Joanne

ÏÖÔÚÎÒÏë»Øµ½Ôõô¶Ô¸¶(/¶Ô´ý)Ç°·òº¢×ӵĻ°ÌâÀ´. ÎÒÏëͨ¹ýÎÒ×Ô¼º¶ÔÅ®¶ùÓëËý×游ĸºÍÍâ×游ĸµÄ¹Û²ì,¿´»áÓÐʲôÆô·¢. ÕâÀïÓÐÒ»µãÀàËƵÄÇéÐÎ,¾ÍÊÇÄãÃǺͺ¢×ÓÃÇҲûÓг¤ÆÚסÔÚÒ»Æð. ÏÈ˵ٶùºÍÎÒ¸¸Ä¸µÄ¹Øϵ. ÎÒĸÇ×ÊǸöºÜÄܸɵÄÈË, Ëý¶ÔÉú»îÊÂÎÞ¾Þϸ¶¼Óкܶà"ÕýÈ·"µÄÏë·¨. ËùÒÔËýºÍÎÒÅ®¶ùÔÚÒ»Æðʱ,Ò»°ãÊǸɺܶàÓëÕÕ¹ËËýÏà¹ØµÄ¼ÒÎñ»î,»òÕß¾ÀÕýËýµÄÐÐΪ¾ÙÖ¹,»òÕßÕûÀí·¿¼ä(ÒòΪËý²»ÄÜÈÝÈÌ·¿¼äµÄÁãÂÒ)µ«Ã»ÓÐʱ¼äҲûÓÐÐËȤͬËýÍæ.½á¹ûÅ®¶ùÒ»µã¶¼²»Ï²»¶ÀÑÀÑ. ÎÒ°Ö°ÖÔÚ¼ÒÀïûÓÐʲôµØλ,Å®¶ù¿´µÃ³öÀ´.ÕâÑùÒ»À´Å®¶ù²»Ô¸Òâ¸úÀÑÀѺÍÍ⹫¶À´¦. ÎÒ°ÖÂèͦÉËÐÄ. ´ó¼ÒÔÚÒ»Æðʱ,Èý´úÈ˶¼Í¦½ôÕÅ,¶øÇÒÎÒ¾õµÃÅ®¶ùµÄ±íÏÖÒ²ºÜ²»ÁîÈËÂúÒâ. ÎÒ²»Ï²»¶ÕâÑùµÄ¾ÖÃæ. ´ÓÎÒµÄ˽ÐÄ¿´,ÎÒÏ£ÍûÅ®¶ùºÍÀÑÀÑÍ⹫Ç×½ü. Å®¶ùͬÄÌÄ̹Øϵ±È½ÏºÃ. ËýÄÌÄÌÒ²»á¸øËý±ØÒªµÄÉú»îÉϵÄÕÕ¹Ë,µ«Ò»ÇÐÒÔÎÒΪÖ÷. Èç¹ûÅ®¶ùÓÐʲôҪÇó,ÄÌÄÌÒªÈÃËýÕ÷ÇóÂèÂè(ÎÒ)µÄÒâ¼û. ÄÌÄÌÒ²ÒªÇóÒ¯Ò¯Õâô×ö. Å®¶ùÒ²ºÜÌýÄÌÄ̵Ä,ÒòΪËý¶ÔÅ®¶ùµÄ¹æ¶¨ºÍÒªÇó²¢²»¶à,µ«ÊǶ¼Ò»¶¨Òª×÷µ½,¶øÇÒËý˵һ²»¶þ. Å®¶ùÖªµÀ¸úÄÌÄÌûɶºÃÌÖÂÛµÄ. ÄÌÄÌÅãÅ®¶ù×î¶àµÄ»î¶¯¾ÍÊÇÒ»ÆðÔÚ³ø·¿¸ø´ó¼Ò×öµãÐÄ. Å®¶ù¾õµÃ×Ô¼ºÊÇ°ïæ,¶øÇÒ²ÎÓë´óÈ˵ĻºÜ×ÔºÀºÜµÃÒâ. ÄÌÄÌÕÕ¹ËËýµÄʱºò,Ë«·½¶¼ºÜÇáËÉ. Ò¯Ò¯ÊÇÅ®¶ùµÄÍæ°é,ÊÇËû×îºÃµÄ"ÅóÓÑ". ËûÃÇ¿ÉÒÔÒ»ÆðÔڵذåÉÏ´ò¹ö,Ò¯Ò¯»áÈÃÅ®¶ù×øÔÚËûÍÈÉÏΪÍÏÀ­»úÕƶæ, Ò¯Ò¯»áÓøɲݸøËý´î¸ö"³Ç±¤". Ò¯¶ù‚zÔÚÍâÃæ¹í»ìÒ»Õó,³£³£ÊÇÒ»ÉíÍÁºÍÄà. ½á¹ûÄØ,Å®¶ù¶ÔÒ¯Ò¯×îºÃ,×îµëÄîËû,Ò²×îÌýËûµÄµ±È»,ËûÍêÈ«²»ÐèÒªÑÏÀ÷, ÒòΪٶù¶ÔËûÊÇÑÔÌý¼Æ´Ó. ÎÒ²»ÊÇ´Ó¶«Î÷·½µÄ²îÒìÀ´¿´,ÕâÉÏÊöµÄ´¿´âÊÇÈ˵ĸöÌå²îÒì,±ÈÈç,ÎÒºÍÎÒÀϹ«Ö®¼ä,ÎÒ¸üÄÍÐÄ,Å®¶ùºÍÎÒ¸üÇ×½ü,µ«ÓÐʱҲ»áÀ´µãСµ·µ°.ÀϹ«¸üÑÏÀ÷,ËùÒÔÅ®¶ùºÜÅÂËû.

