GUANGZHOU WARNING

[JeffandJade]

I disagree,

 

My wife and her family have many stories of thieves taking money, cellphones, purses in China. There is a new method in China where the thief cuts the woman arm (holding the purse) so she moves her arm up in pain - then he snatches it and runs. I, on the otherhand, have family all over the US and not one of my relatives or myself have ever been victoms of any crime. Much as people like to complain about law inforcement in the US, it is far better than the severely understaffed police force in China.

 

Just my 2 cents,

Jeff

[rogerluli]

That is so scary. The 2 hoodlums that mugged my SO had knives but thank god she wasn't cut, but being banged around and bruised is bad enough. She still hurts from it.

[JeffandJade]

Very sorry to hear about that.

 

When my wife was robbed she was taking some money and a gift home to her parents. She works so hard for her money and she was taking it home to help her family. Thanks goodness the guy that robbed her didnt have a knife, but he threw her to the ground and took her purse and ran. She twisted her knee and still limps from the incident. Both her and her sister have had their cellphones stolen also. I think this type of thing is a big problem in China and is only getting worse!

 

Jeff

[rogerluli]

That's terrible what happened to your wife also Jeff. I don't know what China can or will do to stop this kind of thing. I think that's a big part of why my SO wants us to retire to her hometown of Huaihua in Hunan. It just does not have the kind of crime problems that the big cities do.

[JeffandJade]

The scary thing is that this happened in my wifes hometown - Heng Yang in Hunan also. Sadly, I think although crime is more prevalent in the bigger cities in China, it is moving into the small towns as well. I think that until China increases the police force ratio per citizen that things will only get worse. Personally, I feel more safe retiring in Florida than in China and at least for now that is our plan. Thats another 30 years off though for us so who knows..

 

Jeff

[Dan R]

The crime in China today is reminiscent of the American NE rust belt of the 70's.

Infrastructure was decaying. Industry was moving out, unemployment climbing and crime on the rise with police unprepared.

 

China is going through similar changes today.

 

The good news is everything changes, let's hope it is for the better.

[RJZ+JCW]

That's terrible news. I have already committed myself to accompany my SO during the GZ trip. And now, I am more convinced I must go with her. I have spent alot of time in China, and I have had several mugging attempts upon myself, but they quickly realize I am a real street smart SOB with no self control when someone messes with me. I am only scared of machetes in China, which is something the more hardcore guys carry.

 

I agree with JeffandJade, I percieve most places in USA to be safer than China, and I grew up in the Barrio when I was a teenager. Of course it's all relative, some US cities are very bad. But, overall, public safety and public health in the US is better than China, IMO.

[xulei601]

Oregonknl is right. The main (old) train station in Guangzhou is a cesspool. There is a long distance bus station just about a block away, and the short walk from train station to bus station is the most harrowing I've ever taken. I recommend anybody traveling by train to GZ to try to arrive at the East Station. It is new and, as of two years ago, still relatively clean. Plus there are not the endless hordes of people milling around which accounts for much of the theft.

[lele]

That's terrible news. I have already committed myself to accompany my SO during the GZ trip. And now, I am more convinced I must go with her. I have spent alot of time in China, and I have had several mugging attempts upon myself, but they quickly realize I am a real street smart SOB with no self control when someone messes with me. I am only scared of machetes in China, which is something the more hardcore guys carry.

 

I agree with JeffandJade, I percieve most places in USA to be safer than China, and I grew up in the Barrio when I was a teenager. Of course it's all relative, some US cities are very bad. But, overall, public safety and public health in the US is better than China, IMO.

I strongly am sorry to hear about your experiences in China, but I must factually object to your conclusion about China as a whole.

 

It is true that South China has a much higher crime rate than the north, but the absolute murder rate and violent crime rate is far higher in the US than China as a whole.

 

And on a city to city basis, it shows. In Boston, each month, more than 35 people are shot and killed. In Qingdao, a city which is far larger than Boston, Cambridge, and Somerville combined (about 3x the population), the total number of murders is less than 35 a month (and this includes all forms of murder, as compared to just being shot).

 

The rate of violent crime in NYC, and it is much improved today, is still larger than in Beijing (a city which is slightly larger in population than NYC).

 

There are numerous reports by NGOs which will back these statistics which I have observed.

 

However, it all depends on where you are. GZ is dangerous, no doubt it. But, compared with Cleveland, it is quite safe, on a per-person basis...

 

And if you want to see dangerous, I would like to invite you to Bangkok or Manilla, both extremely hyped US tourist destinations...

 

Just my liang fen.

[kfman]

Well Lele... I think america should use the same crime prevention methods as the communist government of china... eye for an eye, litter? chop off the hand. Murder? Dead meat.. etc etc.. and our crime rate would be low too. So on this issue I can agree with you about results, and as a Federal Correctional Officer, I highly support their methods of crime prevention!

 

 

[RJZ+JCW]

That's terrible news. I have already committed myself to accompany my SO during the GZ trip. And now, I am more convinced I must go with her. I have spent alot of time in China, and I have had several mugging attempts upon myself, but they quickly realize I am a real street smart SOB with no self control when someone messes with me. I am only scared of machetes in China, which is something the more hardcore guys carry.

