About Chinese women who have overstayed...

[DennisLeiqin]

I meet Chinese women almost weekly who've overstayed. When I first meet the woman, I can almost size up her profile just by her age...

 

Most are in their thirties. They leave a teenage child behind in China to be cared for by the child's grandparents. These women may or may not be married and are usually mum or coy about saying whether they are or not. They overcame a sense of hopelessness after their husband’s divorced or abandoned them for another woman. Job opportunities in China are few. Remarrying ‘UP’ is unlikely. Remarrying at all is daunting. And, they know it is difficult and sometimes risky to find a west man through the internet. They also know that if their feet can get on US soil they’ll have a world of opportunities available to them that they’d never have by staying in China.

 

Then there are some overstayed women who are married and their husband’s finance them while the women establish themselves here. These women and these relationships puzzle me. They seem to have little contact with their husbands. Years may pass without seeing each other. The women will frequently QQ with their child, yet I will seldom hear them mention their husbands. Although not rich, they seem to have enough money for the necessities of an apartment, car and sometimes travel without having to work long hours in the Chinese community or work at all. I’m guessing that their husband’s are rich enough to afford to send their wife away while they play…but, that’s just a guess.

 

One thing most of these women have in common is, once here, their desire to stay and live out their lives here. Even with a GC, most will chose to remain here to live while making annual trips back to China for visits. Many have dreams of their child attending a US university. Seldom does that dream come true.

 

Women in China know there is no deportation threat by overstaying. They all know they are free to live here, go to school, graduate, get a drivers license, buy and drive a car, own a home... So, they apply for a visa. Work visas are limited. From my experience, most arrive here on a tourist visa.

Once here they work in the Chinese underground economy. The jobs available to them are nanny, elderly care, cleaning homes, working in restaurants, and massage. There are few options but to work for a Chinese boss who'll expect them to work 12-on 12-off, 7 days a week.

 

I believe that INS prefers that these women adjust their status and become legal. Yet, it's not so easy. Immigration court is an adversary. If these women feel confident that they overstayed for good reason they’ll hire an immigration attorney who will file for AOS and then represent them in immigration court. Those are usually women who arrived on a fiancé visa. Those women have little recourse but to claim they were abused in order to gain legal status.

 

Many who try to scam the system again fail. Those who have a legitimate case pass. Meaning, those who appear before immigration court with a lawyer and a convincing case will often be given the benefit of the doubt. The letter of the immigration law is simply left to the mercy of an immigration judge to decide if the person overstayed for good reason. As in most court cases, it is up to the judge to decide if the testimony is the truth or not.

 

If they do not have a legal case, their only recourse for a GC is to marry a USC.

 

These women tell me they simply want a good man to love them. If the man is a good man they will stay to love and care for him. I have helped many ladies join internet dating sites like Match.com. Some have married. Some have married Chinese men. And, some have married American men. All of them seem to have a happy and contented married life here now. At least, the couples that I have heard through our network of friends have all turned into positive marriages and the couples whom I know and keep in contact with personally too. There are obvious courtship advantages with both persons already here on US soil that one cannot have separated by an ocean, continent and culture.

 

These are simply my antidotal experience from years living among the Chinese community here in Los Angeles. Nothing I say is gospel… simply my opinion.

 

I would appreciate David_D's take on this (as well as other men) who have lived within and among Chinese here in the US.

Edited January 22, 2012 by DennisLeiqin (see edit history)

[tsap seui]

Man, Dennis, you are really getting to see a lot of the whole picture. My wife often reads tales like these to me from the internet, but you are getting to see it first hand. What a dadgum experience, I tells ya.

 

tsap seui

[dnoblett]

My wife and I encountered an overstay a few years ago while vacationing down in the Florida Keys, nice lady, my wife did swap contact info with her.

 

But yes the only easy way to get legal is to marry a US citizen and the adjust, as long as they can provide evidence of legal entry to the USA. AOS from a K-1 if not married to the origional K-1 petitioner can be a bit more problematic though.

[DennisLeiqin]

My wife and I encountered an overstay a few years ago while vacationing down in the Florida Keys, nice lady, my wife did swap contact info with her.

 

But yes the only easy way to get legal is to marry a US citizen and the adjust, as long as they can provide evidence of legal entry to the USA. AOS from a K-1 if not married to the origional K-1 petitioner can be a bit more problematic though.

Here again the word of the law is being shown, yet what is actually enforced is not. ...as long as they can provide evidence of legal entry to the USA. Again, these women are here. The final judgement is given to an immigration judge. These words of the law are lost and become moot when an immigration court and the judge makes her (his) ruling.

[david_dawei]

Gezz gods... it is the post I always wished I had done but could not articulate... We definitely need a round of Er Guo Tou drinking.

 

I was pulled into what I would call a chinese black market or underground and saw more crap than I want to ever explain... the desire to be "here" is without restraint and cause and effect.

