hank

Try to relax. As long as your namecheck has been completed, you will get your interview soon. Just give it a week or two, you are almost to the finish line.

Thanks for the post pingme. Somehow, I don't buy Mrs. O'Connell's assertion that our immigrant visas are processed slower than student visas because of "more steps". Because most of us have already passed the name checks and are merely waiting to be scheduled for an appointment. What additional steps are there between passing the namecheck and the interview? In addition, if they are not favoring student petitons from Chinese citizens over our family petitions, why are our petitions only processed at GUZ, while student petitions are processed at all consulates? It seems unfair to me. But at least they are responding, and this is a good thing.

Good Luck Alex!

Guys, this has evolved into something awesome. Now we need some guidance, because we have too many GREAT ideas on the table. It would be good if one of the moderators, who have the most experience, could step in and take the lead. Then we can all follow their advice. Remember that United We Stand, Divided We Fall. PJ, donahso, ttlee_99, owenkrout, Charlotte, are you out there?

Oh why not, I'll send the group letter. Is everyone okay with that? And we will use Boba's version of the letter.

I agree that Boba's letter is the one. And it is written in a group letter format, so let's go with the group letter. If we want the power of numbers, we can mail the same letter to different decision makers in the DOS. And Tywy_99 is right, that Mrs. Harty should be addressed as: Maura Harty Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Consular Affairs So who wants to carry the torch? I would suggest a volunteer who has already received his/her visa. Let's get moving for our CFL brothers and sisters who really need this.

Pingme, Your letter is excellent. I just have two very small suggestion and a question. Suggestion: "Please consider the petitions of US citizens for their loved ones to be at least of equal priority as those from Chinese citizens." This is a little confusing, because it sounds like you are saying that Chinese citizens are also issuing petitions for their loved ones. Restate this as: "Please consider the petitions of US citizens for their loved ones to be at least of equal priority as student and business petitions from Chinese Citizens." And for number 2 on the list, there is an appeal process already avaliable. However, this process is not transparent and does not let us actually speak with a knowledgable representative. In addition, I think that we should use the word "transparent", because it was a word that Mrs. Harty repeated herself many times at the Beijing conference. Finally, are you sure that all your facts and figures are correct? If they are, we have a very strong case. If not, it will hurt the credibility of our letter. I revised your letter (a little). See my version below, and let me know what you think. If it's good and all the facts and figures are correct, let's run with this version. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear Secretary Harty: I am writing to you as a member of “A Candle For Love” (CFL), a growing online community of nearly 2,000 law abiding, taxpaying U.S. Citizens. We are joined by the common bond of a lengthy and unpredictable wait to receive immigrant visas for our wives, fiancés and children. The purpose of this letter is to address a few of the current immigrant visa processing issues at the American Consulate in Guangzhou. These issues have caused unnecessary and terrible hardships for many of us and our families. We ask that you please take a moment to read our honest assessment of the current situation and that you consider possible solutions. 1) Wait Times for K1 & K3 Visas: The wait time for the K-1 Fiancé Visa and K3 Visa is among the longest in the world. Our members wait an average of 13-months without a good reason or understanding why it takes so long. We ask that you please investigate and help us to understand this situation, especially in light of the fact that other countries, such as England and Canada, are able to process visas of this type in much shorter time, typically 30-45 days. China has the world’s largest population. Is it time that a country of this size and importance has more than one consulate to handle immigrate visas? Canada has two such locations. You recently spoke in Beijing about the improvements in handling Student and business visas from China, with over 180,000 student visas per year typically processed and issued in a matter of days or weeks. Please consider the petitions of US citizens for their loved ones to be at least of equal priority as student and business petitions from Chinese Citizens. 2) The Lack Of Transparency in The Appeal Process Many of our members are being denied visas for no apparent reason. They are denied and not allowed consultation with a member of the IV Unit to resolve these denials, or to know why they are being denied. Please work to correct this situation. 3) White Slips that are changed to Blue Slips: There are a growing number of cases where white acceptance slips are being given to the wife or fiancé of a U.S. Citizen immediately after the interview, only to receive a blue slip the following day, and the visa denied — without explanation or consultation. Please do what you can to ensure that the initial decision remains until the visa is given. Again these cases directly affect the lives and future of US Citizens and their loved ones. These items are simply a few occurrences we wish to bring to your attention at this time. The US consulate in China is US soil. Please help to ensure that everyone who enters is treated with the basic human rights of dignity, respect, and non-discrimination that is fundamental to our way of life. We are not asking for any special treatment, just the same consideration, care and service that anyone requesting a visa in China would and should expect. Thank you for taking the time to hear our concerns. Respectfully, The Members of CFL. PS: I have forwarded a copy of this letter to my local Senators and Representative to help resolve these issues. A copy is also being forwarded to each of the consulates in China, to make them aware of the issues and hopefully they can work together to improve the service we receive. Again I would like to thank you for the improvements you have been able to accomplish in allowing Chinese students and business people to obtain their visas, now I hope we can expect the same for US citizens waiting to be reunited with their loved ones. Thanks.