I thinks Rob should be the one who decipline while Jin support and be the playmate.

Nice,well-reasoned post as usual Jim. Yes. Young children are smarter than you think. They will adjust to your rules even if they are different from their mother's. The kids also know who likes them and they listen and even cling to the person who likes them. They usually want to please that person. However, you do need to establish a firm boundary (to things matter to you most), and make your rule clear.

For every dollar that the US put into the space program, we got an over 10 fold return on the investment. Plus, I defy anyone to find any aspect of modern life that is not affected by the tecnology and reserch involved with our exploration of space. Congratulations to China as she makes another step into the extraterrestrial community. Agree. Also, an uplift attitude helps both the rich and the poor.

Jin, ÄãºÃ! ллÄãµÄÐÅÈÎ. ÎÒÔø¾­×ö¹ýһС¶Îʱ¼äµÄMOD£¬µ±Ê±¾ÍÏ£Íû¶à¹ÄÀøһЩ½ãÃòμÓÌÖÂÛ£¬µ«Ê§°ÜÁË ¡£ËùÒÔÎÒ×Ô¼ºÒªÇóÍ˳ö¡£ÏÖÔÚÎÒÈÔȻûÓÐÐÅÐÄ×öºÃÕâ¼þÊ¡£ Èç¹ûÄã»òÆäËû½ãÃÃÔ¸Òâµ£µ±ÆðÀ´£¬ÎÒÒ»¶¨¾¡Á¦À´Ö§³ÖºÍÅõ³¡¡£ÎÒ¾õµÃÕâ¸öƽ̨»á¶ÔÎÒÃǺܶàÐÂÀ´µÄ½ãÃÃÃÇÓаïÖú¡£

