Information on increased greencard & citizenship apps.

[lostinblue]

If you are borderline poor, then why on earth would you promise to support and give another person a better life by bringing them over here from another country if you can barely support yourself?? Thats so selfish when this person gives up everything to come here for you. Do you realize that by signing financial support papers, you are obligated to financially support her/him for the next 10 years even if you get divorced?... Im not saying I agree with the price hikes.. I dont. But if you cannot afford another 600 dollars, then how can you afford to take care of another person? The system isnt denying you bringing someone over thats poor, its you who had better be able to afford to bring them over and support them. No one wants to live a poor life and most of our SOs want and expect a better life with us.

 

As far as I am concerned.....You've hit the nail on it's head here! I whole heartedly agree with what Steve and Qingqing said here.

 

I couldn't have said it better!

 

PapaBear

I totaly disagree. Just what is borderline poor?American borderline poor or Chinese borderline poor."Thats so selfish when this person gives up everything to come here for you." One only has to travel through China to realize what POOR is. Get out of the cities and away from the well to do and privilaged chinese that most of us has met in our trips to china and see a real 3rd world country. Where there still are children not attending school,walking around barefoot , Where the home has no running water,no hot shower and maybe one light bulb for the whole home and no heat in winter. and people work 12-14 hours per day just to make enough to eat. or both parents leave the children with the grand parents and go to the cities to work and only see the children once a year. Just so they can send the children to school. Would some one in this situation be willing to come over here and live our poor life. I met a Chinese woman a few years ago and she was so amazed that she could go to school over here and get a degree with the programs that were made available to her. In china at her age she would never go to school as she lived outside a certain district and the universities there were a poorer quality in the one she lived in.Thus the ability to get a good job was was also lacking. With my Yan she works in the computer area and IF she can land the same job in the United States doing what she does in china she could make 30-40/hr. MAYBE. I am not borderline poor but on the lower end of the pay scale of most of the members here . Because of this I should leave her in China. Tell her to find someone else. The question is maybe what is poor to her. She told me during the cultural revolution she had a friend who invited her to stay for supper. They were poor. They were having a Rat for supper. I believe HER version of poor and YOUR version of poor will greatly differ.I would love to hear Eunice 's take on this.

[Steve and Qingqing]

You missed the whole point. Go back and reread the posts before mine. This has nothing to do with someone in China being poor. my point was for those complaining OVER HERE about barely being able to afford the price increases..They are the ones who shouldnt be bringing someone over here, whether they are poor or not, if they themsleves cannot afford to support themselves let alone another person...they should wait intil their income can support 2 or more before promising someone they love, a better life with them. Odds are the person they bring over wont find work for awhile, most likely a year or more and they had better be prepared for all the financial obligations that comes with taking on a big responsibility and marrying someone from another country.

[bosco]

You missed the whole point. Go back and reread the posts before mine. This has nothing to do with someone in China being poor. my point was for those complaining OVER HERE about barely being able to afford the price increases..They are the ones who shouldnt be bringing someone over here, whether they are poor or not, if they themsleves cannot afford to support themselves let alone another person...they should wait intil their income can support 2 or more before promising someone they love, a better life with them. Odds are the person they bring over wont find work for awhile, most likely a year or more and they had better be prepared for all the financial obligations that comes with taking on a big responsibility and marrying someone from another country.

 

And you sir have utterly failed in basic reading comprehension of the ideas expressed by those who responded when you wrote essentially the same thing earlier.

 

I didn't have to promise anyone a better life to convince her to come here. We met, fell in love, and decided we wanted to find a way to be together. Money was discussed as were many other things but it has never been the reason or motivation for either of us. But you just can't seem to comphrehend this. Your words have the effect of sounding like marriage is a financial rather than social/emotional contract. If most of the people here or even nationally were young people just out of school who have never had to manage for themselves, then I might find a way to agree with you a little--young people should perhaps wait awhile before marrying. But I would guess that the majority of people marrying citizens of other countries aren't 20 years old.

 

Enough of everything else has been said. I think I'll just go pull up my bootstraps and earn a few million today so I can "afford" to "buy" me a good wife......I'm truly sorry to be so blunt but intended or not, that IS how some of the people here sound sometimes.

