Here is a thought

[christy]

Hi, all,

 

I just had a thought after thinking about how to get Media attention for several days. Like RockSplit, the attempt to contact the media seemed to be infertile. So, here is a thought: What is the possibility for us to have a class action lawsuit against the government for the emotional turmoil we have to go through for the visas? Would it be feasible? I think a lawsuit might be able to get some attention from the government and media. Of course, there are a lot of hurdles to go through, I am just brian storming ideas. Please give some suggestions. Thank you very much!

 

Christy

[AZwolfman]

Remember Kevin? He appeared as a spokesperson for our plight on an Aaron Brown CNN report. A few days later his sweetheart had her visa.

 

How about Mick and Owen's visit to GZ consulate to talk to Richard Adams? Shortly afterward, visas were issued and 2 more pics were removed from the GZ dartboard.

 

The Angry Texan went to GZ determined not to leave without some answers. His fiancee mysteriously received EMS and visa soon after his arrival.

 

What about Markimwating, who was perhaps the most proactive CFL member ever? The visadelays.com was originally his brainchild. Soon after its inception - precluded by much letter writing, faxing, phoning, emailing to the gov't officials - Mark's fiancee received her visa and you never heard from him again.

 

JonInDenver even went to his congressman and was able to get them to rattle some cages. Visa received. One more pic removed from the GZ dartboard.

 

Eric? Visa received and still here because he wants to help, but how did he get to be such an authority on the BCIS? That's easy - Every single day his agenda was to get his fiancee home, and he querried so many officers for information, and did so much research on how to get his fiancee home, that he eventually came to be more informed than the officers themselves. Eventually visa received and one more pic removed from the GZ dartboard.

 

I have mentioned only a few of the more proactive past members, but hopefully I have illustrated my feeling that you have to make getting that visa your number one priority. You need to contact someone - or institute part of a definite plan toward achieving this goal - each day.

 

Most of the things you do, the people you contact, the faxes and emails you send will have absolutely no singular result. But all your actions together WILL. Make them know that you will not disappear until you have visa in hand. Make them want to give you the visa so you will go away. I suspect that after a while, every time someone got a letter from Eric, they would say, "Oh no, not Eric again. Won't someone please give him his D!@# visa so he will go away and leave us alone!"' He made his problem THEIR problem.

 

Media attention is only one avenue you should explore. If you can get it, fine; if you can't get it, don't stop the pressure in other ways. Lawsuit? I am against that. I think the time, effort, and money would be better spent making yourself and your plight known to each official.

[Mick]

You are one-hundred percent correct AZ. You mentioned the trip Owen and I made to GZ to visit with Richard Adams. I should hasten to point out that our appointment with Mr. Adams was largely a result of a barrage of e-mails, faxes, and phone calls made in our behalf. During the process of obtaining an appointment he alluded to this but we openly stated we would not call off the dogs until we got an appointment. Further, we went to that appointment armed with a petition and letters from numerous Candle/001 members. There can be success in persistence and group fortitude. As Owen often says, you have to make your problem their problem. It should be noted that by the time Owen returned from the trip, his wife's EMS was waiting for him. We received ours two weeks after the trip and it was mailed out nine days after the meeting. Many who had their names on the petition received EMS within a month. IN fact, around ten of us were there to pick up our visas together on March 10. You mention the Texan. Perhaps no one was jerked around by the system more than he was. But his tenacity and dogged persistence finally prevailed. He and his lovely lady were there as well, picking up their visa on the 10th.

 

Lawsuits have been suggested before but to my knowledge, no one has done this. Personally, I think it would be very difficult to win such a suit. Further, you might need a lot of cash to get an attorney to take on the case. Just my two cents.

[juz]

AZ's oberservation is so right. But Christy, lawsuit idea has been discussed couple times (I have been around here too long:-(), and I don't think we can pull it off.

 

A while ago, I said for the very few left in the black hole at the end, the thing would get very bad, maybe the worst possible. Now I am here, and with maybe another 5 or 6 people.

 

The real problem for us now is that we don't have enough people make noise anymore. When Kevin went to CNN, there are about 6000 - 10000 people waiting for their visas alone in GUZ. When Mick and Owen went to see Richard, over 100 e-mails a day sent to GUZ asking for the appointment. And now, we have 5 maybe 6.

 

So how do we suppose get their attention? Maybe more dramatic actions like hunger strick. Maybe we come together hold a demonstration. Maybe...

