How can we make the process less painful?

[Stone]

From reading the posts made by USCONGUZ, I understand that VOs come and go, as they cycle through their assignments, and different VOs have varying experiences and trainings in handling immigration visa petitions. After reading the blue slip events which happened to the following CFL members:

 

notrevorich

 

EdG

 

bobmal99

 

in thinking about the traumatic and devastating impact on the beneficiaries and the petitioners, I am asking the following two questions:

 

(1) After the beneficiary is handed a blue slip, can she/he ask to speak to a VO supervisor to have a “second opinion” right afterwards, because different VOs can come to different conclusions? These are evidenced by bobmal99 and notrevorich cases (see their respective threads).

 

(2) After the blue slips are given out, the only way that the American petition can communicate directly with the Consulate is through E-Mails on the Consulate’s website or making a personal trip to Guangzhou. As many petitioners have their own busy jobs and may not have the luxury to travel to Guangzhou on a short notice, can the American petition have a “telephone interview” with the VO, so that petitioner can explain the case and story to the VO? If the “telephone interview” does not work, then the petitioner can use the last resort to fly to Guangzhou to advocate his/her case. (You can't reach a decision maker through the current Visa Hotline in Shanghai, China).

 

I saw many blue slips were eventually resolved for CFL members. I am just thinking how we can make the process smooth and less painful. Your future and your wives future are all in the hands of VOs, and are decided in a few minutes.

 

Paul

Edited December 16, 2005 by Stone (see edit history)

[yuehan123]

Short answer: No & No

 

I recall that one consenus on this site was that often times the VO has made a denial decision prior to the interview. True or not, it may not matter who else you might 'appeal' to because the denial paperwork demand for evidence is specific in it's requirements. Further verbal communication is probably not useful. It is better to focus on meeting the initial requirements for evidence, thus avoiding a denial.

 

Another general discussion was, rhetorically, 'why not go to GUZ for the interview?' You know well advance when it is likely to be. You know the interview date when you receive the P-4 and, finally, your support and the ability to produce evidence including a short video may be invaluable.

 

Attempting to try and appeal a denial with a phone call is probably not practical. What could you possibly say when physical evidence did not convince the VO?

[Stone]

* In bobmal99 case, the first VO did not look at the evidences submitted by the children. The second VO who reviewed the case did look at the evidences. The denial was overturned the same day.

 

* In notrevorich case, the notrevorich stated that he essentially submitted the same evidence. But a different VO looked at them in a different way, then the visa was later granted.

 

* The petitioner in the United States can speak to the VO in Guangzhou in Chinese language through “telephone interview”, so that the VO can know the communication would not be a problem. Most often, the Chinese spouse is totally uninformed of the complicated immigration process (i.e. terminologies, etc.).

 

* Many times the petitioner would book a flight after the visa is granted (this is what it should be, right?). If the petitioner flies to Guangzhou to support the spouse, then the spouse may not be able to come back with the petitioner in the same flight back to the States. Petitioners' vacation is limited, but the Chinese spouse has to make travel arrangements prior to departure (saying goodbye to friends and relatives, packing up, etc.). The petitioner cannot stay in Guangzhou for an extended period of time, because he/she has a job in the U.S. (not retired yet). If the visa is granted, petitioner can then go to China to get the spouse and arrange the travel much more easily.

Edited December 16, 2005 by Stone (see edit history)

[m-coon]

A phone call is certainly not practical as there is no proof of who is making the call. It would be too easy to have somebody else to make the call for you to falsely administer "proof" of chinese verbal skills. The VO has no way of knowing who he is speaking with - this could never work!

[Cerberus]

From reading the posts made by USCONGUZ, I understand that VOs come and go, as they cycle through their assignments, and different VOs have varying experiences and trainings in handling immigration visa petitions.  After reading the blue slip events which happened to the following CFL members:

 

notrevorich

 

EdG

 

bobmal99

 

in thinking about the traumatic and devastating impact on the beneficiaries and the petitioners, I am asking the following two questions:

 

(1) After the beneficiary is handed a blue slip, can she/he ask to speak to a VO supervisor to have a “second opinion” right afterwards, because different VOs can come to different conclusions?  These are evidenced by bobmal99 and notrevorich cases (see their respective threads).

 

(2) After the blue slips are given out, the only way that the American petition can communicate directly with the Consulate is through E-Mails on the Consulate’s website or making a personal trip to Guangzhou.  As many petitioners have their own busy jobs and may not have the luxury to travel to Guangzhou on a short notice, can the American petition have a “telephone interview” with the VO, so that petitioner can explain the case and story to the VO?  If the “telephone interview” does not work, then the petitioner can use the last resort to fly to Guangzhou to advocate his/her case.  (You can't reach a decision maker through the current Visa Hotline in Shanghai, China).

 

I saw many blue slips were eventually resolved for CFL members.  I am just thinking how we can make the process smooth and less painful.  Your future and your wives future are all in the hands of VOs, and are decided in a few minutes.

 

Paul

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Stone,

 

Please read the field report that I made. The information is less than 3 weeks old. Go to post 1, 25 and 34 at http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14483. I listed the FAX number there. You better keep it.

 

DavidZixuan and I discussed this outright and fully. There seems to be different classifications of RFE now. An outright blue slip is for example, you don't have the funds for sponsorship, no tax records, etc. These items will take time to correct. I should point out that this list could be endless.

 

Then there is the case of my wife. She received a pink slip. Seems that this new slip is for something can be solved with a fax, or can immediately fixed "on the spot!" My wife's case was a "on the spot" fix, which I cared for by a simple fax. The visa was granted immediately the following day, after the FAX was sent in.