 

 

(Walks away from wasting any more of my time with this--shaking my head in bewilderment)

Edited February 5, 2007 by Ling-Curt (see edit history)

[Steve and Qingqing]

I never said I promised my wife a better life as well. We met , fell in love and discussed what would be involved in pursuing a serious relationship. Sorry but money has alot to do with a marriage and if you cannot afford more than the poverty level of life, then why on earth would you drag someone else into your situation just because your in love?? How selfish that is..Im not rich by any means but I knew what I was getting into and if I could barelyc afford poverty level, I sure as hell wouldnt have asked another to join my life and suffer with just barely being able to afford the forms, let alone all that go's with a new relationship.

 

The whole thread is bascially about the price increases anyway and I agree that its wrong that we should have to pay more and such large increases when this government allows so many to live here and benefit from us for free. It pisses me off when I see people protesting the government in favor of illegals and their rights. They dont have any rights and surely wont be able to afford becoming legal nor will most even try when its so easy for them to get faked documents... All I know is if they are given amnesty, we here better see a refund of all the fees we had to pay out!

Edited February 5, 2007 by Steve and Qingqing (see edit history)

[bosco]

I never said I promised my wife a better life as well. We met , fell in love and discussed what would be involved in pursuing a serious relationship. Sorry but money has alot to do with a marriage and if you cannot afford more than the poverty level of life, then why on earth would you drag someone else into your situation just because your in love?? How selfish that is..Im not rich by any means but I knew what I was getting into and if I could barelyc afford poverty level, I sure as hell wouldnt have asked another to join my life and suffer with just barely being able to afford the forms, let alone all that go's with a new relationship

 

Repeating yourself for a third time without addressing (or showing any comprehension thereof) a single point those who are insulted by your posts doesn't help anything.

 

Are not both participants equal partners in deciding and making a marriage????? Your words continue to suggest otherwise and you seem incapable of seeing it. If a poor person meets and falls in love with someone, do they not have the same right to marry as a person with more?

 

Certainly if a poor person were to misrepresent his/her financial status there is a problem. But then, if the person he/she has met would change their mind because the person doesn't have enough, well then their wasn't that much of a solid foundation of love there in the first place.

 

How does one "drag" another into poverty???? Does not that other have equal status and the right to choose what is most important to her/him? Your words would only hold true if 1) One person really was more important/better than the other. 2) One person misrepresented the situation enough that the SO would be coming to the US to find a big unpleasant surprise. Your words seem to suggest the former condition more than the latter. But I find both possibilities to be utterly repugnant.

[NUWORLD]

I never said I promised my wife a better life as well. We met , fell in love and discussed what would be involved in pursuing a serious relationship. Sorry but money has alot to do with a marriage and if you cannot afford more than the poverty level of life, then why on earth would you drag someone else into your situation just because your in love?? How selfish that is..Im not rich by any means but I knew what I was getting into and if I could barelyc afford poverty level, I sure as hell wouldnt have asked another to join my life and suffer with just barely being able to afford the forms, let alone all that go's with a new relationship

 

Repeating yourself for a third time without addressing (or showing any comprehension thereof) a single point those who are insulted by your posts doesn't help anything.

 

Are not both participants equal partners in deciding and making a marriage????? Your words continue to suggest otherwise and you seem incapable of seeing it. If a poor person meets and falls in love with someone, do they not have the same right to marry as a person with more?

 

Certainly if a poor person were to misrepresent his/her financial status there is a problem. But then, if the person he/she has met would change their mind because the person doesn't have enough, well then their wasn't that much of a solid foundation of love there in the first place.

 

How does one "drag" another into poverty???? Does not that other have equal status and the right to choose what is most important to her/him? Your words would only hold true if 1) One person really was more important/better than the other. 2) One person misrepresented the situation enough that the SO would be coming to the US to find a big unpleasant surprise. Your words seem to suggest the former condition more than the latter. But I find both possibilities to be utterly repugnant.

 

 

CURT: Very well said!

What would one clasify as being poor??

Love has nothing to do with money!!!

Our government has put guidlines down for this process we are all in now!

That is why there a 125% poverty level guidline just to get this process started

My wife and I married each because we love each other and money had nothing to do with the choice me made!!

Yes it does cost money to bring our love ones from another country back to the US!!!

