New and Confused - Where To Begin?

[Invictus]

Hi, guys... My girlfriend and I would like to start the K1 process this year and I'm a bit confused about our options. We met in China in December 2010 and were together up until February of 2012. Then I left for Europe for a few months and we just spent this summer together, two months to be exact. Now I'm back in New York and she's in Wuhan and we'd like to apply for the K1 right away.

 

What I'd really like to know is what can we do to ensure we have the best possible chance of getting this thing? I have seen some people say it's best to do it all yourself, but bureaucrats make me nervous, no matter how meticulously I fill out their forms and jump through their hoops. The reason I found this forum, actually, was by seeing Marc Ellis' name mentioned frequently when I did searches on this topic, and I traced him back here.

 

Long story short, I'm heavily leaning toward just hiring a good, recommended lawyer and letting him advise and guide us through the process. This way I can concentrate on what I'm doing now (starting a new job) and, also, he can help prepare my girlfriend for the interview, when the time comes.

 

I know this all sounds jumbled. I feel...worried, I guess. I'd just like to find a thread to latch on to so that I can just get this started. Do you guys think, in your experience, that getting a lawyer is a good step? Also, how much would one cost? I've seen prices ranging from $1,000 to $1,500. Also, lawyer fees aside, how much do the actual application processing fees cost on the government's side? That information I haven't been able to find anywhere.

 

Pardon the long post. I really appreciate your advice.

[dnoblett]

Firstly welcome to candle.

 

A question, you were living in China for 2 or more years, and were together for 2 years, then spent 2 months together just this summer, why did you not marry over there and then apply for a spouse CR-1 visa? This is something that may be asked by immigrations.

 

There is about $1000 difference in fees between K-1 and CR-1 process, K-1 has the added $1070 fee to get a green-card, which the CR-1 gets automatically upon arrival in the USA. The K-1 is really for cases where marriage in the USA is the priority, or necessity in cases where getting married overseas is difficult to impossible (Religious, or age issues where this would not be an issue in the USA)

 

Anyway, the length of relationship is in your favor, it is one thing that improves things for getting a visa.

 

Is there anything odd about your case that may cause a denial, like knowing a relative of the prospective immigrant that lives in the states? A good read about possible denial reasons: http://www.ilw.com/a...0323-ellis.shtm

 

In my wife's K-1 case, we did all the paperwork ourselves, in fact did all the paperwork all the way to her naturalization and citizenship 4 years after coming to the USA on a K-1, really it is not that complex, and you have a bigger interest in doing it right than some third party doing it for you. Most lawyers take your money, ask you to provide them all the info to fill in the blanks on the I-129F and G-325A forms used to petition for the visa, many times making mistakes, sometimes small, other times horribly wrong, in many cases, the petitioner if smart looks over the lawyer's shoulder and tripple checks the paperwork finding mistakes. Again only you have the intrest of success, not the lawyer.

 

What some do is contact Marc and explain case to him and ask advise for a fee, and then do their own paperwork. Marc also has a person in Guangzhou who can help beneficiary with preparing for interview at the time of interview.

[warpedbored]

Welcome to CFL. We are like family here. You will get support from people who know what you're going through as well as information on the visa process. Don't be shy about jumping into conversations and asking questions. This site has been here for 10 years and has a wealth of information and experience.

 

The decision as to what kind of visa to apply for is a highly personal one. There are a lot of factors involved. As Dan pointed out a K-1 visa isn't much faster than getting married and filing an I-130 for a CR-1 visa. Also as Dan pointed out it does cost more and you have to wait to adjust status once here in the US. There is however one major advantage to a K-1. If your sweet heart is denied at interview and given a NOIR you still have the option of getting married and starting over. There are no do overs for a CR-1. If denied you have to fight it out to the bitter end which can take years. At this point filing an I-130 would require a trip to China which would negate any savings.

 

As far as attorneys go there are very few I would recommend. At the top of that list is Marc Ellis. He is familiar with how the consulate in GZ works and his assistant in GZ is as knowledgeable about the visa process as it pertains to China as any lawyer. They are a formidable team. Last track I had they had a 100% success rate since they teamed up. I agree with Dan that a consultation with Marc might be a good idea but the main thing to remember with any lawyer is NO ONE CARES MORE ABOUT YOUR VISA THAN YOU DO. A lawyer can fill out the forms, make sure the Ts are crossed and the Is dotted but you still have to do the leg work and gather all the pertinent information yourself. IMO that is the lions share of the work.