Hey Guys, After reading about MikeXiao's case, I feel that we need to get our letter out now! As far as which version to send out, I am all for sending a signed copy of every version. Read MikeXiao's case and see why I'm so pissed. Click here to read about MikeXiao's Case So we need to send our information (names, phone numbers, and GUZ Case numbers) to one member, who will mail the letters. Does anyone want to volunteer to handle and mail the letters? If we sit on our hands, nothing will get done. We need to help shine the light for our CFL brothers and sisters in this dreaded black hole.

Exactly why our letter is so important. We can either stand by and do nothing or open our mouths and voice our opinions that the system is corrupt. This is another reason why I didn't agree with shortening the letter. Timelines may be important, but transparency should be our main priority. There is no reason why they should be left in the dark... with their hopes dashed until the DOS feels like getting back to them in five or six months.

If you discovered an interesting magazine article, would you throw it away because it was more than two pages? My letter was written to be interesting and something that would keep her interest. If we want to get Maura Harty to act on our behalf, we need to make a very compelling case. This cannot be accomplished with a short business-like letter. Martin Luther King's speeches were not short, but they sure were compelling and stirred people to action. Like I said before, if she does not have the time to read our letter, she certainly won't have the time to waddle through the red tape to help us. I feel that our best bet is to help her understand how we feel and what we are going through. We can't accomplish this by trimming down. In addition, I'm definitely game for adding something positive to the end of the letter. But if you are in, it's time to raise your hand and be counted. We need enough support to get lift-off with this letter.

Good idea Trigg. Is there anyone who would like to take a stab at editing this letter? We can put several versions on this thread. Then make a group decision about which one to go with. Do I hear any volunteers????

I agree that it is usually better to keep things simple. However, is there a way to cover all of the major points in a shorter letter? We need to talk about those who were denied visas for no aparent reason, and the fact that they are in the dark about the reasons why. We need to talk about those who received white slips, and then blue slips on the day of visa pick-up. We need to talk about those who are stuck in the second name check process, about the way VO's have been dismissing our cases without looking at all of the information, about how they refuse to provide translation services, and about the long visa processing times. We need to explain each of these issues in a meaningful way. For example, I brought up the notion that Chinese citizens are getting serviced for student visas before American citizens who want to be reunited with their families. By presenting this point, we are stating "why" our cases should have priority. In addition, a few members have also suggested that we mention a few positives about GUZ. That will make this letter even longer. But it also adds credibility to our claims, as it shows that we are trying to be fair in our assessments. Finally, if Maura Harty cannot take the time to read this letter, she certainly will not have the time to make any changes on our behalf.

Jenny, Good point! We should say something nice, like a "thank you" to those VO's who are polite and doing their jobs well. It's true that most of the problems are caused by a few bad apples. I'll add that before we send out the copy. Who else is in?

