Feathers268

You have to take into account that the vast majority of the population was Christian with thier religion taking a very large role in thier lives. That being said, the fundimental part was that they acknowledged that our rights don't come from the king but from a higher power. So, does that mean a person that acknowledges no God has no rights? Not at all. It only means that very religous people are going to praise thier "God" in writing and ceremony. They were carfull not to set up a government to convert everyone to Christianity but it doesn't get past the point that the majority were. In that time, an Atheist would have the same rights as anyone, but society would have acted upon them differently.

You have to take into account that the vast majority of the population was Christian with thier religion taking a very large role in thier lives. That being said, the fundimental part was that they acknowledged that our rights don't come from the king but from a higher power.

I think they were probably all slave owners. They were all well-off men. As I said, they were not the "cream of the crop" kind of guys! But nonetheless, they hung it all out there to try to get what no one had ever succeeding in getting before. The roots of the Declaration is a good place to start this. It gives a unique perspective into the mindset, the philosophies, the temperament of those that jump started this nation. Actually, many were not. They debated whether slavery should be part of their new country and agreed to put the topic off for future debate. Without slavery, the southern colonies would not have gone along.

It is no wonder why Americans tend to root for the underdog. In July of 1776 we separated from the British Empire, a global reaching super power of the day. King George didn't even take it seriously at first.

This was a thought I had a short time ago. Having business at the federal building here in Sac, I had the chance to show Jen both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States. As someone who will work toward naturalization, I know she will need to learn about it, plus, as a future voting citizen, a well informed citizen in the workings of our government, will make a better more informed vote. Now, before this can get started, it would be important to keep present day politics out of it. This would be a discussion of the mechanics of the government along with the rights of the citizens. So, for now what do you all think? Is this worth a try?

The important thing to remember, is that, American news has only one goal. MAKE MONEY. Stories are picked to apeal to the most people possible so therefore, the coverage stays shallow. Also, the 24 hour news cycle, thanks CNN, means stories are reported before proper research can be done. As for the President, having voted for the other guy, I could throw everything at his feet, but the truth is that Obama has as much control over jobs as Bush did. The general public does not get educated enough so they tend to believe that the President is more like a king, but it is just not true. Another thing to look at, the current administration has a forien policy that matches the previous one by about 96%. Seems that conditions dictate policy more than idealistic campain promises.

I think what you would have seen was police having to protect the rioters from the armed public, especially in the sowthwest and Texas. If these riots started from former Gitmo residence, they should never have been released.

q

Was this an actual quote form a government official? If that was an American official, they would be out on their butts for such a comment. I'd love for that official to have an "engineering accident". After all, they are just a "common" city official. it was a sarcastic comment from a chinese netcitizen.... in my experience chinese people are aware that the government and really rich do not put too much value on a person's life ... they did not just discover this ... they have known it for years ... and not just this current governement Quite so... And people seem to be waking up to the fact that they shouldn't have to put up with it any more... Well, some people anyway. From what I see and here I think they are very much like us in USA .. they see many things they disagree with and would like to change but you cannot "fight city hall" ... nor can you fight a political system that gives you no choice (China) or little choice ... I don't think this compares to the US. If an official was quoted here with the same type of statement, the media would be relentless causing pressure from the public to be removed from office. If they were an elected official, they would have a hell of a time getting re-elected.

Was this an actual quote form a government official? If that was an American official, they would be out on their butts for such a comment. I'd love for that official to have an "engineering accident". After all, they are just a "common" city official.

I have to agree with what Dave said. It is a matter of perception of values that are very different. As Americans, we can find differences in family values that in our eyes may question things going the either way. On big example, in a couple of weeks, Jen will be headed to China probably for 3 months. To most of my American friends, this is unheard of. The fact that my wife will leave for so long does not seem right to them. We try to teach our children to be independent and capable of caring for themselves as adults. At the same time we as parents do not expect that they will care for us in old age but rather plan and save to take care of ourselves. On the same token, I've seen Jen chang plans and ideas simply because her mother says so. I don't get the same from my parents because they know that if I don't agree, I'm not going to do it, and as an adult, there in nothing they could do about it. But then, they are proud of my ability to think and act for myself. Sure, this does not include every American, the only thing the same to everyone is the freedom to conduct family business as they see fit.