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(ÏÂÃæÊÇÎÒÇ°Á½Ìì¸úÔÚÁíÒ»¸öÌù×ÓºóµÄ,ºÃÏóÄDZ߱»·ÅÆúÁË,ÏÖתÌù¹ýÀ´. ) Jin, ½ñÌìÎÒûÓÐÌ«¶àʱ¼ä,¼ÓÉÏÖÐÎÄ´ò×ÖÂý,ÎÒÖ»Äܼòµ¥Ì¸Ì¸ÎÒµÄÏë·¨. Ê×ÏÈÒª½¨Á¢¸ÐÇé,È»ºó²Å̸µÃÉÏ°ïÖúËûÃǵ÷ÕûÐÐΪϰ¹ß. ½¨Á¢¸ÐÇé,²»¿¿ÕÕ¹ËËûÃǵÄÈÕ³£Æð¾Ó,¶øÊÇÒª°²ÅŸ½ºÏËûÃÇÄêÁäºÍ°®ºÃµÄ»î¶¯,×îºÃÄÜ»ý¼«²Î?br />? Éú»îµÄ¾®¾®ÓÐÌõÊÇÄã×Ô¼ºµÄÐèÇó,²»ÊÇËûÃǵÄÐèÇó. ÈÃ×Ô¼º·ÅËÉÒ»µã,¾¡Á¿ÔÚÒ»ÆðÍæË£Öз¢ÏÖº¢×ÓÃǵĿɰ®Ö®´¦,´Ó¶ø·¢×ÔÄÚÐĵÄϲ»¶ËûÃÇ,ËûÃÇ?br />ͻᷴ¹ýÀ´°®Ä?×ðÖØÄã.µ½ÄÇʱ,ÄãÔÚÂúÂýÊ©¼ÓºÃµÄÓ°Ïì.²»¹ý,ÄÇʱºî,Ò²ÐíÄã×Ô¼º¿ÖÅÂÄþ¿ÏÒª¿ìÀֵĺ¢×ÓºÍÀϹ«,¶ø²»ÔÚºõ·¿¼äÂÒ¼¸ÌìÁË. ÒªÁ¢¹æ¾Ø,µ«²»ÄÜÌ«¶àÌ«ËæÒâ. ·½·¨:ÁгöÄãµÄÈ«²¿ÒªÇó,°´¶ÔÄãµÄÖØÒª³Ì¶ÈºÍ¿ÉÐÐÐÔÅÅÐò,¾«Á·³öÉÙÊý¼¸Ìõ,Ã÷È·ÒªÇó,Ñϸñ?br />½Ð? Ï£ÍûÎÒÕ⼸ÌõÅÔ¹ÛÕߵĽ¨Òé¶ÔÄãÓаïÖú. I am sorry, Jin. It takes me at lease 4 times longer to type in Chinese than using my imperfect English. This is one reason I prefered CFL over 001 or other Chinese women sites. I hope to have more sisters here. This post has been edited by Joanne: Sep 24 2008, 02:49 PM

Jin, ½ñÌìÎÒûÓÐÌ«¶àʱ¼ä,¼ÓÉÏÖÐÎÄ´ò×ÖÂý,ÎÒÖ»Äܼòµ¥Ì¸Ì¸ÎÒµÄÏë·¨. Ê×ÏÈÒª½¨Á¢¸ÐÇé,È»ºó²Å̸µÃÉÏ°ïÖúËûÃǵ÷ÕûÐÐΪϰ¹ß. ½¨Á¢¸ÐÇé,²»¿¿ÕÕ¹ËËûÃǵÄÈÕ³£Æð¾Ó,¶øÊÇÒª°²ÅŸ½ºÏËûÃÇÄêÁäºÍ°®ºÃµÄ»î¶¯,×îºÃÄÜ»ý¼«²ÎÓë. Éú»îµÄ¾®¾®ÓÐÌõÊÇÄã×Ô¼ºµÄÐèÇó,²»ÊÇËûÃǵÄÐèÇó. ÈÃ×Ô¼º·ÅËÉÒ»µã,¾¡Á¿ÔÚÒ»ÆðÍæË£Öз¢ÏÖº¢×ÓÃǵĿɰ®Ö®´¦,´Ó¶ø·¢×ÔÄÚÐĵÄϲ»¶ËûÃÇ,ËûÃǾͻᷴ¹ýÀ´°®Äã,×ðÖØÄã.µ½ÄÇʱ,ÄãÔÚÂúÂýÊ©¼ÓºÃµÄÓ°Ïì.²»¹ý,ÄÇʱºî,Ò²ÐíÄã×Ô¼º¿ÖÅÂÄþ¿ÏÒª¿ìÀֵĺ¢×ÓºÍÀϹ«,¶ø²»ÔÚºõ·¿¼äÂÒ¼¸ÌìÁË. ÒªÁ¢¹æ¾Ø,µ«²»ÄÜÌ«¶àÌ«ËæÒâ.·½·¨:ÁгöÄãµÄÈ«²¿ÒªÇó,°´¶ÔÄãµÄÖØÒª³Ì¶ÈºÍ¿ÉÐÐÐÔÅÅÐò,¾«Á·³öÉÙÊý¼¸Ìõ,Ã÷È·ÒªÇó,Ñϸñ¶½ÐÐ. Ï£ÍûÎÒÕ⼸ÌõÅÔ¹ÛÕߵĽ¨Òé¶ÔÄãÓаïÖú. I am sorry, Jin. It takes me at lease 4 times longer to type in Chinese than using my imperfect English. This is one reason I prefered CFL over 001 or other Chinese women sites. I hope to have more sisters here.