 

GUZ seems to be improving the manner of processing, by giving a person a chance to repair the damage and not outright Blue RFE the person.

 

After the blue slips are given out, the only way that the American petition can communicate directly with the Consulate is through E-Mails on the Consulate’s website or making a personal trip to Guangzhou. As many petitioners have their own busy jobs and may not have the luxury to travel to Guangzhou on a short notice, can the American petition have a “telephone interview” with the VO, so that petitioner can explain the case and story to the VO? If the “telephone interview” does not work, then the petitioner can use the last resort to fly to Guangzhou to advocate his/her case. (You can't reach a decision maker through the current Visa Hotline in Shanghai, China).

 

No, there isn’t any way that you are able to directly communicate with this particular section. I had the after-hours Embassy Officer helping me, and he wouldn't release the phone numbers. I understand his point though. It would have been useless to talk to them. They (Visa Section) wanted to have an explanation from me via fax, not a telephone call. On the telephone, how do they know it isn't your grandfather talking to them? Send a FAX and they have a signature to look at right there and compare with all the other signatures sent in (129F, G325, etc)

 

There are several other posts that I made. If you follow what is written, your chances are minimized receiving an outright RFE. These are some other advice is have made. It is entirely up to the individual whether they want to listen or not .

 

Post 36, & 41:

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?...pic=14006&st=30

 

Post 1 and several others I made here:

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14483

 

FAQs in the Links and Resources Section. I should tell you do not deviate from what DavidZixuan has put there. It is extremely accurate. Several “sticky” points I asked my wife and she confirmed the information. This confirmation is less that 2 weeks old. It is extremely accurate!

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=11293

[Stone]

Thank you, Cerberus! I have written down the fax number just in case. Thank you for your advice. I remember what Maura Harty said: a well-informed applicant is usually a successful applicant.

 

Paul

[warpedbored]

I suggest you pose your question (without references to specific cases) to USCONGUZ in the GZ speaks forum.

[david_dawei]

Some denials are resolve in non-traditional ways and this is not going to be allowed often. It's good to know them, but best to prepare for protocol means of overcome.

 

Rely on two basic thougths:

1) A blue slips means they want more time to review something... Most overcomes result in a visa with evidence brought to the interview but not reviewed. Why not review? They want more time to review it...

2) Understand what they want and give it to them as expediently as possible. If the USC is around, I think this helps.

 

---

 

I personally believe that if you are prepared completely, it will not be traumatic and devastating... My SO and I completely rehearse what we would do if given a blue slip... Here's my general advice and this entire thread is worth reading:

 

I do think that being prepared is a holistic concept to include mentally and emotionally.  

 

If your not explaining to your SO that the process is of indeterminate time, but statistically can count on a high degree of passing the first interview, and even higher degree of passing the overcome (should it come to that)... then I think we're ignoring the most important emotional part of the process and perpetuating devastation.

 

If someone has a third party issue or suspects one, this is a slightly different beast and you'd better expect at least six months extra time. 

 

If we don't understand the way it is, whether we like it or not, then we cannot really be fully prepared.. knowledge is a weapon we can use to some advantage and to help buffer the emotional heartache that comes with this process.   It ain't easy, but there's plenty of soldiers ahead of us who have marked the path and it is only because of their dedication to their SO that we understand how to walk through the fires of GUZ...

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Also significant is what VOs have said, as reported by members.. I always found this one of the best for understanding blue slips.. and most of it is in the FAQ:

 

OK,I was at the consulate on Sept. 30 for the info session.

 

The VO that gave the talk had this to say about Blue Slips.

 

The VO's have great discretion over who gets Visa's,the rules are kind of gray.Many of their initial decision's are based on gut reactions.They are only allotted a certain amount of time to reveiw the material before the interveiw.Then they only have a limited amount of time at the interveiw.

 

What this means,is that if their gut reaction throws any kind of red flag up.

They may not look at anything at the interveiw,they have already decided that your case needs further reveiw.Which they do not have time for at the initial interveiw.For us that means we will get a blue slip,we will be asked to bring requested info back the next day.Often times the info will be just the info you had at the interveiw,which they could not take the time to look at,that day.

 

In the VO's own words---When you bring your info in,it will sit on his desk until he takes the time to reveiw EVERYTHING,he says he can not go home until the pile of cases on his desk is reveiwed.

 

In a nutshell,he said do not sweat a blue slip,initially.It simple means they need to take more time to reveiw your information.

 

Fraud is a major problem,they see all manner of fake paperwork.Up to and including fake US passports and IRS paperwork.

 

 

I know this does not seem very fair but it kind of explains some of the inconsistencies we see.

 

Some of us real people are getting swooped up in the big game.

The VO did not seem the least remorseful about how some people might be asked to return again and again,even though their homes might be thousands of miles away.Although overall,he seemed to be a nice guy.

 

I heard what I have heard often here-----bring as much documentation as you can get.They may look at it OR they may not.Every case is different!

 

The good news ,if any!Tell your SO to stay calm,if a blue slip is issued-quite possibly it can be resolved with just the paperwork you already have.They just need to take the time to look at it.

 

 

Well,that is how he explained it.

 

Beyond that,I think sometimes they just ask for off the wall Items(like videotapes)to see how people will respond.If there was a big complete list of everything you needed,then I suppose the fakers would have a fake everything when they show up for the interveiw.

 

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Edited December 16, 2005 by DavidZixuan (see edit history)