 

We "on-holders" need help. Roberts still keep in touch with me and offer me his help several times long after he got his sweetheart's visa. I am moved by his generous heart. I plea to every remain member on this great board, PLEASE HELP US. Give us some tips, some contact infos, or even some tricks. Lend us a hand, help us make some more noise... or whatever you have some spare time to do.

 

I know it is way too much to ask, and I am sorry to do this. I am just so confused and desperate.

[christy]

Hi, All,

 

Thank you all for replying. When I posted that thought, I knew it was a long fetched idea. But I did want to get some feedback from all the friendly people on the forum.

 

I really do not know what to do anymore. I have tried almost everything. I have sent emails to congressman, senator, media, of course, MH, Collin Powell, Home land security. No help, whatsoever. None of them showed any compassion, none of them was sympathetic. I kept on asking myself "why are these people so stone hearted?"

 

However, I am still keeping up my faith and hope. I pray for each and everyone of us to see the twilight soon.

 

Christy

[robhon]

First, I would have to suggest that all the cases cited so far in this thread would be classified as "anecdotal." Not that they're wrong but they certainly don't prove anything about what works. It's always the last thing you did which is interpretted as the one thing that worked. It's like losing your car keys. They're ALWAYS found in the last place you look.

 

To get any realistic information on what did or didn't work before you'd have to do a much more detailed study of a bunch of people's cases. You'd have to document what actions were taken and when, and correlate that to their timelines. And that's only going to tell you what happened not what will happen going forward.

 

Second, whatever might have worked for those before us is not available to many of us now. They changed the system. I could call GZ 1000 times a day and it wouldn't do any good because they don't even know who I am. They don't get anything until security checks are done here. And for all my attempts so far the NVC and DOS seem to be a big black impenetrable box. (Maybe someone else has been able to get something done there; I haven't.) So, I think for the newer people here it's a whole different ballgame.

 

Third, I'd have to say that fundamentally what we are all doing here is fighting a lot of individual battles. There is a basic selfish nature to what we each face. "I want my spouse/fiance(e) here NOW so I can start living my life." This site operates as a wonderful support mechanism for all of us. But, no one is here to fight for the rights of legitimate immigrants to be processed efficiently and rejoined with their families, except where it has to do with their own family. It's certainly not everyone but I'd say most people that come through here disappear after their cases are processed... because they accomplished what they were fighting for.

 

That said, I think there are people here who would like to fight for those rights for others. The intent of the K visa program (as I read it) was exactly to provide those rights and I think there's a fight to be fought. It would be difficult, though. It would probably take several years, well past the time it took to get your own family here. You'd have to maintain the same drive and enthusiasm even though your family was together. That's a tough one.

[warpedbored]

Hi all. I agree that media attention is our best weapon. I recently came across a contact with a reporter in the Minniappolis area with ties to fox and upn. She wants to do a story on delays at NSC and fiance visa difficulties. She looking for people in that area to interview. I wrote her an e-mail and just received this reply.

 

Dear Carl:

Thanks for your e-mail.

I wish you the best in what sounds like a very frustrating situation.

Feel free to post my e-mail address...I would like to get in touch with

someone in my viewing area to interview in order to do this story for

television.

Feel free to continue to e-mail with your information, but you're right, I

do need someone closer to home for this story.

Thanks so much,

Roshini

rosh009 At hotmail . com

 

Carl, I changed her address from a valid email - folks can figure it. We don't want to be the source of her getting spammed to death.

[Mick]

Some of us old timers are still around here and still willing to fight for each and every case if need be. Times change, tactics change, but one thing remains constant I think. We all need to stand united. Granted, everyone wants to get his or her case solved but I have witnessed, and continue to witness, many unselfish acts on the part of board members. My offer still stands to help in anyway that I can. If you need a letter written to someone, let me know.

 

It should also be remembered that a number of those who have received their visas are now themselves in the midst of yet another battle: AOS/EAD. This process is no easier than getting the visa in the first place, is pock-marked with the same bureaucratic inefficiency, and is a royal pain in the a** in its own right. We, too, are in need of help from time to time. Whatever the case, I am here if you need me.