If you view the differences between China and the US while expecting a round peg to fit into a square hole, then perhaps you might develop a perception that the US way, is the ONLY way. I looked plenty hard at many cities in the US, saw many beggars, freeloaders, bag ladies, guys that look able to work, but stand at highway exits to collect a handout. I also have seen families who need help while hoping they could get a job, or find their way out of a financial dilemma. Rarely if ever did I see someone even acknowledge that some guy was staring in their car window hoping to get something. We all have our own reasons as to whether we offer money or other some sort of assistance, but to make an across the board statement the US people are more compassionate than Chinese people is just misinformed. Also, attempting to use the large number of people that were killed or injured in the earthquake last year as an illustration of how the people and government are not working to make the country safer, is also misinformed. The US is just over 200 years old, with most of its growth happening in the last 100 years. Compare that to a country whose people have inhabited and lived for over 7000 years, and you may just get a glimmer of how an ancient culture is changing. But then again, I'm not holding my breath. There is not one thing I said that makes America seem better than China. The political parties may use the homeless to beat each other over the head about who is more compasionate, but usuall, the people are as generous as possible. As for my perceptions of China, I can only base that on the few people I know. None are from the areas affected so they don't have feelings for the people there. Having experienced major earthquakes here in CA, I had a different reaction. If there was any thing I would say about the earthquake, it shows the break neck speed that the Chinese are building and in some cases forgoing building standards in a earthquake zone. Sorry about that Feathers. I did come off a little strong there.... I started by looking at the title of the thread: "Replying to lack of compassion for the crippled" and it sorta took over my thinking. How does one go about measuring the level of people's compassion? Is it by the money they donate? Whether they give to people on the street? Give of their own personal time to be of some sort of assistance? I'm sure these can be factored in, but I think taking in the bigger picture must be first. When I suggested the scenario of fitting a round peg into a square hole, what I intended to communicate is vast differences in culture between the US and China. China is often lauded in the US media and compared on a one-to-one ratio with US social programs. In my view, American people have come to expect that when someone is in need, that the government should be there to help them out. There are programs out there, like welfare, food stamps, social security medicare, and so on. You hear the term "fixed income" tossed around a lot when it comes to people that are older or disabled whose entire existence is based upon these government programs. China does have programs to help the poor and the hungry, but most of China's people have existed in poor villages for thousands of years. Many have somehow figured out how to get by on their own. Whether they are farmers, fishermen, street vendors, trash collectors, they seem to get by on so very little. Many of the things they do would never be allowed in the US, as there are strict laws about selling on the street and collecting garbage. When you walk the streets of big-city China...you will likely see quite a few poor begging, and crippled people. Some of them somehow manage to find their way to high-traffic areas, lay out a blanket with a few trinkets, and set out a bowl for handouts. Some people drop money in, and many do not. It would be very difficult to say whether it happens less in China when compared to the US. Perhaps it's just when you see the hungry and poor face to face, it has more of an impact? No worries Jesse. Last night, I was letting some of the dietrib in TC bother me a little and put me in the mood to poke around a little at some of the other threads, hence the US bashing comment in the other thread. When it comes down to it, we all here have one of the most importaint things in common. We chose to find love in China. Know this, I would never resort to personal atrtacks if my point is not seen by all, and nothing you said was taken in any other way than another side of a debate. I've seen and heard some of the cruelest things come from Americans before. As you said, Both countries have all kinds of people. We here on CFL are a cut above most, we steped out of our own world to look into another. In my case, by far the best thing I ever done.

I don't really view this thread as bashing the US, but it does show how other nations are currently perceiving it's affect on the world economy. As throughout history, the US has not always been viewed in a favorable light by other countries. Like it or not, and whether or not this issue gets any traction on the world stage, there are a rising number of countries that want to change the world economy, which may or may not be beneficial to the US. It does seem that the world economy is changing, and many countries are adapting to that change. Personally, I don't view the changing economy or China seeking to establish a world currency than is non-USD as a threat. Just how America responds to the change, will determine its fate. Not every idea that comes from outside the US is a bad idea. Another one for the diary. I agree with Jesse. Just thought I would poke the hornets nest with a stick and see what happens. Yes, it doesn't happen often Dave, but we do sometimes agree.... I did do a double-take on your post, thought Feathers. I get accused all the time of being a little-over supportive or polyanna when it comes to my views on China. I really do love America and I also love China. When it comes to the economy, I see China holding one of the strongest positions in the world. Americans don't have a very good history of saving money; that includes me. I would have to say that people are deeply affected by their environment. If they are surrounded by people who find it important to have every new electronic device that comes along, the biggest, greenest house on the block, best car and so on, then it just seems more likely that you might catch the keeping up with the Jones's syndrome. I'm finding it easier to save money in China. It might be because its quite a bit cheaper to live over here. But then, as with most Chinese women, my wife is very frugal, which is starting to rub off on me. How'd this get in here? B) My little comment spured Jesse and Dave to agree? I didn't think some jaunty little words could do that. Whats next? Me agreeing too?

I got an interesting take from Jen tonight. She mentioned the fear that if you help someone who was hurt, when the police arrive, or when you get them to the Hospital, they will turn around and blame you for their injuries to get money out of you. Being American will only compound this issue.

Thhanks guys, I'll poor over these links to see if we can find a good course of study for Jen.