 

I am not saying that Dennis classifiies all chinese but he has done an exact job on an exact group. I could tell stories too, but they are not what this website wants to really hear.

 

Here are two current stories... my wife is in contact with two chinese ladies in FL who are ready to leave their husbands... both are only together in a relationship about 6 months or less... They have their plan... the husband has no idea...

[chilton747]

 

 

I am not saying that Dennis classifiies all chinese but he has done an exact job on an exact group. I could tell stories too, but they are not what this website wants to really hear.

 

 

So you are saying that this website is not interested in the truth? I see nothing wrong with it. I have a story or two myself.

[chilton747]

 

 

If they do not have a legal case, their only recourse for a GC is to marry a USC.

 

These women tell me they simply want a good man to love them. If the man is a good man they will stay to love and care for him. I have helped many ladies join internet dating sites like Match.com. Some have married. Some have married Chinese men. And, some have married American men. All of them seem to have a happy and contented married life here now. At least, the couples that I have heard through our network of friends have all turned into positive marriages and the couples whom I know and keep in contact with personally too. There are obvious courtship advantages with both persons already here on US soil that one cannot have separated by an ocean, continent and culture.

 

 

Dennis I say you have done a good service for the women who were honestly looking for someone to love. My hat's off to ya man!!

[david_dawei]

Truth be told... Let's let our hair out with the wind....

 

I have known Dennis for a good number of years and we have shared Er Guo Tou together....

 

When I was 'single' he offered me a choice of women...

 

As Chilton says.. this was a good service he was doing... well... that is if I was a good guy, of course !

 

But this is part of the underground... I've been there... and I am done with it.... well, there are not absolutes in life...

[chilton747]

Truth be told... Let's let our hair out with the wind....

 

I have known Dennis for a good number of years and we have shared Er Guo Tou together....

 

When I was 'single' he offered me a choice of women...

 

As Chilton says.. this was a good service he was doing... well... that is if I was a good guy, of course !

 

But this is part of the underground... I've been there... and I am done with it.... well, there are not absolutes in life...

 

Please continue...

[DennisLeiqin]

Truth be told... Let's let our hair out with the wind....

 

I have known Dennis for a good number of years and we have shared Er Guo Tou together....

 

When I was 'single' he offered me a choice of women...

 

As Chilton says.. this was a good service he was doing... well... that is if I was a good guy, of course !

 

But this is part of the underground... I've been there... and I am done with it.... well, there are not absolutes in life...

 

Please continue...

Yes, David's post seems to imply that I have 'offered' up women to him, as if I am some pimp. Not sure what he meant by that, as I have never 'offered' anyone and I have never known David when he was 'single'.

[david_dawei]

Let's cut to the chase... Anyone out there 'knows' of someone who would like to meet someone... Let's not make this out to be more than it is... but I feel I could explain more about the underground culture which is 'available'... but let's leave it at a common sense understanding.

[knloregon]

"..Women in China know there is no deportation threat by overstaying. .." Not, apparently, if its a student visa. know two cases where Chinese have expired student visas, and are hunted down like dogs, and deported. Part of the student visa process (post 911) was the addition of significant fees to track foreign students in America (one of the reasons many Chinese liked Australia better than the US for grad. school after 911) -- the upshot was that ICE now has the resources to track foreign students.

 

My advice to Chinese in the US illegally would be to wait for the (political) solution extended to the Mexicans---which surely will come---and ride the coat-tails. I can't imagine that Congress can write an amnesty package so narrowly that it excludes Chinese illegals, while including Mexican illegals, but I can't for the life of me, cite a logical reason----given the long history of the Chinese Exclusion Acts --- beginning in the 1880's and extending (to some extent) to the present day. ---and come to think of it---11 states allow in-state tuition for Mexican nationals ---but (effectively) no other nationally.

[DennisLeiqin]

"..Women in China know there is no deportation threat by overstaying. .." Not, apparently, if its a student visa. know two cases where Chinese have expired student visas, and are hunted down like dogs, and deported. Part of the student visa process (post 911) was the addition of significant fees to track foreign students in America (one of the reasons many Chinese liked Australia better than the US for grad. school after 911) -- the upshot was that ICE now has the resources to track foreign students.

 

My advice to Chinese in the US illegally would be to wait for the (political) solution extended to the Mexicans---which surely will come---and ride the coat-tails. I can't imagine that Congress can write an amnesty package so narrowly that it excludes Chinese illegals, while including Mexican illegals, but I can't for the life of me, cite a logical reason----given the long history of the Chinese Exclusion Acts --- beginning in the 1880's and extending (to some extent) to the present day. ---and come to think of it---11 states allow in-state tuition for Mexican nationals ---but (effectively) no other nationally.