Home.

The criminals are doing the things you mentioned, Dennis. China has its share of criminals. IMHO, ParaOlympics will at very least raise awareness in the society that we should not forgotten the handicaped group. Different society has different value system. I think in the past, it is easier for Chinese to provide man-help than building accessable facilities so that the handicapped can move around independently. (Remember, China is a society which charish more group strengh than individual indenpendence.) For example, once in Beijing West Train Station, my sister-in-law's wheelchair faced a flight of stairs. A group of station workers came along, wanted to help lifting the chair (with her in it). My father-in-law didn't trust the group. To me the chance was extremely slim that 4 big men would drop the tiny lady in the wheel chair, but my father-in-law insisted carrying her single handed. Is it a typical American? I woule appreciate wheelchair accessable facilities. I think ParaOlympics would certainly help with that.

Amanda f¨¥i ch¨¢ng b¨´ cu¨° t¨² pi¨¤n de (is that correct grammer?) f¨¥i ch¨¢ng b¨´ cu¨° de t¨² pi¨¤n

Congratulations!!

Democracy in China? Democracy is relative. Relative to what? China simply is NOT a democratic nation. That is NOT a bad thing. Since China embraced Capitalism, it may feel a lot like democracy to some. If my country is as demoratic as america, could really EXPLODE. I agree. At least at this point of time.

I found this link. Enjoy it, my friends.

I guess due to dense population, it is more economical (and environmental friendly) to travel by train in China. I just made a round trip between Chengdu and Chongqing. It used to be around 10 hour train ride (each way). Then the freeway was build about ten years ago. The trip was cut down to 4 hours by bus. Now a section of new railway was build, the train ride is less than 4 hours. (I see potential of reducing this trip to within 2 hours). Many people now prefer train over bus due to cost and comfort. People still drive. But driving cost a lot more from gas and toll.

It's great to have your voice here Wendy as a woman who is from the country. If you don't already know you will discover that the great majority of our wives are urban women... And I'm pleased as punch that your family is doing well in their small town... But there were 50,000 protests in China last year, most of them in rural areas over the issues of concern...Let me give a couple of examples. Suppose that your families' land, and many others, are needed for a new GOLF COURSE... Your family gets not nearly enough compensation for their property that was their livelihood but the local party officials all have new Mercedes... Or imagine that your family grows rubber trees in southern Yunnan province and now all growers MUST sell to a government controlled entity at far lower prices than could be gotten on the open market...but the local party officials all build new villas... This is one reason I kept my mouth shut. I cann't represent all Chinese. But why can you (not you personally, power of English word ) make so much remarks about China? Joanne by your reasoning we must sit on our hands and not comment on anything... We have all been to China, we can read widely and deeply about it, we can use our minds to draw our own conclusions... At lease, I don't tell you that you don't know everything about China. As for the number of protest. I don't know who made the statistics, but it is a believable figure. Google result shows me: "In 1998, China began to streamline its primary levels of government. By the end of 2003, 25 provinces had accomplished their task of cutting the number of towns/townships. The total number of towns and townships was reduced from 46,400 to 39,000, 7,400 less than five years ago." 50,000 amounts to slightly over 1 protest per town per year. Is this a large number? Is it because the Chinese government suppressed people's voice so that they could not hold protests as much as they like? Such as in front of white house, at lease once per day.

I have been back to homeland for almost a month now. I have been asking myself one question: what makes one happy? It seems what you have now is not as important as what you or your child may have in future.

It's great to have your voice here Wendy as a woman who is from the country. If you don't already know you will discover that the great majority of our wives are urban women... And I'm pleased as punch that your family is doing well in their small town... But there were 50,000 protests in China last year, most of them in rural areas over the issues of concern...Let me give a couple of examples. Suppose that your families' land, and many others, are needed for a new GOLF COURSE... Your family gets not nearly enough compensation for their property that was their livelihood but the local party officials all have new Mercedes... Or imagine that your family grows rubber trees in southern Yunnan province and now all growers MUST sell to a government controlled entity at far lower prices than could be gotten on the open market...but the local party officials all build new villas... This is one reason I kept my mouth shut. I cann't represent all Chinese. But why can you (not you personally, power of English word ) make so much remarks about China?

