Atty Roth's GUZ Complaint

[fishin]

we should plan a date with the same letter and we all submit at one time to same people.. what do you guys think.....

 

 

Good idea, but depends on the amount of participation. Ten or more would be effective.

 

 

my name is rich. my fiancee and i got pretty much the same treatment by guz. the interview as far as my fiancee and her daughter relayed to me was a farce. they asked for a dna test and my marriage and financial information again. of course they already had every official document known to man. the dna was new and expensive of course. sent it all back and then they ultimately said we had a non bonafide relationship. i've visited 3 times in less than 3 years. we are trying for a k1 visa which i now think was a mistake that was recommended to us by our attorney but anyway we more than covered all the bases. daily contact for 3 years, cards letters, everything well past all their requirements.

 

i'd be happy to go after them in any way i could. they recently sent a letter to my fiancee saying that the file had been returned to cis. it took them 2 months to realize that they had received all the information, dna etc., after the interview and i believe that the only reason they even realized it then was because i emailed them to look into the status. they wrote back that they had only just received the information even though i had proof of them signing for the package 2 months earlier.

 

i have never in my 59 years experienced a level of such incompetence as with my guz experience. i think a patethic excuse for a government bureaucracy might approach describing their behavior.

 

i was for the first time in my life embarrased to be an american in trying to explain to my fiancee and her daughter how such seemingly utter disdain for a persons rights could stand for american values.

 

can anyone give me an idea of how long it may take to actually get an official explanation of why they really said no beyond non bonified relationship. how can an opinion on their part, non bonified relation, stand against thousand of pages of facts most of which can stand in a court of law?

 

they do indeed believe it is obvious that they are above the rule of law.

 

it really took the cake for me when i relayed the bad news to our attorney and was told that the best thing to do was reapply and of course pay another $455.00 fee so that whichever came up first, the new interview or the appeal, which they said were never successful, would take precedence. sounds like double taxation to me. how can they allow a new case to begin without resolution of the original one being completed. sounds like a complete disregard for due process?

 

anyway, if i were to marry her now and start a k3 i would have to close the k1 application which would then mean that i would never get an explanation and would be going in completely blind to any facts they may think they have?

 

you tell me how best i can help including going to washington and i'll gladly comply. strength in numbers is never a bad idea.

 

thanks.

 

rich and guiling and tingting.

[Randy W]

Doctrine of Consular Nonreviewability - http://www.aaup.org/...FINAL080108.pdf

 

see Immigration Litigation Bulletin Aug. 2006, pg. 5 - http://www.usdoj.gov...August_2006.pdf

 

The INA contains no provision for the judicial review of a consular officer's visa determination

 

They ARE above the law, to a degree - the denial is final.

 

When your case is back in the states, you can file a Freedom of Information, which may or may not reveal anything useful. There will likely be no other activity on your case.

 

For your next filing, there will need to be something different, hopefully to address the reasons for your denial. Consider marriage, and filing an I-130 for a CR-1 visa, and a different attorney, who can look at all details of your case to analyze what went wrong. In cases like this, Marc Ellis's name usually comes up.

 

More than a few people have followed this path.

Edited November 16, 2009 by Randy W (see edit history)

[Kyle]

If you need an attorney, we're using Carol Armstrong with our I-130. She's been great (Attention to detail, consistent contact through email and phone - we're in China. Knowledgeable of the process, extremely personable - she makes it feel more like a family relationship than a legal one)

 

http://armstrongvisalaw.com/

Edited November 17, 2009 by Kyle (see edit history)

[heyjimi]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

[fishin]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

 

i think from your description my fiancee had the same witch for her interview. nothing about myself and fiancee just focused on her daughter trying to trip her up with questions like implying that she was my fiancees sister not daughter. of course they weren't confused and answered properly. it is a joke. at the least it is un-american and certainly their conduct is immoral in my eyes.