I want to thank everyone for the great amount of feedback that I received on the first draft of our group letter. I tried to incorporate as many suggestions as possible. Wolffjw, I liked your suggestion about removing all references to "Candle For Love", but this made it hard for me to qualify my claims about problems at GUZ. I needed to be able to refer to the experiences of our members. But your feedback was certainly appreciated. Alright everyone, the second draft is below. If you feel that it's ready, let me know if this petition has your support. If we can get enough bids of support, we can proceed to discuss the details behind getting this petition and signatures to Mrs. Harty. "Dear Secretary Harty, We are members of “A Candle For Love”, a growing online community of American Citizens who are waiting to be reunited with family and loved ones in China. The purpose of this letter is to address current immigrant visa processing problems at the American Consulate in Guangzhou. These issues have caused tremendous hardships for us and our families, so we hope that you will take a moment to read our honest assessment of the current situation. Below, you will find a list of reoccurring problems that our members have encountered. Our greatest concern involves the complete lack of transparency and customer service in the visa process. Currently, some of our members have been denied visas for NO apparent reason. Their anguish comes from being kept in the dark about the cause of the denial. How can they provide the right evidence or even make their case when there is no consular representative to discuss the situation with? To make matters worse, several of our members have received white approval slips on the day of their interviews, only to be denied on the day of visa pick-up. This unethical and abhorrent practice casts a long shadow on the Department of State’s credibility. Then there are others with no interview date in sight, as their petitions are stuck indefinitely in the second name check process. Their burden could be lightened if they understood the reasons for such extreme delays. Unfortunately, they have also been kept in the dark. Imagine the tremendous heart-break and hardships that are placed on these couples, especially after waiting so long for the immigrant visa process; many have waited over a year. Since they are committed to their fiancés and spouses, some are left with no choice but to abandon the United States and move to China. In a way, this creates a backdoor expatriation of American Citizens. How can this happen in our country, where we were raised to believe that our government values each individual citizen? This situation can easily be resolved if those who were denied visas, after resubmitting evidence, could have the opportunity to sit down and discuss their cases with a knowledgeable consular officer. And those who are stuck in the name check process could get straight answers from the Department of State. This is not only fair, but an ethical necessity. Our second concern involves the treatment that our fiancés and spouses have received during interviews. Some have received blue slips or denials before the consular officers even looked at the evidence presented. Others, who presented additional evidence to overcome initial denials, had their evidence returned with letters unopened. How can any interviewer make a fair decision without considering the evidence? This practice is unfair and completely unethical. In addition, some of our fiancés and spouses have encountered interviewers who refuse to provide interpretation services. To make matters worse, some of these same interviewers have asked questions in rapid succession, without providing proper time for our fiancés and spouses to answer. We strongly feel that the authenticity of our relationships cannot be measured in one’s command of the English language. If there is a written policy that requires fluency in English, we would like to know about it. If not, interpretation services should always be available. Finally, we wish to address the long immigrant visa processing times at Guangzhou. Compared to other consulates around the world, Guangzhou is one of the slowest (if not the slowest) in processing family based petitions. In addition, it seems that Chinese citizens who are applying for student visas are given priority over American citizens who are applying to be united with their families. How can this be right? In conclusion, we are requesting better customer service and transparency in the visa process. This is our most urgent request, because the inexcusable suffering of so many Americans and their loved ones can be resolved through simple improvements. Please provide better customer service and transparency to those who encounter snags in the visa process. Please ensure that consular officers treat our fiancés, spouses, and cases with the respect and attention that they deserve. Finally, we hope that immigrant visa processing times at Guangzhou can improve soon. Thank you for taking the time to hear our concerns."

Not a drip from the spigot. Patience my friend.

Thanks for the feedback. I will edit the letter and post the new copy soon. And for those who are experiencing serious visa problems, please send me a copy of your stories.... you can PM it to me if you like. Perhaps Mrs. Harty can look into your cases.

