DennisLeiqin

What's your opinion of the content of the NYT article you posted? That it provides information which is not available through other sources. The Communist media tend to publish the same, or very similar articles which in this case were barely a paragraph or two. The other Western media, of course, didn't cover it. Curious that you are able to read these western media sources. I suppose if you can then Chinese citizens can too? And, are you concerned that your internet use and internet post might be watched by 'them'?

Eunice is back in da house!! Nice, informative post Eunice. Nice to see you are still involved.

I think in most of our cases with our wives having limited English or just having to start over in developing a career here just might rule our group out of that equation. Still, have to agree with Beachey that our wives are very industrious and they're not too many slouchers to be found among them. Fortunately, my wife has found a ninch taking care of newborn Chinese babies here in LA and seems to have her pick of work, albeit that the Chinese bosses require her to work 12 on 12 off 7 days a week. Still, she works for a month and then takes a month off. Can't say that her $75/day pay puts us up in the category that Beachey's OP shows. But, when I look at what Leiqin isn't spending because she's working you can probably double that daily pay.

Hmmm....let's see now... Attractive twenty something woman whose got an explosive personality but is willing to give it up to anyone who will petition her to come to the US and willing to put up with her tirades and then hope and pray that she'll at least give it up once in a while in order to keep the hook embedded to keep the poor sap hoping for more... Yeah, sounds great. Where do I sign my single (used to be) friends up?

Maybe you can play matchmaker and introduce sis to someone.

I had to give up this Superbowl Sunday. We needed to buy a new car and then give Leiqin's car to her son. After buying the new car we drove 200 miles round trip to Ning and then back home. Missed the game. That's OK. Just as we were on the freeway driving we had to keep a very careful watch on those drivers who obviously spent most of the day at SB parties...was a pretty crazy drive home.

Makes sense, not to mention that it's the law. Rather confusing as to why my friend in the know would tell me that's the reason they're driving with a license. ... unless they're Korean, Japanese ... ? Naw. May take a while to find out, but I am going to keep digging...

What do you know about these women getting an International Driver License while here? Is the law different than just getting a normal license that will expire when their visa or GC does? I was told that many women get an US international driver license while here. Sorry, I'm too lazy and tired to search for an answer.

I like this last line... To see the United States despite the strength, but they play Mahjong in China, not a Western poker, playing by the rules of the Chinese people, how many American's chances of winning?

In the state of NY in order to take driving lessons would need a valid learner's permit, which like a license requires evidence of legal presence. Permit has the same requirements as a license, the permit is a legal photo ID. Probably the law here too. These Chinese don't get drivers lessons from a licensed school, but from another Chinese who has a "business" teaching other Chinese how to drive. Additionally, as you can imagine, following the letter of the law isn't much concern to many Chinese who overstay. And, playing stupid is common practice. So, an officer pulls them over and asks for a driver license. The instructor explains to the police how he's teaching his friend how to drive and how he wasn't aware of a learners permit. Police will often let them go with a warning (just a guess, no facts to back that up).

It may be Dennis that while their cases for asylum are pending they have some legal presence status for being here. If they are here with no legal presence though they can no longer get a driver's license in any of the 50 states. Now I wonder if so many drive on expired licenses. And, I still don't understand why one woman I know, who is currently out of status, why would she be taking driving lessons? Curious...

I briefly spoke with a close friend, Mary, who is very tuned-in to these women. She tells me that they do get a driver license (now that I read the Calif. law that Carl posts, I will need to look into this further). All I know is I see them buy and driving cars when I know their immigration status. In fact, I know one woman who is currently going to driving school so that she can get a driver license and buy a car. This woman has overstayed now ~3month and she knew right off that she'd need to have a car to work, live and survive in LA. They pay cash for their autos. There's no legal residence requirement to attend school, heck we all know about that. If they can put 50%, they can buy a home without having proof of legal status, Mary tells me. Mary says what often happens is, after overstaying a year (don't know why or if one year is important) many of these women will hire a lawyer to plead a case of asylum in immigration court. When I met my wife, she was an asylee. She and her son gained asylum after her American born husband died 8 months after their arrival here. I never learned what they pleaded or how they were granted asylum. I always guessed that it was out of kindness of the immigration court. Anyway, Mary said that's what she's seeing. She believes the courts are pretty liberal about granting asylum. I will add more when as I learn.

That's an interesting question and quite frankly I don't know how they do it, yet I see it all the time...I'll ask around and see what I find out.

Nice find, Dan. Very interesting...so many symbolisms... Thanks.

Leiqin and I live just outside the old LA Chinatown. We enjoy the old Chinatown tourist feel vs. the new China burbs of Monteray Park in LAs San Gabriel Valley where we do our grocery shopping. The old downtown Chinatown won't be going anywhere soon. It still draws tourist who want to see Shanghai building's architecture that were originally built as movie props and then moved to here. Chinatown is still a China town where Chinese live and work. I have often sent CFL friends who travel to LA to the real, new China towns that are away from the tourist Chinatown to the new, modern areas in San Gabriel. I suppose some day looking back visitors will view the San Gabriel Chinatown just as quaint as the current downtown Chinatown is seen today.