 

i guess over time the job may make them that way? i couldn't have a job such as that. i wouldn't last a week before i got relieved for refusing to treat all people with respect and dignity.

 

don't you wonder why the two of you are never permitted to either be at the ACH or lord forbid the interview, that way there would be a witness to their attrocities i guess. their entire process is set up to exclude any outside scrutiny thus is guaranteed to be abusive at a minimum.

 

i wanted to ask you about the CR1? I am not familiar with it. what is involved and what is the prupose of that route say versus a K3?

 

if i knew then what i know now i would do three things differently:

 

1) I would have gone to Guangzhou and attended the ACH and made my presence known. i'm certain it is not allowed to ask any real questions or maybe that you will receive any real answers. even though i had an attorney it was never mentioned to me as an option?

 

2) it was recommended that we should go for a K1 as it was supposed to be quicker and more easily approved. I would upon hindsight gotten married and went the K3 route.

 

3) i would have waited a little longer to go to China the first time as it was in your case very close to the separation from my ex and when it was finally granted more than a year and a half later officially.

 

i don't understand how any of these things should matter. the facts should speak for themselves. to be honest i'm not sure if i have the finances to start all over again?

 

everything the interviewer needed was with the first submittal. she asked for more about my marriage documents and financial information which of course they already had. the dna request was totally off base i believe. a stalling tactic for sure.

 

have you ever seen the movie Uncle Buck? if you get the chance i see a similarity between the interviewer and the principal that uncle buck confronts. after being denied at the initial interview and then again based on the additional information i always think of that when i think oh her even though i have never met her. these people in their seeming disdain for human beings can't help but bring out these types of reactions and sterotypes.

 

take care.

 

rich

[Guest Pommey]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

 

i think from your description my fiancee had the same witch for her interview. nothing about myself and fiancee just focused on her daughter trying to trip her up with questions like implying that she was my fiancees sister not daughter. of course they weren't confused and answered properly. it is a joke. at the least it is un-american and certainly their conduct is immoral in my eyes.

 

i guess over time the job may make them that way? i couldn't have a job such as that. i wouldn't last a week before i got relieved for refusing to treat all people with respect and dignity.

 

don't you wonder why the two of you are never permitted to either be at the ACH or lord forbid the interview, that way there would be a witness to their attrocities i guess. their entire process is set up to exclude any outside scrutiny thus is guaranteed to be abusive at a minimum.

 

i wanted to ask you about the CR1? I am not familiar with it. what is involved and what is the prupose of that route say versus a K3?

 

if i knew then what i know now i would do three things differently:

 

1) I would have gone to Guangzhou and attended the ACH and made my presence known. i'm certain it is not allowed to ask any real questions or maybe that you will receive any real answers. even though i had an attorney it was never mentioned to me as an option?

 

2) it was recommended that we should go for a K1 as it was supposed to be quicker and more easily approved. I would upon hindsight gotten married and went the K3 route.

 

3) i would have waited a little longer to go to China the first time as it was in your case very close to the separation from my ex and when it was finally granted more than a year and a half later officially.

 

i don't understand how any of these things should matter. the facts should speak for themselves. to be honest i'm not sure if i have the finances to start all over again?

 

everything the interviewer needed was with the first submittal. she asked for more about my marriage documents and financial information which of course they already had. the dna request was totally off base i believe. a stalling tactic for sure.

 

have you ever seen the movie Uncle Buck? if you get the chance i see a similarity between the interviewer and the principal that uncle buck confronts. after being denied at the initial interview and then again based on the additional information i always think of that when i think oh her even though i have never met her. these people in their seeming disdain for human beings can't help but bring out these types of reactions and sterotypes.

 

take care.

 

rich

 

Rich,

There are hundreds of threads of folks who got screwed by GUZ , sometimes GUZ is a ass sometimes Folks dont prepare carefully, of course all blame GUZ for the outcome.

