wife began to change her practice the next day.

 

We enacted point 2 already, with my ass whippings, though my wife has no idea when to do this. She used to just let Lil One come and slap her in the face over and over when the child was angry. I put an end to that, whether right or wrong, back when the chop sticks were launched into wife's forehead. Wife and daughter have a natural lack of anger control and when discussing a situation later they try to use anger as an excuse for bad behavior. WRONG! The other problem is their pride which causes revenge to each other in ways. WRONG! Other than that they are perfect sweet angels

 

I don't mean to sound like I am picking on my wife so much. Grandparents took charge of most things with Lil-One until a few months after we married. Wife was a career woman doing the most financially for her family the whole time married to her first husband. And she is the one who got their house, & etc. She just has little confidence in her ability with children and tends to treat them like adults in expectations. She simply feels lost. So point 1 needed reducing and point 3 needed a lot of emphasis. She listens and appreciates my observations and has been seeking advice on what to do to make the family a better place. I pointed out how happy life was in Beijing and that we need to get back to that kind of loving kindness shown by all. She agrees. The change to America has not been very easy for them.

 

Now is this true that corporal punishment is not allowed in some places? Where? Anyone remember thipping or slapping babies hand when the baby would dig his/her claws into Mom enough to draw blood when angry about something?

Edited September 22, 2008 by SheLikesME? (see edit history)

[IllinoisDave]

I know that you meant "Western Boys" but every time I see post title, I think of the Hotel Chain "Westin Inns"

I guess my brain's wired similar to Randy's and Yimi's. I can't get that stupid song out of my head every time I look at this thread.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAHfoIfo_7A

Edited September 22, 2008 by IllinoisDave (see edit history)