If everyone here on CFL did not meet the 125% level then there would

not be anyone here to write these posts!!

[FuManChu]

I agree with Steve.

 

 

Sorry, but if you can't afford a small increase of a few hundred dollars, how are you going to survive? I don't think anyone will argue that when the SO arrives in the USA there is going to be a short time, where they will be dependant on you. What are you going to do about he increase in costs associated with that? Are you going to be able to help her get an airplane ticket here?

 

I'll bet I'm probably younger than most here, and honestly, money is not an issue for me. But by analogy, would I have 10 children if I can't afford them? What is love going to get me? The only thing I want from my government is to deliver my mail, and pick up my trash. Keep your social security, medicare, etc.

 

I married for love. But I live in the world; not "never never land."

[bosco]

I agree with Steve.

 

 

Sorry, but if you can't afford a small increase of a few hundred dollars, how are you going to survive? I don't think anyone will argue that when the SO arrives in the USA there is going to be a short time, where they will be dependant on you. What are you going to do about he increase in costs associated with that? Are you going to be able to help her get an airplane ticket here?

 

I'll bet I'm probably younger than most here, and honestly, money is not an issue for me. But by analogy, would I have 10 children if I can't afford them? What is love going to get me? The only thing I want from my government is to deliver my mail, and pick up my trash. Keep your social security, medicare, etc.

 

I married for love. But I live in the world; not "never never land."

 

And yet you completely fail to understand that the majority of Americans do not have any savings? That the majority, for good or ill, manage to get by and even pay for a few extras like that trip to China but being hit by another substantial fee makes life more difficult? This is my point entirely, this attitude that "what is good/right for me should be good enough for everyone" is severely off-putting. It comes across as sheer arrogance when there is no evidence whatsoever of even a marginal attempt to understand another's life.

[NUWORLD]

I agree with Steve.

 

 

Sorry, but if you can't afford a small increase of a few hundred dollars, how are you going to survive? I don't think anyone will argue that when the SO arrives in the USA there is going to be a short time, where they will be dependant on you. What are you going to do about he increase in costs associated with that? Are you going to be able to help her get an airplane ticket here?

 

I'll bet I'm probably younger than most here, and honestly, money is not an issue for me. But by analogy, would I have 10 children if I can't afford them? What is love going to get me? The only thing I want from my government is to deliver my mail, and pick up my trash. Keep your social security, medicare, etc.

 

I married for love. But I live in the world; not "never never land."

 

 

 

And yet you completely fail to understand that the majority of Americans do not have any savings? That the majority, for good or ill, manage to get by and even pay for a few extras like that trip to China but being hit by another substantial fee makes life more difficult? This is my point entirely, this attitude that "what is good/right for me should be good enough for everyone" is severely off-putting. It comes across as sheer arrogance when there is no evidence whatsoever of even a marginal attempt to understand another's life.

 

Yes, I agree with you CURT!

I do not mind the increas in fees, BUT it should be within reason!!

A 400% increase is out of this world!!!!

With this kind of increase, It Will hit most of us hard all at once!

Edited February 5, 2007 by NUWORLD (see edit history)

[SirLancelot]

While I dislike the fee increases and I definitely think the increases are too large to digest in one sitting--it should be phased in, step by step--I think the debate about being poor and getting married is not relevant to this immigration process.

 

Again, please realize that the US government is not requiring you to have any level of income to marry. You can be completely destitute and still marry. You only need the $50 or so to get a marriage license in your state or in China. Many people seem to equate marriage and immigration into the same thing. For anyone who is poor, you can marry and live in China. Or you can marry someone else already in the US. The US government doesn't stop anyone from marrying, it only wants to prevent people who are unable to support their petitioned beneficiary once they arrive in the US from obtaining immigration benefits. Clearly everyone here agrees that immigration is not a right but a benefit. So the US government can and does control who has access to immigration.

 

The fee increases are not only relevant to K1 or K3 visas, they are across the board and employment based visas are going up significantly more. So I don't think this is biased against marriage at all.

 

Nevertheless, when all is said and done, of course I don't like this fee increase. But USCIS/INS has been given a mandate by Congress that they must be self sufficient (completely user fee based) and the current fees are by no means covering all the cost. One can argue that the USCIS has incompetent workers who should be fired to bring in more efficient and productive workers, but it still doesn't change the fact that they are not bringing in all the revenues necessary to maintain their operations. So in the end, we have no choice but to pay up, no matter how much we hate this increase.