[heyjimi]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

 

i think from your description my fiancee had the same witch for her interview. nothing about myself and fiancee just focused on her daughter trying to trip her up with questions like implying that she was my fiancees sister not daughter. of course they weren't confused and answered properly. it is a joke. at the least it is un-american and certainly their conduct is immoral in my eyes.

 

i guess over time the job may make them that way? i couldn't have a job such as that. i wouldn't last a week before i got relieved for refusing to treat all people with respect and dignity.

 

don't you wonder why the two of you are never permitted to either be at the ACH or lord forbid the interview, that way there would be a witness to their attrocities i guess. their entire process is set up to exclude any outside scrutiny thus is guaranteed to be abusive at a minimum.

 

i wanted to ask you about the CR1? I am not familiar with it. what is involved and what is the prupose of that route say versus a K3?

 

if i knew then what i know now i would do three things differently:

 

1) I would have gone to Guangzhou and attended the ACH and made my presence known. i'm certain it is not allowed to ask any real questions or maybe that you will receive any real answers. even though i had an attorney it was never mentioned to me as an option?

 

2) it was recommended that we should go for a K1 as it was supposed to be quicker and more easily approved. I would upon hindsight gotten married and went the K3 route.

 

3) i would have waited a little longer to go to China the first time as it was in your case very close to the separation from my ex and when it was finally granted more than a year and a half later officially.

 

i don't understand how any of these things should matter. the facts should speak for themselves. to be honest i'm not sure if i have the finances to start all over again?

 

everything the interviewer needed was with the first submittal. she asked for more about my marriage documents and financial information which of course they already had. the dna request was totally off base i believe. a stalling tactic for sure.

 

have you ever seen the movie Uncle Buck? if you get the chance i see a similarity between the interviewer and the principal that uncle buck confronts. after being denied at the initial interview and then again based on the additional information i always think of that when i think oh her even though i have never met her. these people in their seeming disdain for human beings can't help but bring out these types of reactions and sterotypes.

 

take care.

 

rich

 

Next time you go to China and you arrive at the airport,theres always a nice gentle Chinese woman or polite Chinese man to greet you,When you arrive in an American airport,your greeted with an attitude "get in line...your in the wrong line... O V E R H E R E !!!!!! We went to get my wifes SSN card,and had a woman with a big time freakin attitude....anyway....it sounds like you had some similar issues.

Get married and do the k3 or cr1 because waiting for the k1 to return back to the states,going to take some time.and a lawyer....do you really want to know my opinion on them? hahaha.anyway, Address all the issues you think might have led to your '"NON BONAFIDE RELATIONSHIP"address it up front in your k3 or cr1....I think the cr1 is better,but takes a little longer so it has been said....my wife actually ended up with the IR1 because when she entered USA,we were already married 2 years,and so she got her 10 year green card.Also,i really do believe being there at Guz for her interview makes a big difference,I am not saying it is a guareentee a visa,but really it just makes sense to be there.At the ACH,I must say I had a very pleasant male VO,allowed me to ask all my questions,did not blow me off,was very attentive,typed alot of it into the computer......also from the description my wife gave me of her VO,it sounded like the guy i had.So the second time around for my wife,was a pleasant experience.quick interview.anyway,good luck whatever you decide to do.

 

Jimi

[fishin]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

 

i think from your description my fiancee had the same witch for her interview. nothing about myself and fiancee just focused on her daughter trying to trip her up with questions like implying that she was my fiancees sister not daughter. of course they weren't confused and answered properly. it is a joke. at the least it is un-american and certainly their conduct is immoral in my eyes.

 

i guess over time the job may make them that way? i couldn't have a job such as that. i wouldn't last a week before i got relieved for refusing to treat all people with respect and dignity.

 

don't you wonder why the two of you are never permitted to either be at the ACH or lord forbid the interview, that way there would be a witness to their attrocities i guess. their entire process is set up to exclude any outside scrutiny thus is guaranteed to be abusive at a minimum.

 

i wanted to ask you about the CR1? I am not familiar with it. what is involved and what is the prupose of that route say versus a K3?