If you view the differences between China and the US while expecting a round peg to fit into a square hole, then perhaps you might develop a perception that the US way, is the ONLY way. I looked plenty hard at many cities in the US, saw many beggars, freeloaders, bag ladies, guys that look able to work, but stand at highway exits to collect a handout. I also have seen families who need help while hoping they could get a job, or find their way out of a financial dilemma. Rarely if ever did I see someone even acknowledge that some guy was staring in their car window hoping to get something. We all have our own reasons as to whether we offer money or other some sort of assistance, but to make an across the board statement the US people are more compassionate than Chinese people is just misinformed. Also, attempting to use the large number of people that were killed or injured in the earthquake last year as an illustration of how the people and government are not working to make the country safer, is also misinformed. The US is just over 200 years old, with most of its growth happening in the last 100 years. Compare that to a country whose people have inhabited and lived for over 7000 years, and you may just get a glimmer of how an ancient culture is changing. But then again, I'm not holding my breath. There is not one thing I said that makes America seem better than China. The political parties may use the homeless to beat each other over the head about who is more compasionate, but usuall, the people are as generous as possible. As for my perceptions of China, I can only base that on the few people I know. None are from the areas affected so they don't have feelings for the people there. Having experienced major earthquakes here in CA, I had a different reaction. If there was any thing I would say about the earthquake, it shows the break neck speed that the Chinese are building and in some cases forgoing building standards in a earthquake zone.

In a short while, Jen will be looking to petition for natualization. I've had a devil of a time finding decent classes here in Sac. Any thoughts on materials for preparing?

Ah, all you people want to do is bash the US.

I got the same response about the earthquake. I was told that the number dead was OK because China has so many people. When I saiod that was still not good, I was told, This OK, this is China, no America.

I don't think you looked hard enough. For everyone ont the median I see, every red light has at least 1 car that gives some money. It was so lucrative in Modesto, there were well known scamers that would sit there for 10 hours and then go to their car parked around the corner. Ive fixed washing machines in homeless shelters in SF, San Jose, and Oakland where there are more beds than residents. Usually people were only turned away for drugs, stealing, fighting, etc. Even the tent city here in Sacramento that Oprah made famous is the result of people who don't want to go to the shelter. By the way, it is over 10 years old as most there resist moving to where they can get help.

We saw that park under construction in 2006 on our way to tour the Great Wall. The tour guide proudly called it the "Chinese Disney" and gave me a hard look when I laughed. She also gave me a hard look when I refuted her clame that the Great Wall could de seen from the moon.

not that funny if you have to hold 45 minutes before your turn to pee. I doubt the new Disney in Shanghai will be sucessful. The main problem is cultural difference. most in china have no emotional attachment to the Mouse as in the US. I think Disney can do quite well with a little homework and a determination to keep true to the original Disney image. The younger generation does have an affinity for the mouse and the Kingdom but in Jen's case along with her friends, it is for the Kingdom here in the states. When I talked to her about it, she felt that Disney HK was no good because it was Chinese and therefore not real enough. But coming to California, Disney was goal #1 on things to do, to which she proudly bragged to her friends and family about going.

That really is sooo funny!! You rascal, you corrupted her, didn't you!! Funny, Leiqin and I went to PF Chang's for dinner today. Nothing on the menu was written in Chinese, so I had to order for us. She started complaining that the food wasn't good and why didn't we go to the Sizzler instead!! When Jen's aunt arrived, we went to a Chinese buffet only to find that it wasn't a buffet nor was it even open. So it was off to Sizzler, for us, the 2nd night in a row.

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/...e.ap/index.html So how has USA solved its energy an emissions problems ? is not the USA the biggest energy taker and biggest polluter , yes That is a myth and is simply not true . Yes, the US consumes the largest amount of oil, but our production of pollution has been reduced through increasingly tougher emission standards. Granted this is only anicdotal evidence, but her in Sacramento, the only time the air resembled what I saw in bejing and Shanghai was when the northern part of the state had a couple hundred wild fires or when the farmers are burning off the old rice fields. Here is a list of the top ten poluted cities in the US,US cities. And here is a list of the top 10 poluted cities globally, global cities. It is believed that up to 1/4 of the particulate matter over California comes from burning coal in China that is blown over here across the Pacific. I'm all for cleaning up the atmosphere, but not at the expense of our economy alone. The EU, China, India, Africa, Central America, and South America have to step up also.

I want to say Thanks a lot CFL. I would not have made it without your help and love. My dream is to have a happy family and everybody in my family care about each other and love each other. My dream is also to have my own business and make it successfully to be financial secure and schedule flexible. That is the way that I can have more time to spend with my daughter and also I can provide my family a better life. Thanks a lot my dear friend. I will keep trying to turn something impossible into possible and create a good future and a happy life. Jany, you got it! You understand the American dream better than a lot of Amercans do. I can see that you WILL be successful, your family WILL prosper, and we will be here standing and cheering you on the rest of the way. Just keep going. And remember, CFL might have given you a hand to help you up, but YOU are responsible for your success. I'm sure I'm speaking for all of us in saying we are very proud of you and all you have done. KEEP IT UP!