[PapaBear]

---------------------------------------------------

And you sir have utterly failed in basic reading comprehension of the ideas expressed by those who responded when you wrote essentially the same thing earlier.

 

Your words have the effect of sounding like marriage is a financial rather than social/emotional contract.

 

(Walks away from wasting any more of my time with this--shaking my head in bewilderment)

 

---------------------------------------------------

But by analogy, would I have 10 children if I can't afford them?

----------------------------------------------------

And yet you completely fail to understand that the majority of Americans do not have any savings?

 

This is my point entirely, this attitude that "what is good/right for me should be good enough for everyone" is severely off-putting.

----------------------------------------------------

 

You know, I think that someone here has a deaf ear¡­¡­..and it is because his head is somewhere else. When he does hear the ¡°pop¡± it¡¯ll be a great realization!

 

The bottom line, as this thread began it¡¯s existence, is that the fee increase that USCIS is proposing isn¡¯t fair to anyone. Anyone struggling to make ends meet. Or anyone who is financially stable. The discussion of whether one can take care of their SO once here is for another thread in another place.

 

PapaBear

[obxtrainman]

At this point it took 1.5 years to get my wife here after we married. I might add that it was extremely unfair that the petitions going through Vermont were amazingly faster than those through Cali. I reside in North Carolina, out in the ocean, the extreme east coast of this country. Somehow the cutoff was Virginia, 50 miles north of here. Anyway, I wonder if they change their,"the governments", rules half way through the process, and by some freak of circumstance, I wasn't able to come up with the additional hundreds of dollars Are they going to deport my wife of 3.5 years, who will have resided here for a couple of years by then???

 

How can they even think that is fair to the people that have already suffered being separated from their loved ones for so long. And all the while telling us they want to give amnesty to the ones that are here illegally.

 

One really must wonder about the tactics of the current administration. I'm not bashing any one single politician, or party. I am in amazement of the current government. A government that I have devoted 22 years of my life serving. I'm sure our forefathers are turning over in their graves, just knowing what a mess has been made of the wonderful system that they came up with

[Rakkasan]

While I don't think lack of money should eliminate anyone from marraige or marriage to somoene from another country, I do wonder how those who are so stressed out over these increases managed to make one or more trips to China plus pay the costs of the medical, travel to the US Consulate and airfare for the wife/fiance to the US?

 

Yes, these increases are steep. I am hoping to have Zhen here prior to their going into effect so I can possibly sidestep some of them, however it is now February and the proposed increases are not expected to go into effect until October, that gives me 9 months to save an extra $900 to cover these costs. It may not be easy, but I expect I will be able to work it out with a little more OT and few less meals out.

 

As much as it pains me, I totally agree with Lances' post. These fees are mandated by congress, USCIS has no choice but to comply. Federal Register - February 1, 2007

 

Curt: Please stop throwing up your hands and walking away frustrated when responses don't go your way. Take a deep breath, type a cogent response and then simply respond again. Threatening to walk away shaking your head won't get your point across.

 

NOWORLD: I looked at the proposed increases again and I am not seeing a 400% increase in any one of the fees related to our process that is going to increase that much. Where did you get this number from?

 

OBX: That whole system is screwy. My service center is Nebraska, which is where I sent my application. Nebraska then forwarded it to California because Nebraska doesn't process Fiance Visas. HUH? Why not? Aren't they both USCIS service centers charged with the same responsibilities? Who knows.

 

I probably will submit a response of some sort as it relates to the increases, but having been involved with US EPA years ago and their public hearings, I know that the decisions are made prior to the public meetings and they are only a formality, these increases are a done deal.

Edited February 7, 2007 by Rakkasan (see edit history)

[NUWORLD]

While I don't think lack of money should eliminated anyone from marraige or marriage to somoene from another country, I do wonder how those who are so stressed out over these increases manage to make one or more trips to China plus pay the costs of the medical, travel to the US Consulate and airfare for the wive/fiance to the US?