 

if i knew then what i know now i would do three things differently:

 

1) I would have gone to Guangzhou and attended the ACH and made my presence known. i'm certain it is not allowed to ask any real questions or maybe that you will receive any real answers. even though i had an attorney it was never mentioned to me as an option?

 

2) it was recommended that we should go for a K1 as it was supposed to be quicker and more easily approved. I would upon hindsight gotten married and went the K3 route.

 

3) i would have waited a little longer to go to China the first time as it was in your case very close to the separation from my ex and when it was finally granted more than a year and a half later officially.

 

i don't understand how any of these things should matter. the facts should speak for themselves. to be honest i'm not sure if i have the finances to start all over again?

 

everything the interviewer needed was with the first submittal. she asked for more about my marriage documents and financial information which of course they already had. the dna request was totally off base i believe. a stalling tactic for sure.

 

have you ever seen the movie Uncle Buck? if you get the chance i see a similarity between the interviewer and the principal that uncle buck confronts. after being denied at the initial interview and then again based on the additional information i always think of that when i think oh her even though i have never met her. these people in their seeming disdain for human beings can't help but bring out these types of reactions and sterotypes.

 

take care.

 

rich

 

Next time you go to China and you arrive at the airport,theres always a nice gentle Chinese woman or polite Chinese man to greet you,When you arrive in an American airport,your greeted with an attitude "get in line...your in the wrong line... O V E R H E R E !!!!!! We went to get my wifes SSN card,and had a woman with a big time freakin attitude....anyway....it sounds like you had some similar issues.

Get married and do the k3 or cr1 because waiting for the k1 to return back to the states,going to take some time.and a lawyer....do you really want to know my opinion on them? hahaha.anyway, Address all the issues you think might have led to your '"NON BONAFIDE RELATIONSHIP"address it up front in your k3 or cr1....I think the cr1 is better,but takes a little longer so it has been said....my wife actually ended up with the IR1 because when she entered USA,we were already married 2 years,and so she got her 10 year green card.Also,i really do believe being there at Guz for her interview makes a big difference,I am not saying it is a guareentee a visa,but really it just makes sense to be there.At the ACH,I must say I had a very pleasant male VO,allowed me to ask all my questions,did not blow me off,was very attentive,typed alot of it into the computer......also from the description my wife gave me of her VO,it sounded like the guy i had.So the second time around for my wife,was a pleasant experience.quick interview.anyway,good luck whatever you decide to do.

 

Jimi

 

 

Jimi;

 

Thanks for all your help and thanks also to all who have and will respond.

 

I said earlier that I would change three thigs and do them differently. I had forgotten that I would be a regular on this site. so much information and peoples first hand experience. caring real people just like guiling and i.

 

i as well will skip an attorney this time other than perhaps a consultation over the whole process and tips in regard to the details.

 

i don't have a thing really against my attorney it's just a crap-shoot?

 

I agree with you and have believed it since the denial and request for more information after my fiancees interview last december. It was fully determined and dictated who would and who would not get appoved.

 

i do not believe that it was a coincidence that while my fiancee and her daughter were waiting at the embassy for their interview and they were there early. every person who went into the room with the male vo came out passed. every single individual that came out of the female vo's room failed or needed more information.

 

the interview was just to go thru the formality and hone in on a reason to deny it. in our case use the daughter to request a dna test to prove she was my fiancee's real daughter.

 

one of two possibilities i believe. one: delay and deny approval by requesting a totally unnecessary test. not to mention very expensive.

 

two: some lowlife scammers or worse were able to con them and get some people thru before they caught on. a cousin in place of a daughter who knows? so now the typical bureaucratic reaction is to make all honest hardworking everyday people have an expensive and unnecessary test while the scammers have moved on to some new loophole.

 

anyway, thanks again for all the help. i'll look up the CR and IR information to decide what may be the best way for us to proceed.