[avastar]

Sorry I've said this before, but I don't think Christy's idea is so far fetched. I don't think the suit should have anything about emotional turmoil, except if it ever got so far as damages. The real issue, still, is that Dos is breaking / subjugating the law. The Immigration and Nationality Act, which is a combination of the LIFE Act and the Patriot Act, says that K3's and K1's are too be processed as nonimmigrants, there was no suggestion there, its very plainly stated. And very simply that is not happening. There has been no law or amendment to change that fact, just an arbitrary determination at some level of DOS that said change them to immigrants. Even if it was Powell or Bush themselves, they are not above the law. That is the real issue for a law suit.

 

The question is, what is our goal? I've received some recommendations from a lawyer who's interested in our issue, but has nothing to do with immigration. He made many good points such as frivolous lawsuits, being blamed for potentially aiding terrorists by both the government and the media, length of lawsuit AND appeals, maybe utilizing house subcommittees to make inquiries, and the fact that these people are not gods...they work for us.

 

From my perspective I see 2 options as far as lawsuits go. One to get attention and one to go the long haul, dealing with the real issues and trying to effect the real change that needs to take place. We keep hoping they'll staighten themselves out, but it just doesn't seem to happen. Unfortunately, I personally don't have the resources to pursue the long haul,

 

However, I think I can deal with the consequences of trying to get attention. We can all file the same lawsuit at the same time on a specific day. We do not need a lawyer to do that, so it could be 25 federal lawsuits in 25 states with the same appeal. The lawyer said that the judges would probably frown on "frivolous" lawsuits that are filed and then abandoned and that there would be a good chance we would have to pay court costs and the government's cost. And he highly recommended that we don't do that, but in this manner we should get the media attention that we seek.

 

The court case is just another option I think we should consider. I would also be more than willing to join in a demonstration in front of the State Department. I live in the midwest, but would be happy to make the drive, if we could coordinate an effort.

[rocksplit]

Without pressure there will be no change.

 

A lawsuit might eventually provide the fuel to change. What is the most efficient use of energy of those willing to affect change?

 

Personally I favor a constant presence in DC symbolizing the long senseless waiting without fair recourse. If there are as many lives affected as we claim, we ought to be able to give expression to the reality of the situation. Addressing the public at large through media coverage might help politicians and involved bureaucrats in their search for solutions to a fair, open and accountable processing of visa petition.

 

A constant revolving presence of individuals representing us is one idea; the other could be a weekend with a sea of past and present petitioners on the mall. Are there enough of us to express ourselves visibly and for good cause?

 

I am willing to be there. In the unlikely event our family should be united before we come up with any action there is one more beautiful voice. Can we organize a database of the willing? How many are there?

 

Daniel

[rocksplit]

Avastar I like the clarity in your thinking, even if I don't favor a legal fight.

 

What about drafting an open letter to be published in a national paper orchestrated with a personal e-mail barage to all involved?

 

With the cost spread out it should be bearable.

 

Is there sufficient interest? Can we reach a consensus?

 

Daniel

[juz]

I am in for rocksplit's idea.

 

I am in.

[robhon]

I honestly believe there is a case for a class action suit, although I'm not a lawyer so I couldn't say for sure. The trick is to find the right law firm who's up to the task. "Billy-Bob's bail bonds and legal advice" ain't gonna cut it. And I'd imagine 9 out of 10 firms wouldn't want to touch this case with a 10 foot pole. But you know there are firms and lawyers out there who are looking for something juicy that would play well in the media to boost their own careers.

 

I'll say it again... This stuff is made for TV! Young people in love who desperately want to start their families and the big bad government is standing in the way... I tell ya, George Bush's stories of WMD and national security won't hold a candle to a picture of my pregnant wife longing for her Louh Gung. Americans are an emotional lot, they are.

[AZwolfman]

What about drafting an open letter to be published in a national paper  orchestrated with a personal e-mail barage to all involved?

Now here is something that might be do-able - as one of a package of several attention-getting avenues. B)

[warpedbored]

Can anyone here help me find someone for the reporter in Minniapollis to interview? I can't seem to find anyone and this is too good of an opportunity for those of us stuck in NSC hell to pass up. I received another email from her today. Here it is

Carl

 

Dear Carl:

Just to give you an update since you posted my e-mail address.

I heard from one man right away.

He's in Hawaii though.

He's also trying to help me find someone in the Minneapolis area.

Just so you know, we can drive a bit of a distance for these interviews.

So some parts of Wisconsin are not far from us.

Thanks for your help.

I so want to do this story for tv.

Best,

Roshini