China confiscates Bibles from American Christians

[NewDay2006]

Sounds to me that the Chinese gvt was more concerned about the Bibles being sellable items and not so much the content. People need to learn and respect other country's laws!

I bought a bilingual Bible while I was in China. No problems.

I agree. I have always taken Bibles (1) to China, never a problem, not that they checked.

[tsap seui]

Opinion (everyone's entitled to one)

 

Many of you know that I am an active and committed Christian however, when I look at this from my perception of the Chinese government's viewpoint I think the government has a fairly even handed approach.

 

There seems to be not much of an issue in China with churches and mosques that operate in the open and are registered with the government. I should add that I see no evidence that these entities are "party-controlled" as the, in my view, biased AP article states. The issue with the government comes when religion is practiced underground because, I believe, the government suspects that these underground religious organizations may have a political agenda counter to the present government.

 

In my view, Vision Beyond Borders, was both naive and wrong to try to bring 300 Bibles into China without permission.

 

Good post!!!!!!!!

 

tsap seui

[shushuweiwei]

It's the "Praise the Lord or We'll Pass The Ammunition Syndrome"

 

History repeatedly shows...the white man sends in the missionarys to give the heathen natives religion. If the heathen natives don't follow the missionary's orders, then the white guy in charge sends in the soldiers to enforce the fact that them heathen natives WILL pray to whoever the white man says they have to!!!

 

If them pesky heathens still don't accept the white man's choice of their religion, then the soldiers start shooting the heathen's leaders and everyone else that don't comply with the missionarys and their soldiers "peaceful" religion.

 

If I had a country, and I saw 4 smilin' yahoos with 300 bibles heading my way....I'd run for the hills....or better yet... just shoot THEM...FIRST!!

 

Missionarys first...the soldiers will be soon to follow.

 

Budda help us all.

 

tsap seui

I'm a pascifist but I vote shoot!

[lostness]

I don't understand how someone can blatantly violate Chinese law and then feel offended because they were caught. Just as everyone that posted before me pretty much said the issue wasn't the Bible it was the number of Bibles.

I stayed at a hotel in Shanghai that had a Chinese/English Bible in the room. And I know, I know, Shanghai is a bit different than the rest of China, but I hope that you can still get my point: There were no pages missing from the made in China Bible.

[SheLikesME?]

I've even heard of people believing the law shouldn't apply to them because of a higher calling, but then that ignores the concept of biblical teachings.

You know your right.

 

My church has done nothing but take the high road with the PRC. They will not be govt controlled, so they have been very slow and cautious.

 

1st they were allowed to hold services for all foreigners only. It required the policing of the congregation and I heard of stories from people I know who saw PRC citizens escorted in tears out of the service. Our church policed themselves to keep PRC citizens out, or they would lose their permission to hold services for foreigners living there.

 

2nd, years later, they applied for a permanent building, which they were granted. It is a floor in an office building but looks every bit like a building here on the inside. DURING the negotiation for the permanent chapel they brought up the parallel congregation in Beijing of PRC citizens who want to be members but were practicing the religion underground on their own without official church sanctioning. The govt approved of those people becoming official members, as long as they meet in a separate congregation at a separate time with ONLY PRC citizens allowed to attend. I cannot go there, though my wife can. Both congregations use the new chapel. We are still not allowed to bring in missionaries or hand out bibles and books, but someone new can join that is a PRC-C if they are related to a member. Thus my wife could have joined over there if she wanted and being a wife she was allowed to go to either congregation. This all sounds complicated but because we kept our nose clean with the govt. we have been given privileges others have not, so far anyway. One of our beliefs is to obey the laws of the land of the country you are in. You don't go getting a holier than though attitude the Lee refers to.

 

3rd. For the Olympics the church published in every country the does and don'ts when going to Beijing. One of them was to not pass out literature of any kind or proselyte in any manner. They said they can attend the foreign congregation on Sunday, but warned the members to obey the law. I hope all have!

 

Respecting the govt. is the only way to gain legitimate freedom in the future. IMO. It worked so far.