 

after bad wrapping them on this site we probably have no chance of getting approved.

 

i read on here that perhaps the consulate people look in on here to get a feel for what people are thinking and hopefully experiencing so that they get a real sense of what their actions truly mean to us in real terms of being needlessly kept apart from our loved one.

 

if they are then i'm sure they know how i feel about the process.

 

i hope they feel the same way and work to change it.

 

if it was my job i would be working and finding ways to get it back thru the chain of command to get it fixed.

 

there are plenty of people here in the states that want it. that would support fair change.

 

how can they stand in front of the news cameras and tell people follow the rules do it right and legal and then you get chewed to bits by the system. how can you face people and tell them don't sneak over the border, when in the next breath you are talking about granting amnesty to all of those individuals that have not followed the rules. what justice for us that have?

 

if it was me i'd probably do anything i could to get here.

 

i don't have a thing against the people who have. if i stand a diminished chance what chance would they have?

 

 

take care and god bless you all.

 

rich

[splinterman]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

 

i think from your description my fiancee had the same witch for her interview. nothing about myself and fiancee just focused on her daughter trying to trip her up with questions like implying that she was my fiancees sister not daughter. of course they weren't confused and answered properly. it is a joke. at the least it is un-american and certainly their conduct is immoral in my eyes.

 

i guess over time the job may make them that way? i couldn't have a job such as that. i wouldn't last a week before i got relieved for refusing to treat all people with respect and dignity.

 

don't you wonder why the two of you are never permitted to either be at the ACH or lord forbid the interview, that way there would be a witness to their attrocities i guess. their entire process is set up to exclude any outside scrutiny thus is guaranteed to be abusive at a minimum.

 

i wanted to ask you about the CR1? I am not familiar with it. what is involved and what is the prupose of that route say versus a K3?

 

if i knew then what i know now i would do three things differently:

 

1) I would have gone to Guangzhou and attended the ACH and made my presence known. i'm certain it is not allowed to ask any real questions or maybe that you will receive any real answers. even though i had an attorney it was never mentioned to me as an option?

 

2) it was recommended that we should go for a K1 as it was supposed to be quicker and more easily approved. I would upon hindsight gotten married and went the K3 route.

 

3) i would have waited a little longer to go to China the first time as it was in your case very close to the separation from my ex and when it was finally granted more than a year and a half later officially.

 

i don't understand how any of these things should matter. the facts should speak for themselves. to be honest i'm not sure if i have the finances to start all over again?

 

everything the interviewer needed was with the first submittal. she asked for more about my marriage documents and financial information which of course they already had. the dna request was totally off base i believe. a stalling tactic for sure.

 

have you ever seen the movie Uncle Buck? if you get the chance i see a similarity between the interviewer and the principal that uncle buck confronts. after being denied at the initial interview and then again based on the additional information i always think of that when i think oh her even though i have never met her. these people in their seeming disdain for human beings can't help but bring out these types of reactions and sterotypes.

 

take care.

 

rich

 

Next time you go to China and you arrive at the airport,theres always a nice gentle Chinese woman or polite Chinese man to greet you,When you arrive in an American airport,your greeted with an attitude "get in line...your in the wrong line... O V E R H E R E !!!!!! We went to get my wifes SSN card,and had a woman with a big time freakin attitude....anyway....it sounds like you had some similar issues.

Get married and do the k3 or cr1 because waiting for the k1 to return back to the states,going to take some time.and a lawyer....do you really want to know my opinion on them? hahaha.anyway, Address all the issues you think might have led to your '"NON BONAFIDE RELATIONSHIP"address it up front in your k3 or cr1....I think the cr1 is better,but takes a little longer so it has been said....my wife actually ended up with the IR1 because when she entered USA,we were already married 2 years,and so she got her 10 year green card.Also,i really do believe being there at Guz for her interview makes a big difference,I am not saying it is a guareentee a visa,but really it just makes sense to be there.At the ACH,I must say I had a very pleasant male VO,allowed me to ask all my questions,did not blow me off,was very attentive,typed alot of it into the computer......also from the description my wife gave me of her VO,it sounded like the guy i had.So the second time around for my wife,was a pleasant experience.quick interview.anyway,good luck whatever you decide to do.