Last week, BeijingJenny spoke with Maura Harty, the Assistant Secretary of State for Consular Affairs. This is the person who can make needed changes at GUZ. Afterward, several CFL members have been sending Mrs. Harty emails and letters. The idea of a group letter was proposed, and I volunteered to write it. Well, here it is. Please let me know if you want to sign the letter... we need enough support to make it worth sending. In addition, any feedback about the letter would be useful. It still needs to be edited. Finally, those with stories that you would like to send, please PM me. We can include your stories as an attachment to this petition. Thanks everyone. "Dear Mrs. Maura Harty, We are members of “A Candle For Love”, a growing online community of American Citizens who are waiting to be reunited with family and loved ones in China. The purpose of this letter is to address current immigrant visa processing problems at the American Consulate in Guangzhou. These issues have caused unspeakable hardships for us and our families, so we hope that you will take a moment to read our assessment of the current situation. Below, you will find a list of reoccurring problems that our members have encountered. Our greatest concern involves the complete lack of transparency and customer service in the visa process. Currently, several of our members are stuck in what we have termed the “black hole”. It is a situation in which their fiancés or spouses have been denied visas, even after resubmitting evidence. Their greatest anguish comes from not being told the exact cause of the denial. How can they provide the right evidence or even make their case when there is no consular representative to discuss the situation with? Imagine the unspeakable hardship that is placed on these couples, especially after being required to put their lives on hold for over a year for the visa process! Some of those in the “black hole” are left with no choice but to leave the United States and move to China. In a sense, this creates a backdoor deportation of American Citizens who cannot bear to part with their fiancés or spouses. This situation can easily be resolved if those who were denied visas, after resubmitting evidence, could have the opportunity to sit down and discuss their cases with a knowledgeable consular officer. This is not only fair, but an ethical necessity. Our second concern involves the treatment that our fiancés and spouses have received during interviews. Some have received blue slips or denials before the consular officers even looked at the evidence presented. How can any interviewer make a fair decision without considering the evidence? We feel that this is completely unfair and unethical. In addition, some of our fiancés and spouses have encountered interviewers who refuse to provide interpretation services. To make matters worse, some of these same interviewers have asked questions in rapid succession, without providing proper time for our fiancés and spouses to answer. We strongly feel that the authenticity of our relationships cannot be measured in one’s command of the English language. If there is a written policy that requires fluency in English, we would like to know about it. If not, interpretation services should always be available. Finally, we would like to mention the visa cases that are stuck in another type of “black hole”. Several of our members have been stuck in the second name check process for nine months and beyond. This is a terrible situation, in which these couples are left to wait indefinitely. To make matters worse, they are kept in the dark as to the causes of these delays. Once again, this is an issue of transparency. In conclusion, we are not asking for any major changes in the visa processes at Guangzhou. We are merely requesting better customer service and transparency in the visa process. We feel that our demands are fair and necessary. The inexcusable suffering of so many Americans and their loved ones can be alleviated with a few small changes. Please provide better customer service and transparency to those who encounter snags in the visa process. Please ensure that consular officers treat our fiancés and spouses with the respect and attention that they deserve. This is all that we are asking for. Thank you. "

Absolutely Mari. Your story needs to be heard. But no one can explain it better than you. Please write about it and PM it to me. It will go a long way in strengthening our case and sheding light on these ongoing problems. All those who have suffered because of DOS incompetence, please send me your stories. We need to be heard.

For those who have showed their support so far, thank you. I will go ahead and draft the first copy of our letter, and post it within the next few days. I would hate to see Jenny's efforts go to waste, as she made the effort to speak with Mrs. Harty. So I feel that the least we can do is follow up with a letter to let our government representatives know how problems at GUZ are affecting us. This letter will not push for policy changes. It will not push for any large administrative changes. It's goal will be to accomplish two things. 1) Allow those who are stuck in the black hole to actually speak with a knowledgable DOS representative and get a straight explaination of what's going on. To this day, Alex and others have never received the story of what really happened to their petitions. They need to know. And this is consistant with Mrs. Harty's own goals for greater transparency. 2) Allow us, the petitioners, greater participation in the interview process. I do not buy GUZ's claim that there is not "enough space" in the interview room. The petitioner should at least have an opportunity to speak to the VO before a denial is issued... if the petitioner is present. These requests do not require any changes in policy or current operational procedures. They merely call for more courtesy on GUZ's part. That's all. But it is a huge step in helping us prevent further black holes. Stay Tuned for the first draft of our group letter... coming this week.