Hunted down like dogs? What do you have to back that up? I have yet to see any Chinese being deported. Period. Yes, there are deportation buses to Mexico. Are there deportatin plane flights to China? No, there are not. Like it or not, these Chinese women know that once they are here they can stay without impunity. IMO the problem is not the enforcement of those who overstay, but at the front end of allowing those who fit a certain profile to gain a visa in the first place.

[Randy W]

"..Women in China know there is no deportation threat by overstaying. .." Not, apparently, if its a student visa. know two cases where Chinese have expired student visas, and are hunted down like dogs, and deported. Part of the student visa process (post 911) was the addition of significant fees to track foreign students in America (one of the reasons many Chinese liked Australia better than the US for grad. school after 911) -- the upshot was that ICE now has the resources to track foreign students.

 

My advice to Chinese in the US illegally would be to wait for the (political) solution extended to the Mexicans---which surely will come---and ride the coat-tails. I can't imagine that Congress can write an amnesty package so narrowly that it excludes Chinese illegals, while including Mexican illegals, but I can't for the life of me, cite a logical reason----given the long history of the Chinese Exclusion Acts --- beginning in the 1880's and extending (to some extent) to the present day. ---and come to think of it---11 states allow in-state tuition for Mexican nationals ---but (effectively) no other nationally.

Hunted down like dogs? What do you have to back that up? I have yet to see any Chinese being deported. Period. Yes, there are deportation buses to Mexico. Are there deportatin plane flights to China? No, there are not. Like it or not, these Chinese women know that once they are here they can stay without impunity. IMO the problem is not the enforcement of those who overstay, but at the front end of allowing those who fit a certain profile to gain a visa in the first place.

 

Read my timeline, Dennis. Sorry if you don't see these things, but some of us do.

 

Yes, you can overstay a visa, NOT apply for AOS or ANYTHING ELSE and fall through the cracks (like perhaps most people do), but if your paperwork falls on the wrong person's desk at the wrong time - well, maybe you can ignore THOSE orders, too.

 

Then again, there ARE people that they DO go after. I was on a "deportation flight" with one of them, as I've stated before.

 

It's unclear what your reticence is - you seem to be aware of immigration court. There are undergrounds, middle grounds, and plenty of people who are completely above board.

Edited January 22, 2012 by Randy W (see edit history)

[DennisLeiqin]

"..Women in China know there is no deportation threat by overstaying. .." Not, apparently, if its a student visa. know two cases where Chinese have expired student visas, and are hunted down like dogs, and deported. Part of the student visa process (post 911) was the addition of significant fees to track foreign students in America (one of the reasons many Chinese liked Australia better than the US for grad. school after 911) -- the upshot was that ICE now has the resources to track foreign students.

 

My advice to Chinese in the US illegally would be to wait for the (political) solution extended to the Mexicans---which surely will come---and ride the coat-tails. I can't imagine that Congress can write an amnesty package so narrowly that it excludes Chinese illegals, while including Mexican illegals, but I can't for the life of me, cite a logical reason----given the long history of the Chinese Exclusion Acts --- beginning in the 1880's and extending (to some extent) to the present day. ---and come to think of it---11 states allow in-state tuition for Mexican nationals ---but (effectively) no other nationally.

Hunted down like dogs? What do you have to back that up? I have yet to see any Chinese being deported. Period. Yes, there are deportation buses to Mexico. Are there deportatin plane flights to China? No, there are not. Like it or not, these Chinese women know that once they are here they can stay without impunity. IMO the problem is not the enforcement of those who overstay, but at the front end of allowing those who fit a certain profile to gain a visa in the first place.

 

Read my timeline, Dennis. Sorry if you don't see these things, but some of us do.

 

Yes, you can overstay a visa, NOT apply for AOS or ANYTHING ELSE and fall through the cracks (like perhaps most people do), but if your paperwork falls on the wrong person's desk at the wrong time - well, maybe you can ignore THOSE orders, too.

 

Then again, there ARE people that they DO go after. I was on a "deportation flight" with one of them, as I've stated before.

 

It's unclear what your reticence is - you seem to be aware of immigration court. There are undergrounds, middle grounds, and plenty of people who are completely above board.

I am not saying that deportation does not exist for Chinese. However, I am saying that in my 7 years here living among and knowing many Chinese who are undocumented they live life relatively free of reprisal and fear of deportation. I have yet to meet one who has either been given notice of deportation nor been deported. What does that say?

 

And I will add, why is it common knowledge among Chinese women that they can come here, overstay, go to school, get a driver license, buy and drive a car, own a home without fear of deportation? Why is this so difficult for some of you to realize the truth of what's going on? Why do you insist that USCIS have some deportation gestapo in place when there isn't? Facts are facts. Reality is what it is. Like it or not. This is what our immigration policy has allowed.

 

So, you have seen one person being deported on a flight that you were on. And that overrules all the many undocumented women who continue to live here free and without fear of reprisal? That's just silly.

Edited January 22, 2012 by DennisLeiqin (see edit history)