 

Yes, these increases are steep. I am hoping to have Zhen here prior to their going into effect so I can possibly sidestep some of them, however it is now February and the proposed increases are not expected to go into effect until October, that gives me 9 months to save an extra $900 to cover these costs. It may not be easy, but I expect I will be able to work it out with a little more OT and few less meals out.

 

As much as it pains me, I totally agree with Lances' post. These fees are mandated by congress, USCIS has no choice but to comply. Federal Register - February 1, 2007

 

Curt: Please stop throwing up your hands and walking away frustrated when responses don't go your way. Take a deep breath, type a cogent response and then simply respond again. Threatening to walk away shaking your head won't get your point across.

 

NOWORLD: I looked at the proposed increases again and I am not seeing a 400% increase in any one of the fees related to our process that is going to increase that much. Where did you get this number from?

 

OBX: That whole system is screwy. My service center is Nebraska, which is where I sent my application. Nebraska then forwarded it to California because Nebraska doesn't process Fiance Visas. HUH? Why not? Aren't they both USCIS service centers charged with the same responsibilities? Who knows.

 

I probably will submit a response of some sort as it relates to the increases, but having been involved with US EPA years ago and their public hearings, I know that the decisions are made prior to the public meetings and they are only a formality, these increases are a done deal.

 

Rakkasan: If you would do all the math with all the other fees that are included with this increase, Then you would know!!!

 

And now you say that you need to work OT and save on meals.

The way i see it, your in the same boat as some others here in the US!!!

 

Your missing the whole point to the increases in fees!

I do not mind the increase in fees.

But IMO: The fees should spread out over time, NOT ALL AT ONCE!!!!!!!!

[obxtrainman]

While I don't think lack of money should eliminate anyone from marraige or marriage to somoene from another country, I do wonder how those who are so stressed out over these increases managed to make one or more trips to China plus pay the costs of the medical, travel to the US Consulate and airfare for the wife/fiance to the US?

 

Yes, these increases are steep. I am hoping to have Zhen here prior to their going into effect so I can possibly sidestep some of them, however it is now February and the proposed increases are not expected to go into effect until October, that gives me 9 months to save an extra $900 to cover these costs. It may not be easy, but I expect I will be able to work it out with a little more OT and few less meals out.

 

As much as it pains me, I totally agree with Lances' post. These fees are mandated by congress, USCIS has no choice but to comply. Federal Register - February 1, 2007

 

Curt: Please stop throwing up your hands and walking away frustrated when responses don't go your way. Take a deep breath, type a cogent response and then simply respond again. Threatening to walk away shaking your head won't get your point across.

 

NOWORLD: I looked at the proposed increases again and I am not seeing a 400% increase in any one of the fees related to our process that is going to increase that much. Where did you get this number from?

 

OBX: That whole system is screwy. My service center is Nebraska, which is where I sent my application. Nebraska then forwarded it to California because Nebraska doesn't process Fiance Visas. HUH? Why not? Aren't they both USCIS service centers charged with the same responsibilities? Who knows.

 

I probably will submit a response of some sort as it relates to the increases, but having been involved with US EPA years ago and their public hearings, I know that the decisions are made prior to the public meetings and they are only a formality, these increases are a done deal.

 

When are you sheep going to stop making up excuses for a screwed up administration???

 

My math figures from the news reports,,,,, that the people that have recently, and concurrently going through the process of immigration legally are going to pay for all of the illegals here now. The main reason for the biggest jump in fees,,, the fees for those that are changing status. Changing status?? Hasn't all the work been done by then? The name checks, the financials. The so called reason for the $575 dollar increase,,the most expensive, is for the incidental benefits these people are receiving..The only benefit my wife is receiving is that she is being allowed to pay taxes legally. they are supposedly going to drop the increase by 2008,,,,,That would be right after the people that have waited some of the longest times, are just short of finishing the 10 year card. They are as usual, holding the people that have footed the highest bills for the longest hostage. Think about it,,,we already have so much invested, both heart and soul, and money, they know we will dole out the most to ensure they won't deport our lovely wives. Apparently the asshole making $100,000plus dollars a year to sit on his ass in DC couldn't come up with an original idea on his own to cope with the problem that has been boiling for some number of years now. So therefore he resourced to the age old philosophy of screwing the people that actually contribute to this society.

 

My apologies for making whatever Mod delete this post afore hand.