SIMPLY AMAZING !!!! Thanks Squid!

Jenny, I've learned something from your wonderful example. If you can go to Beijing to meet Mrs. Harty, then a short trip to meet Mrs. Harty in the U.S. could be easy. I propose creating a signed letter, followed by stories documenting experiences from individual CFL members who have been through or are in the black hole now. I am upset about the long wait times. But I am even more upset by stories of our CFL members being denied visas, then left in the dark about the reasons. GUZ can improve customer service without major changes. I propose that the letter be designed to get us in the door with Mrs. Harty... to get us a face to face meeting or conference where we can discuss changes that need to occur. If we are going to do this, we need to leverage our numbers. We can bring family and friends on board too. My visa is coming along in two months, so this probably won't benefit me directly. But in the past few months, I have read enough stories to make my stomach turn. The situation at GUZ needs to change, because it isn't right. And if we don't raise our voices, who will?

A few days ago, beijingjenny spoke with Maura Harty, the Assistant Secretary of State for Consular Affairs. Apparently, Mrs. Harty is a key individual who has the ability to enact change at GUZ and seemed sympathetic to our plight. However, the voices of those requesting business and student visas have been louder than ours... and their applications have priority over ours. This is wrong because business and student visas serve Chinese citizens who want to study here or do business. While our visas are requested by us, American citizens, who should be served first by the DOS. Thanks to beijingjenny, we may have Mrs. Harty's attention... if we continue to follow up. Donahso says that "a group letter is fine if someone wants to take it on." However, we must follow the CFL guidelines. I am volunteering to draft the letter, but I need feedback on the following items. 1) What issues should we bring to the table. 2) What is the best way to approach this issue. 3) Which members would like to sign the petition. Number three is important, as we need to know if CFL members want to do this. I understand that some of you, who are currently going through this process, may be wary about approaching the DOS. I know the feeling. So I want to start by saying that this petition will be absolutely POSITIVE in tone. We want to enlist the help of our government representatives, so we need to ask in a polite way. This does not mean that we cannot address the issues, but we need to approach it properly. So I am asking for the help of those who have already passed this ordeal; you can provide a lot of constructive feedback to policy-makers. And for those who are still waiting, like me, please step up if you feel that it is right. And of course, feedback from everyone is more than welcome. Thanks.

Thanks donahso, I would gladly volunteer to draft and organize the group letter. Before doing so, it would be helpful to get suggestions from CFL members. 1) What issues should we bring to the table. 2) What is the best way to approach this issue. 3) Which members would like to sign the petition. In addition, I want to strongly state that this will be a positive petition. We want to enlist the help of our government representatives, so we need to ask in a polite way. This does not mean that we cannot address important issues, but we need to approach it from the right angle. What do you all think? Should we do it?

Sorry, I ment my fiance's visa. I have been accustomed to thinking of it as my visa too. I'll change that in my original posting.

Recently Beijingjenny had the chance to question Maura Harty, the Assistant Secretary of State for Consular Affairs, about the situation at GUZ. Harty responded that adoption cases (among student and business visas) were given priority over family and fiance visas. And while I feel that the adoptions are a great thing, I feel that we should have priority over all visa cases, and this is why. Unlike adoption, business, and student cases, our visa problems could cause backdoor deportations of American Citizens. I know that this sounds crazy, but bear with me. If my fiance's visa was denied, like those of several of our CFL members in the black hole, I would be left with no choice but to leave the United States and move to China. This scenario does not exist with other visa issues. How many of us can walk away from our so? If we can't, then we are forced to leave the U.S. In other words, this is a round-about way of deporting American Citizens. That is why our issue is so crucial, and outweighs adoptions by far. In addition, student and business visas serve Chinese citizens who want to study or do business in the U.S.. But family visas are requested by and serve U.S. citizens. Shouldn't our own DOS serve American citizens first? We need to be heard. Please Please Please Write an email or registered letter. Especially if you are one of those who have passed through this gauntlet. The rest of us need your help. maura harty : hartyma@state.gov Her address: 2201 C Street NW Room 6811 Washington DC 20520 202-647-9576