OK, back on topic then... For anyone interested, my participation in one case was as a character witness where a very close friend was asking for asylum from religious persecution. She is a pastor at our church and feared that returning to China she would receive retribution from her graduate thesis that she gave at her Chinese Christian seminary that condemned the Chinese government's policy of restricting religious freedom. I was also a witness in a close friend's case of abuse by her American husband. Through tears (sobbing and whaling) she testified of being tied up to her bed while her husband performed sexual acts of torture where she had to show the court the scars she received. She told the court how she was required to stay nude throughout the day while her husband took pictures of her in various sexual positions. The state rested without rebuttal. Our friend tells us that the female judge was teared up listening to her testimony. The first case won asylum. The second case was give an immediate unconditional 10-year green card. PM me and I will give you these women's contact information. She wasn't really whaling, but wailing. Although ShaZhang may enjoy whaling I doubt that she's every thought of trying it.

OK, back on topic then... For anyone interested, my participation in one case was as a character witness where a very close friend was asking for asylum from religious persecution. She is a pastor at our church and feared that returning to China she would receive retribution from her graduate thesis that she gave at her Chinese Christian seminary that condemned the Chinese government's policy of restricting religious freedom. I was also a witness in a close friend's case of abuse by her American husband. Through tears (sobbing and whaling) she testified of being tied up to her bed while her husband performed sexual acts of torture where she had to show the court the scars she received. She told the court how she was required to stay nude throughout the day while her husband took pictures of her in various sexual positions. The state rested without rebuttal. Our friend tells us that the female judge was teared up listening to her testimony. The first case won asylum. The second case was give an immediate unconditional 10-year green card. PM me and I will give you these women's contact information.

Randy, you took the position that ICE has in place a deportation system to remove these women from our society. I disputed that premise. Not trying to step on your toes by taking a contrary position; however, I do take an opposing view and I don't understand why you find that opposing view as seemingly something that you need to defend or attack. Frankly, I find that subject silly and not worth discussing further. I simply wanted to share some of my experience of these women who have overstayed here in the US and appreciate yours and other opinions as to why our immigration system allows them to arrive and overstay, as well as what reasons these women seek to come here.

Huh? Sorry, I don't understand what your point is. Dennis, please refer back to the original topic. Ahhh, sorry, still don't know what you are talking about nor what your point is....did I disagree with something?

Huh? Sorry, I don't understand what your point is.

ICE deports persons of all nationalities. ICE has limited funds to round up all the illegals who have landed here and are living on US soil. It's no secret that citizens of other countries know this: that there is little chance of their being deported once here. It's a joke to pretend that ICE enforces deportation of these illegals. The US immigration has continued to allow thirty-something Chinese women to get tourist visas. I don't understand why they continue to ingore their profile and of their potential to overstay. As I stated in my OP, I meet these women almost weekly. There are 11.2 million illegals here in the US. Stop pretending that ICE has a handle on deportations and that there are continious 24/7 deportation flights to China. There aren't and these women who seek a life here know it too. Heck, people of the world know it. Once here, they stay here. They can start a business, drive a car, own a home...and they live here without fear of immigration reprisal. I just don't understand why some here in this forum continue to insist that there's something different than this reality.

That is probably true, Carl. I can only speak of and have posted from my experience living here in LA. Maybe, ICE has concentrated on the easy pickens. Don't know. My post wasn't meant to debate whether or not ICE enforces deportation, but to simply give a slice of my perspective of how I see those who overstay here in my world. Guess, some enjoy making more out of it than what you and I find necessary.

Hunted down like dogs? What do you have to back that up? I have yet to see any Chinese being deported. Period. Yes, there are deportation buses to Mexico. Are there deportatin plane flights to China? No, there are not. Like it or not, these Chinese women know that once they are here they can stay without impunity. IMO the problem is not the enforcement of those who overstay, but at the front end of allowing those who fit a certain profile to gain a visa in the first place. Read my timeline, Dennis. Sorry if you don't see these things, but some of us do. Yes, you can overstay a visa, NOT apply for AOS or ANYTHING ELSE and fall through the cracks (like perhaps most people do), but if your paperwork falls on the wrong person's desk at the wrong time - well, maybe you can ignore THOSE orders, too. Then again, there ARE people that they DO go after. I was on a "deportation flight" with one of them, as I've stated before. It's unclear what your reticence is - you seem to be aware of immigration court. There are undergrounds, middle grounds, and plenty of people who are completely above board. I am not saying that deportation does not exist for Chinese. However, I am saying that in my 7 years here living among and knowing many Chinese who are undocumented they live life relatively free of reprisal and fear of deportation. I have yet to meet one who has either been given notice of deportation nor been deported. What does that say? And I will add, why is it common knowledge among Chinese women that they can come here, overstay, go to school, get a driver license, buy and drive a car, own a home without fear of deportation? Why is this so difficult for some of you to realize the truth of what's going on? Why do you insist that USCIS have some deportation gestapo in place when there isn't? Facts are facts. Reality is what it is. Like it or not. This is what our immigration policy has allowed. So, you have seen one person being deported on a flight that you were on. And that overrules all the many undocumented women who continue to live here free and without fear of reprisal? That's just silly.

Hunted down like dogs? What do you have to back that up? I have yet to see any Chinese being deported. Period. Yes, there are deportation buses to Mexico. Are there deportatin plane flights to China? No, there are not. Like it or not, these Chinese women know that once they are here they can stay without impunity. IMO the problem is not the enforcement of those who overstay, but at the front end of allowing those who fit a certain profile to gain a visa in the first place.

Please continue... Yes, David's post seems to imply that I have 'offered' up women to him, as if I am some pimp. Not sure what he meant by that, as I have never 'offered' anyone and I have never known David when he was 'single'.