 

Do your homework, read every post in the "Ellis' Island" forum and don't be afraid to ask questions. Even if you do hire a lawyer, check double check and triple check their work. Do not become complacent and trust they make no mistakes. I've seen too many nightmare stories where lawyers have screwed things up terribly. One example is a couple where the wife's daughter accompanied her to the US on K-1/ K-2 visas. Their lawyer assured them that it would be OK if the daughter left the country before they finished AOS. The daughter aged out while outside the US and since a K-2 is a single entry visa they now have to wait at least 8 years before the daughter can finally come back.

[Invictus]

A question, you were living in China for 2 or more years, and were together for 2 years, then spent 2 months together just this summer, why did you not marry over there and then apply for a spouse CR-1 visa? This is something that may be asked by immigrations.

 

I read somewhere that a CR-1 takes longer than a K1 and is significantly more difficult because you must give proof of the marriage itself, this is why we didn't get married while there. Did I find wrong or outdated information? If that's the case I will fly back during the holidays and we get married right away.

 

However, something just gave me pause:

 

If your sweet heart is denied at interview and given a NOIR you still have the option of getting married and starting over. There are no do overs for a CR-1. If denied you have to fight it out to the bitter end which can take years.

 

This sounds like a very big risk... Will it really reflect badly on us if we didn't get married during our time together? 'Cause the potential of a denial on a CR-1 makes me very uncomfortable.

Edited September 23, 2012 by Invictus (see edit history)

[dnoblett]

Outdated info... CR-1 and K-1 tend to take within a month or so to process.

 

IMO CR-1 has somewhat less risk of denial than K-1, Being married looks more committed to relationship than a fiancee relationship.

 

In your case the odds of approval look fine either way from what you have posted, 2 years relationship, and then another 2 months over summer. If you can document this you should get a visa with out any issue.

 

Only issue is if there are any red-flags. Such as relationship with beneficiary family living in the states, a recent divorce followed by a quick marriage.

 

In your case truly do not sweet this and do not worry about denial.

 

If it were me in this situation I would be doing the CR-1, even knowing what I know now, more than likely I would have done the CR-1 years ago when I did the K-1.

[Invictus]

No family living in the States, divorces or anything else. Now my next questions become how to document the relationship and, also, if I fly to China to marry her this December, how will we prove we are a "real" married couple, considering we will have never lived together AS a married couple? There will be no joint accounts or credit cards, leases or what have you. Would it look weird to the visa people if I just flew there to marry her for the sake of applying for a CR1?

 

Ugh... I know you said don't sweat it.

 

I think what I should do now is at the very least set up a consultation with Marc, that should help me decide on the right course and finally take the first step.

[dnoblett]

I-130 makes several suggestions as to show relationship, the easiest is to get a couple affidavits from friends and/or family, they do understand the lack of marriage evidence other than a marriage cert in CR-1 visa cases, it is very common.

 

Getting married and filing for a spouse visa is very common, simply provide evidence of the prior relationship leading up to the marriage.

 

The whole point of K-1 is to get married, or CR-1 is to get married and then immigrate, there really is no difference as to the order of operations, get married and get visa or get visa and then get married....

 

Yes, now armed with some info, call Marc and lay it out.

 

If were me doing this, it would be CR-1 all the way, knowing how my wife wanted to immediately take a job shortly after arriving in the USA on a K-1, she could not because a K-1 is essentially a visitor, and cannot take employment until they either have work auth or the green-card, wich can be 4 to 6 months or more after arriving in the USA. A CR-1 can take a job if they wish the very next day after coming to the USA, because the I-551 notation in passport allows them to.

[credzba]

I-130 makes several suggestions as to show relationship, the easiest is to get a couple affidavits from friends and/or family, they do understand the lack of marriage evidence other than a marriage cert in CR-1 visa cases, it is very common.

 

Getting married and filing for a spouse visa is very common, simply provide evidence of the prior relationship leading up to the marriage.

 

The whole point of K-1 is to get married, or CR-1 is to get married and then immigrate, there really is no difference as to the order of operations, get married and get visa or get visa and then get married....

 

Yes, now armed with some info, call Marc and lay it out.

 

If were me doing this, it would be CR-1 all the way, knowing how my wife wanted to immediately take a job shortly after arriving in the USA on a K-1, she could not because a K-1 is essentially a visitor, and cannot take employment until they either have work auth or the green-card, wich can be 4 to 6 months or more after arriving in the USA. A CR-1 can take a job if they wish the very next day after coming to the USA, because the I-551 notation in passport allows them to.

 

I agree with Don.

I did CR/1 5 years ago, and had less time with my wife than you do.

I agree with what Don said about "proving your relationship", but I would state it in the negative terms. I think it is about proving your NOT a fraud, more so than proving you are married.. if that makes sense.

 

I met my wife in person on 1 3 week visit (obviously we had online time previous).

Then I had to return to work in USA.

5 months later we married, and I stayed about 3 weeks.

 

As for "proving the relationship" we had the benefit of intertwined finances that helped.