 

I agree with JeffandJade, I percieve most places in USA to be safer than China, and I grew up in the Barrio when I was a teenager. Of course it's all relative, some US cities are very bad. But, overall, public safety and public health in the US is better than China, IMO.

I strongly am sorry to hear about your experiences in China, but I must factually object to your conclusion about China as a whole.

 

It is true that South China has a much higher crime rate than the north, but the absolute murder rate and violent crime rate is far higher in the US than China as a whole.

 

And on a city to city basis, it shows. In Boston, each month, more than 35 people are shot and killed. In Qingdao, a city which is far larger than Boston, Cambridge, and Somerville combined (about 3x the population), the total number of murders is less than 35 a month (and this includes all forms of murder, as compared to just being shot).

 

The rate of violent crime in NYC, and it is much improved today, is still larger than in Beijing (a city which is slightly larger in population than NYC).

 

There are numerous reports by NGOs which will back these statistics which I have observed.

 

However, it all depends on where you are. GZ is dangerous, no doubt it. But, compared with Cleveland, it is quite safe, on a per-person basis...

 

And if you want to see dangerous, I would like to invite you to Bangkok or Manilla, both extremely hyped US tourist destinations...

 

Just my liang fen.

My meaning is "overall" safer. I know some cities in USA are dangerous in certain areas, but I still feel you are more likely to get killed in China by some unforseen event, whether it be violence, epidemic, pollution, or some other form of disaster. Could you imagine the carnage that could happen from a power outage during the summer in a major Chinese city?? Of the many times I have been in the SH train station, or about town, I just can't help but see a ticking time bomb. I have never seen so many pedestrian-vehicle accidents in my life as I have witnessed in China.

 

Old China used to be a safe place where people had high life expectancies. New China is a cut-throat, stressful, heavily polluted and overpopulated place. I would rather drive thru southside Phoenix with my lowrider bumping rap music than be caught up in another SARS scare.

[JeffandJade]

I agree with you RJZ + JCW. I dont feel as safe in China as I do in the US and I have spent roughly a year over there during the past two years.

 

Also bear in mind - the crime statistics reported from communist China which is trying to attract US business in its large cities is likely to be reported as accurately as SARS was by the government in its early stages.

 

 

Jeff

[oregonknl]

A couple of years ago, while crossing from HK to PRC at the border (Lo Wu) I was swarmed by a group of "helpers" and it may be it was an organized attempt ----

 

---- I felt one go for my walet pocket (which was buttoned shut) and swung around to deck the little F--ker, but before I could, a police officer, who I had noted earlier, as sitting bored on his stool, was on the perp in the traditional Chinese law enforcement manner --- grabbing him by the neck and pulling him to the ground..... I kept walking, but the "helpers" backed off significantly after that.... So Chinese law enforcement is alive and well in China, I think, if they witness the crime...... wouldn't want to be in that guys shoes........

 

As I have posted here several time since: DON'T ENTER CHINA AT LO WU!!!

[hypoclear]

Oregonknl is right. The main (old) train station in Guangzhou is a cesspool.  There is a long distance bus station just about a block away, and the short walk from train station to bus station is the most harrowing I've ever taken. I recommend anybody traveling by train to GZ to try to arrive at the East Station. It is new and, as of two years ago, still relatively clean. Plus there are not the endless hordes of people milling around which accounts for much of the theft.

Yes I agree.. but just confused about which station is which. When we travel there from SZ we usually get off at the first stop and just go downstairs to the subway and off to the embassy.

 

VBery easy, safe? for the most part and quick. I have just recxent had the possibality of going to the second stop to get to the hotel close by for my flight back to the states. This was after putting my wife and daughter on a flight just weeks before. we walked by that area and it was a mad house! and we hadn't even gone into the train station.

 

We ended up walk back the other way for a good ways and crossed over to find some cheap noodle shop.. cheap as in not so good tasting.

 

So when I went back to that hotel I said the heck with it and toughted it out and got off at the firststop and took the subway to the NWA ticket office and than on tomthe hotel. People were great and after some half english gestures and a lucky break on the sub.. a woman lawyer from Beijing who spoke english I was fine. soooo the point is.. I at 6 feet tall and 185 lbs and having worked in NYC for 6 years.. took a pass on that place!!

 

Here in SZ what we see mostly is the sleight of hand pickpocket at the bus stops. Also the motorcycle ride bys in some districts. and now and than I read of a physical robbery.

 

You also have the influx of farmers or migrants into the city, who might not have the skills to be gainfully employed and are on the edge and fall over into this and of course the plain oput right thiefs.

 

Mark

[oregonknl]

So true, RMark,

 

I traveled to GZ for several years before experiencing the Main Railway station in Guangzhou, (this last summer to travel to Hunan provience) --- like you. I always got off at the East GZ station, which is clean, linked to the subway, and as far as I can tell, largely crime free....

 

... the Main Railway station is a different world.