I want to understand why everyone are so sure that the girls are underage. I didn't do any research myself, but is there any evidence, or just they look young? As the way Chinese girls raised, they usually look a couple years younger (than same age American girls) when they are in their teens. I am not saying that I know the girls' actual ages if they lied.

Did you have a hotel itinerary? I contacted a travel agent in NY recommended by my new firm. The travel agent's requirements were stricter than the Consulates! (E.g., information about income and assets , etc.) Went back today with an "invitation letter" from my wife's mother (at least in name ... nudge nudge, say no more) that was faxed from China. I was worried when the fax didn't show the number from which it was sent, but it seemed to satisfy the Consulate. We can pick up our visas on Wednesday. They didn't like my picture though, so I had to retake it at the Consulate. They claimed mine was not clear enough. Go figure. We did this in June. The travel agent went to consulate in Huston. No need for hotel reservation. Just fill in my sister's address where we stay part of the time. At that time, I have already heard about the change of regulation. However, the material we submitted to the agent was the same as a couple of years ago.

We used a visa service to deal with this. No invitation letter asked.

This thread demonstrates that how we CFLers enjoy debates. I usually hold a positive view about China, partly because I might have lived a pampered life (in my own view, not necessarily how my old pals see it), I didn't remember much sufferings, or I tend to forget sufferings easily. I remember how materially deficient we were in our childhood, such as only two or three sets of clothings for a season, rationed supply of food, etc. However, I don't think those gave me much bad memories. I understand my people better, so that certain peculiar, or even impolite behaviors in your eyes could be common and carries no bad feelings or intent. As for the government, it is just made up with a group of Chinese people, carries the baggages of the Chinese culture. - let me sidetrack a little, just to give you an example: I am very attentive to my daughter's needs (and my husband's need before, but he trained me not to get so "nervous"). I do things for her before she even tells. I cann't help it. I just knows what she wants and needs and I instantly do it for her. However, my husband disapproves this of my behavior. He thinks that I must let daughter to express explicitly and askes politely before I respond. This is the way he treated our daughter. Often times he would demand that she does it herself because she is capable of doing it. Who is right, who is wrong? I think I am wrong because we are now in America, and particularly at this time, in my parents-in-laws home which hubby grew up with. However, this is exactly what I don't like of my husband. I would rather that he observes my need and help than I ask for help. Often times, such things are so small, there is really no point of asking someone else to do it, but observing and doing it for your spouse gives good feeling for both. Day in and day out, I become very independent, however this independence may not be all good. I don't really want my daughter to become so "independent". - sorry for the side track. What I wanted to say is that the way we view the world is influenced by our experience, personality, our upbringing and the people around us. I feel most of the (CFL) Americans' view of China is also somewhat influenced by their Chinese spouse (although the spouse doesn't necessarily hold the same view). If the Chinese spouse had a hard life in China, if she/he doesn't know how to maintain good relationships with the friends, most of them Chinese, it is likely their American partner would hold a negative view of China (I still remembers the title of one CFL thread: why my wife is cheated by all those Chinese?) I am not saying China is all good. I just didn't like to discuss all the bad things, particularly if the discussion doesn't provide any value. For example, if your sister has an ugly birthmark on her face, would you feel comfortable that a friend come to you and point out that fact to you? Does your friend need to prove to you that he/she is not blind? However, if you give advice to friends, such as, when in China, don't drink tab water; guard your wallet at all times; wash your hand delegently before handling food and when get home, etc, there are some value there. Then, some things western media were saying about China and most Americans buy are just absurd to us who grew up in China. That's when most Chinese would jump out and shout "cann't be true". Above are just some random thoughts after reading Bill's great post and the thread.

Did it. Thanks for sharing the stories and photos. Didn't realize that you are back to CA already, I wonder where the first part of your stories is. I bet Leiqin was really excited to see all of her family and friends after so many years away from home. You and Leiqin are truly inspiration for us. Thanks for sharing all your stories. I think that both of you want to give more and take less while both of you feel that you have taken more than given.

I must be really out of touch with CFL lately. Got to come back read the thread before much more pages are added on. Have a nice time, Dennis! I look forward to my time in China which is coming up.

More here: http://travel.state.gov/law/info/overseas/overseas_703.html That's what we did after our daughter was born. We did it when she was about 8 month old.