MoonCarolCafe

Me trying to explain to my wife what flying in an airplane is like: You recall the express bus (fast car) we took from Guangzhou back to where we got married? It's like that, but much bigger. And smaller seats. And louder. And your ears will hurt a bit. Aside from that it's very boring. We'll be on the plane for about 14 hours. Ideally anyone flying in to LAX from CAN for the first time will arrive at night. The view of the Los Angeles megalopolis on the landing approach is breathtaking. A galaxy of high pressure sodium street lights stretching as far as the eye can see, the major freeways crossing hither and yon...

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. I know it's easy for me to say from the far side of what you are going through, but I really do feel your pain. Relax. The visa office has you by the short and curlies and you have to play the game by thier rules. There is a very good chance that your wife was pre-selected to get the blue slip, and there is naught she could have done at the interview to turn that "lan" into a "bai". The consulate is going to ask you to jump through hoops of fire wearing clothes soaked in kerosene. Then they are going to send you away and tell you that they'll get back to you when they feel like it. And then... your wife will get a letter telling her to come get her visa, And on that day you will feel about 10 feet tall and strong enough to take on a grizzly with your bare hands (please don't actually try to).

Um I'll take that question for $250. What is..."Hell No?" Think of all hoops the visa office makes you jump through. You think they are going to let you submit the video in a format that is near universally readable when they can insist that you sumbit the video in a hardware format that never caught on in China, in a TV format that was never used in China? NTSC format VHS tape is what they want. Even though VCRs are few and far between in the land of the bootleg VCD, and even if they were common they would not be NTSC machines.

Yeah, considering I stand out in Guangzhou like a raisin in a pot of rice I'm suprised that I did not end up buying dinner for several couples. Perhaps I should smile more when walking around at night. My polite letters with pictures sent via DHL ($30 each!) to the Consul General might have helped, or perhaps they just finally got around to our file in the "hold" stack. It's frustrating not knowing what you did right, or wrong, especially when they have decided beforehand what color slip you will get. (remind your wives/husbands to hide the slip, no matter what the color is, when they leave the consulate!!)

No problem with the taxes, We've filed joint returns since 2003. I was lucky enough to get a tax identification number for her right before the IRS changed the rules making it harder to get one.

Something is not right in the capital of Denmark. I've never met the nice lady in question; but it sounds to me like you are being used. Would you two still be together even if it meant you had to live with her in Nanning? By the way, $200-$300 per month is a chunk-o-change in Guangzhou, I'd expect it to stretch even farther in Nanning. If a woman is constantly giving reasons for you to give her money (instead of suggesting you save it to pay for a trip to visit her) then I'd be quite wary-- be she in Nanning or Nashville.

Ya'll have one last chance... I'm off to the travel agency to get a plane ride to Guangzhou for me, and a plane ride back "home" for us, in about 30 minutes.

Excellent!

The equivalent to a SSN is a TIN, Tax ID Number. My wife has a TIN, even though she has yet to set foot in the USA. I was lucky, I got her a TIN just before they changed the rules for granting them in December 2003.

Who do I speak to if I wish to donate a couple of VCD players as a replacement for the tired VHS machine that is the cause of so much trouble?

I sent my wife in with my passport, an expandable folder full of relationship related documentation, my drivers license (which they kept), credit cards in both our names, my checkbook with both our names on the checks... and a pony. I was there, waiting outside the consulate, and we did not get the coveted white slip. I was there, we gave them everything they asked for... and my wife was still sent away without a white slip. Being present does not guarantee that you will get a white slip. Being absent does not guarantee you will get a blue slip. Being on site for the interview guarantees you won't regret not going if your presence is needed. On the other hand, if you still get sent away empty handed, you are looking at paying for 2 trips where you had originally only planned 1. I wish it were as easy as saying "Stand outside the consulate today and you'll fly back to the USA with your S.O. tomorrow", but then all those who engage in visa fraud (may they fall feet-first into a wood chipper) would know exactly what it takes to game the system.

Thanks ya'll.

45 minutes ago my wife picked up her visa... And there was much rejoicing in the land. Please excuse me while I prance around like a drunken sailor.

I don't know why we were the unlucky recipients of a yellow slip. I do know that a few weeks later the consulate called and faxed my office to verufy that I did work where the paperwork said I worked. I did not inquire which questions were asked of my wife in the interview. Anything that makes her think it might have been her fault is to be avoided.

Quan shoots, she scores, it's nothing but net!