Utility bills, insurance, even bank accounts can be undone if you really were a fraud.

We bought a house in China and one in America, and both our names were on both houses (because we were married).

It wasn't planned for the visa, just worked out that way, and we had no issues at all with the visa.

 

Also, you have to "prove" your relationship 2 years later (k1 or cr/1) to get 10 year green card.

We had our daughter in public school, and had copies from the school stating we had both been the daughters guardian for the 2 years she had been in school.

 

While we provided all the other pictures, insurance, utilities, even letters from our neighbor and friends (for the 10 year card), I think its was the very strong ties in finances and in the children that made our case easy.

 

So, summary, imo the goal is to prove your NOT a fraud more so than that you are married.

Anything you can do that could not be easily undone (if you were a fraud) is the best.

AND.. the permanent kinds of connections are easiest between a married couple. That is why I also support the CR/1 option.

[Invictus]

Just took a look at the I-130 and the suggestions it offers for proving a relationship do not really apply to us. No joint bank account, credit, tenancy, or property. I did give her money to rent a room before I left a few weeks ago but she rented it and signed for it herself. Imwill wire her the rent in the future, does that help?

 

Also, dnoblett, can you point me to a resource regarding the affidavit that friends and family can sign? Is there an official form for that?

[dnoblett]

It is understood that in cases of a short marriage there will not be any thing that a couple married for some time would have, this is why the visa is a CR-1 (Conditional Resident) visa, the resulting green-card will be valid 2 years, and have to have conditions removed at which time you provide all the marital relationship evidence.

 

Affidavits are sufficient in short marriage cases.

 

Can use these as examples, simply reword the part regarding removal of conditions

 

http://www.visajourn...751_support.doc

http://www.visajourn...1_Affidavit.doc

 

Keep in mind I-130 is designed for many different situations.

• Short marriage light marriage evidence. (Later after 2 years of residency in the USA the marriage evidence would be sent to remove conditions)
  
• Marriage 2 years or longer would need more marriage evidence per the form because the visa is different it is IR-1 woth a no condition green-card when arriving.
  
• I-130 is also used for :
  
  • Parents of a US Citizen (IR-5)
    
  • Step Child of US Citizen (CR-2 or IR-2)
    
  • Sibling of US Citizen
    
  • Child of US Citizen or permanent resident.
    

[Randy W]

we'd like to apply for the K1 right away

 

Why not follow through with your plans? From where you are, THIS is the quickest and cheapest, provides a back-up JUST IN CASE, and is less likely to raise any eye-brows about a quickee marriage trip. You save both money and time by NOT waiting for the marriage trip.

 

Not to discount what the others are saying, but I can't see any benefit to, at this stage, changing your plans for such a minimal-to-no visa benefit when that, in itself, can be a red flag.

Edited September 24, 2012 by Randy W (see edit history)

[david_dawei]

Based on your actual situation, I would agree with Randy... your back in the US and she is in china. This is your reality right now. You have the history.. File K1... YOURSELF. Lawyers often much up the file. As Carl said: nobody cares about your file more than you do... you'll do the best... and ask questions here.

[warpedbored]

You can file K-1 now and get the process started. You can't file an I-130 without going to to China and getting married. As I said before it's a highly personal decision. Don't let me, Dan, Randy, David or anyone else influence your decision. Our job is to give you information so you can make the decision yourself.

[antryg]

The affidavit letters of support, should they come from both US (ie foreign) and Chinese sources? It appears that for Invictus, like myself, his significant other hasn't been to the US so friends and family here can't really comment. It doesn't seem to me that an affidavit that says "he says he's in a commited relationship and that's good enough for me" would be a big help.

[Invictus]

Thank you, every one. We were just discussing this, she and I. I am about to begin a new job, which will be both demanding and time-consuming, and we both also felt a bit "weird" about getting married on the fly this way. Call us romantics, but we didn't want to do it that way, though we would if we had to. Like 大卫 said, this is our reality now.

 

Regarding the AOS, can someone give me some perspective on this, please? At the moment my impression of it is like successfully jumping through a ring of fire (the K-1) only to find you must walk on glass (the AOS). This is why we were considering a CR-1 instead of the K-1. Is the AOS really that bad? If she successfully comes here and we get married are we going to end up haggard from stress and worry because of the AOS process?

 

---

 

Antryg, I love wolves. I think the affidavit from the stateside friend or family member might carry more weight if they not only knew through you that you're together, but if they had communicated with her as well. For example, my mother has spoken with her on Skype numerous times. I even have a photo of them "together,"

 

http://i.imgur.com/WEyX0.jpg

 

Hah!

 

Anyway, others will surely know better than I on this one.

Edited September 24, 2012 by Invictus (see edit history)