Edited August 17, 2008 by SheLikesME? (see edit history)

[GZBILL]

There was always a stipulation in every contract I signed with all the universities I taught at that:

"You can not teach or refer to religion in any form"

 

The CCP does not accept proselytizing period. 300 bibles sort of hints at this don't it?

 

Yes, proselytizing is the key issue. 300 Bibles between 2 people would be impossible, by any reasonable person, to be taken as anything other than proselytizing. China does allow freedom of religion, but they do not allow you to force or try to sell your religion to others.

 

It smacks of sheer hipocracy a supposedly religious group trying to break the law. :roll:

 

Heck, I wish they'd ban proselytizing in the USA, too!

[chilton747]

Proselytizing:

 

1 : to induce someone to convert to one's faith 2 : to recruit someone to join one's party, institution, or cause transitive verb : to recruit or convert especially to a new faith, institution, or cause

 

Lest we forget freedom of choice. Nobody is trying to force anyone. It's there if they want to read it. If not, then so be it.

[hakkamike]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080817/ap_on_...les_confiscated

 

Klein said the customs officers had told him that they could each have one Bible for personal use and not more than that. He said the officers had videotaped them and were insisting that they leave the airport.

 

"We don't want to go without taking those books. It cost us a lot of money to bring them here," Klein said. "They're saying that it's illegal to bring the Bibles in and that if we wanted to, we had to apply ahead of time for permission."

 

Don't know about anyone else, but I read about this law when I applied for my first visa.

 

Guess the laws of China don't apply if your right.

I would not call them very good Christians bringing that many Bibles in to China knowing that they wernt suppost to, hell throw them in jail for a few days and let them think about it

[griz326]

I think JimJ has it right.

[Corbin]

It's the "Praise the Lord or We'll Pass The Ammunition Syndrome"

 

History repeatedly shows...the white man sends in the missionarys to give the heathen natives religion. If the heathen natives don't follow the missionary's orders, then the white guy in charge sends in the soldiers to enforce the fact that them heathen natives WILL pray to whoever the white man says they have to!!!

 

If them pesky heathens still don't accept the white man's choice of their religion, then the soldiers start shooting the heathen's leaders and everyone else that don't comply with the missionarys and their soldiers "peaceful" religion.

 

If I had a country, and I saw 4 smilin' yahoos with 300 bibles heading my way....I'd run for the hills....or better yet... just shoot THEM...FIRST!!

 

Missionarys first...the soldiers will be soon to follow.

 

Budda help us all.

 

tsap seui

I'm a pascifist but I vote shoot!

I think maybe they should have had a good old weeny roast with them thar bibles. Start by roasting the weenies that tried to bring them in to China......

 

Not saying that there is nothing wrong with having a bible. I believe that all who want one should get one (I would even encourage you to read it). I also believe that you should follow the laws of the country you are going to also......

Edited August 18, 2008 by Corbin (see edit history)

[IllinoisDave]

It smacks of sheer hipocracy a supposedly religious group trying to break the law. :roll:

 

Heck, I wish they'd ban proselytizing in the USA, too!

[rogerluli]

It smacks of sheer hipocracy a supposedly religious group trying to break the law. :roll:

 

Heck, I wish they'd ban proselytizing in the USA, too!

 

Y'all who need to do the tithing thingie can just send it to me and I'll see that it's used for god's work...

[IllinoisDave]

It smacks of sheer hipocracy a supposedly religious group trying to break the law. :roll:

 

Heck, I wish they'd ban proselytizing in the USA, too!

 

Y'all who need to do the tithing thingie can just send it to me and I'll see that it's used for god's work...

Better yet. Do the economy and the country a favor and spend that tithing on something tangible. Imagine if all those who give 10% or whatever of their salary to a church would pump some of it into the economy or even save it. Instant tax rebates.

[Yuanyang]

So my chances of bringing in for my church is ... ?

 

 

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Snakehandling.png

[Yuanyang]

So my chances of bringing in for my church is ... ?

 

 

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Snakehandling.png

Pretty good if you're a cook!

That's the ticket!