If you can't get to China, you can't get to China, nothing you can do about it. If you have done everything reasonably possible to ensure a positive outcome, then your conscience will be clear. Still, the interview is THE most important thing your wife/fiancee will face. More important than you two getting married. You can be together without being married. If she does not pass the interview then you'll be the one moving to China to be with your love. I too put off a return trip to China, waiting waiting waiting and wanting to be available for the interview. I ended up delaying my trip for 4 months beyond the date I had originally planned to return to China. I'd love to say that the trip is absolutely not needed. History has shown otherwise. The yellow slip is what you get when the consulate has not yet decided if you get the lady or the tiger. It's a "Yeah, you gave us what we asked for, now go away, and don't call us-- we'll call you" notice.

Congrats to the latest batch of interview appointees! Some of you may consider letting your S.O. go to the interview without you traveling to China. I strongly advise against this. Plan A: Spend a chunk-o-change on airfare to China in order to be on hand just in case things go sour in the interview. Plan B: Spend a chunk-o-change on Peptol-Pismol due to the indigestion caused when you realize that you should have chosen Plan A, and spend a chunk-o-change on the airfare to China anyway. No matter what color slip your wife gets (white, blue, or yellow), have her keep it hidden until you are away from the half-ring circus outside the consulate gates. The immigration service touts hanging around the entrance can be quite persistant, doubly so when they see you have been blue/yellow slipped.

My advice: Get there early. Stand with her in the line outside the consulate. When it's time for her to go inside the consulate go take a slow walk around the perimeter of Shamain island and relax, the decision to grant or deny your visa was likely made days if not weeks beforehand.

That is still extraterritorial application of US law-- punishment here, for something you did elsewhere. Abortion is illegal in location A, resident of location A goes to location B where "reproductive choice" has at least defacto, if not dejure recognition, and has an abortion. She then returns home to location A, where she is tried for "murder of an unborn baby", even though the authorities in the place she went to have don't think a serious crime was commited. This is extraterritorial application of US law. A homosexual citizen of Iran gets caught in flagrante delicto on the security camera of an elevator in Harrods with a man who for resons I need not go into here, looks obviously Jewish. I'm certain the Mullahs of Iran take a strict interpretation of the Koran on matters of this sort, especially when the video shows the Semite in the dominant position. (I hope I have abstracted the scenario enough to keep it PG, while understandable). Were he to be tried upon return to Iran that would be again, extraterritorial application of the law. However, we don't even have to wait for them to be in the USA before agents nab them for trial. Yes, that's right-- there is a Supreme Court decision that allows US law enforcement agents to abduct someone from outside the USA, for trial in the USA, even though the person is not a US citizen, provided that a treaty of extradition exisits (Full text of U.S. v H. Alvarez Machain) in order to try them in an U.S. court. It appears that extraterritorial enforcement is legal (the Supreme Court interprets what the legislature creates, no matter how poorly thought out the legislation is). I still think it is a Very Bad Idea. (I also think that the folks in the GZ visa office are just jam-packed full of swellness! Hear me guys? My wife will be dropping by for a visit shortly, OK?) Imagine the indignant cries of outrage were the Chinese National Police to sneak a Fulan-Gong leader out of the USA for trial in China.

If we get in the habit of extraterritorial enforcement we have little standing to object when China throws one of thier citizens in jail for something they do while in the USA, which happens to be illegal in China. I.e. A woman from Saudi Arabia wears a bathing suit in public while visiting a beach in Florida. In Saudi Arabia this is a serious offense against public morals, possibly punishable by flogging and public humiliation. Should she be punished upon return to her nation of origin for actions that rightly or wrongly, are legal in other places? This is equivalent to a law that says if it is illegal for me to do something in my state of residence, it is illegal for me no matter which state I may visit. Protection of minors from sexual predators is a laudable goal. The extraterritorial application of the Protect Act (more info here) appeals to emotion, not logic. IANAL, but IMHO this is poor application of a law.

I have confirmed the wife has been invited to appear at the consulate next week, Monday through Thursday, during normal business hours. Jumping Jesus on a pogo-stick! I am well aware that the merry band of pranksters in the compound at the Swan Hotel have been known to summon a person, only to send them away with yet another slip saying "Don't call us, we'll call you". But like a barfly that chooses to overlook the unusually large Adam's apple of the woman on the stool next to him, I'm going to pretend that we about to score until proven otherwise.

Unfortunately I am not in GZ right now. When she gets back to somewhere with a decent phone connection I'll find out if you will get one last chance to win a game of "Spot the Negro".

Huzzah! The reports of my demise are premature. The missus is a sweet little lady, full of Southern charm (that's Southern, as in Southern China) Happy as a clam to eat dinner at Blue & White (even though I think a warm glass of water has more taste than the food they serve). Apparently she just got a letter suggesting it would be a good idea if she and her passport would stop by the consulate in a week or so.

Damn straight you have a cause to be bitter. Think of the time stolen from you and your S.O. by the staff of the GZ consulate. You can Never. Get. It. Back.

Still here. I'll be in China shortly checking out possible employment.