 

Jimi

 

 

Jimi;

 

Thanks for all your help and thanks also to all who have and will respond.

 

I said earlier that I would change three thigs and do them differently. I had forgotten that I would be a regular on this site. so much information and peoples first hand experience. caring real people just like guiling and i.

 

i as well will skip an attorney this time other than perhaps a consultation over the whole process and tips in regard to the details.

 

i don't have a thing really against my attorney it's just a crap-shoot?

 

I agree with you and have believed it since the denial and request for more information after my fiancees interview last december. It was fully determined and dictated who would and who would not get appoved.

 

i do not believe that it was a coincidence that while my fiancee and her daughter were waiting at the embassy for their interview and they were there early. every person who went into the room with the male vo came out passed. every single individual that came out of the female vo's room failed or needed more information.

 

the interview was just to go thru the formality and hone in on a reason to deny it. in our case use the daughter to request a dna test to prove she was my fiancee's real daughter.

 

one of two possibilities i believe. one: delay and deny approval by requesting a totally unnecessary test. not to mention very expensive.

 

two: some lowlife scammers or worse were able to con them and get some people thru before they caught on. a cousin in place of a daughter who knows? so now the typical bureaucratic reaction is to make all honest hardworking everyday people have an expensive and unnecessary test while the scammers have moved on to some new loophole.

 

anyway, thanks again for all the help. i'll look up the CR and IR information to decide what may be the best way for us to proceed.

 

after bad wrapping them on this site we probably have no chance of getting approved.

 

i read on here that perhaps the consulate people look in on here to get a feel for what people are thinking and hopefully experiencing so that they get a real sense of what their actions truly mean to us in real terms of being needlessly kept apart from our loved one.

 

if they are then i'm sure they know how i feel about the process.

 

i hope they feel the same way and work to change it.

 

if it was my job i would be working and finding ways to get it back thru the chain of command to get it fixed.

 

there are plenty of people here in the states that want it. that would support fair change.

 

how can they stand in front of the news cameras and tell people follow the rules do it right and legal and then you get chewed to bits by the system. how can you face people and tell them don't sneak over the border, when in the next breath you are talking about granting amnesty to all of those individuals that have not followed the rules. what justice for us that have?

 

if it was me i'd probably do anything i could to get here.

 

i don't have a thing against the people who have. if i stand a diminished chance what chance would they have?

 

 

take care and god bless you all.

 

rich

 

 

Rich,

From more than just a few folks comes a statistic that 8 out of 10 couples break up after a denial. Even if that number isn't accurate I believe that it DOES play a part in GUZ's decisions. Especially where you have a case where there is a quick meeting after a divorce, a short courtship before a marriage/proposal and the subsequent petition being filed. I believe that GUZ simply finds a reason to send the P&B back to the 'Drawing Board' knowing that it will take up to another year, and sometimes longer, for the P7B to get back to the stage of another interview. I'm sure they'd like to see if you are one of the couples who have a meltdown because of the denial.

I would suggest to you that you consider another K-1 filing due to the ease of your fiancee's daughter being included in the K-1 petition process-I don't think you'll have to file much additional paperwork to include her in her mother's visa, and that is the biggest benefit to going back along the K-1 route.

But if you prefer, you can go the CR-1/K3 route with the CR-1 giving you the advantage of being able to electronically file your petition through the National Visa Center and it will cut about 2-3 months off the entire process. It also is cheaper to go the CR-1 route as you will not have to pay the Adjustment of Status fee of approximately $1010 if she gets the visa and comes to the US. Look into it.

In the meantime, plan your next petition filing carefully. Make at least another trip and document everything, right down to the taxi car receipts. Take bunches of pictures with you and your new family that have a time/date stamp ON the photos, and in many different places. Print the chat logs if you guys talk online, get copies of the phone call logs, keep copies of the emails you send between you both, etc. PROVE the bona fide of your relationship!

Maybe that doesn't seem like such clear advice right now to you because you are still angry about how they have treated you (we got a white slip also so I know the things you are feeling). Don't waste your time on trying to get your congressmen or representatives involved-they're useless, except for making periodic inquiries into the status of your returned petition. Forget the Freedom of Information Act requests as they will take almost a year and all you will get are copies of the I-129F that you filed, and a DOS/DHS letter saying 'we have more than this but we won't give it to you because it involves a visa refusal, and we don't have to cough that up...'.

Attention To Detail is what you will have to begin thinking as you put together your next petition. Document everything about your relationship.

You'll be ok. Some people just take longer to get their visas than others, and your time will come.

If you have any questions you're welcmoe to PM me.

 

 

Splinterman

[fishin]

I been down this road before.By the way,i dont know where you stand on health care,but this is the same government that wants to run health care,very,very scary.This whole immigration process is a complete joke.My wife was k3 had her first interview in october 2008.She had an interview with a very nasty woman.My wife had every document and proof of a bonafide relationship known to man,the only thing missing was a video tape of us in the bedroom,i mean i know i am being absurd,but this whole thing is absurd.This woman harped on my wife about my wifes daughter in a photograph,asked how old my daughter was,my wife said 21,the VO said your lying she looks like shes no more than 15......see this VO had a crstall ball could see all things,she did not want to see the birth certificate,because why? To be honest,i was and still am ashamed to be an american,Gods honest truth.Now this is my opinion,but i am a believer,my wife was already denied before she even had her interview.Looking over our file,we had a few flags,one was my divorce,close to the time i began writing to my wife,and a quick marriage,we got married on my first visit.I felt nothing wrong with this,but i had to see...what was it they were seeing...... So on our next try at an interview i went cr1,i did address these issues up front.I also went to ACH and brought these issues up to the VO which i think really played a role in my wife passing her second interview which was in June 2009.To answer your question about how long it takes for it to get to usa (your file).Well as of yet i have heard nothing on my k3 (denied)case. In August of 2009,i did get an email stating USCIS had just recieved our K3 file for review.i might not hear anything now anyway since my wife was approved on her cr1.but as you can see it took 10 months to get from Guz to USCIS.maybe what you ought to do, get married and refile for k3 or do the cr1 if you can.

 

i think from your description my fiancee had the same witch for her interview. nothing about myself and fiancee just focused on her daughter trying to trip her up with questions like implying that she was my fiancees sister not daughter. of course they weren't confused and answered properly. it is a joke. at the least it is un-american and certainly their conduct is immoral in my eyes.

 

i guess over time the job may make them that way? i couldn't have a job such as that. i wouldn't last a week before i got relieved for refusing to treat all people with respect and dignity.

 

don't you wonder why the two of you are never permitted to either be at the ACH or lord forbid the interview, that way there would be a witness to their attrocities i guess. their entire process is set up to exclude any outside scrutiny thus is guaranteed to be abusive at a minimum.

 

i wanted to ask you about the CR1? I am not familiar with it. what is involved and what is the prupose of that route say versus a K3?

 

if i knew then what i know now i would do three things differently:

 

1) I would have gone to Guangzhou and attended the ACH and made my presence known. i'm certain it is not allowed to ask any real questions or maybe that you will receive any real answers. even though i had an attorney it was never mentioned to me as an option?

 

2) it was recommended that we should go for a K1 as it was supposed to be quicker and more easily approved. I would upon hindsight gotten married and went the K3 route.

 

3) i would have waited a little longer to go to China the first time as it was in your case very close to the separation from my ex and when it was finally granted more than a year and a half later officially.

 

i don't understand how any of these things should matter. the facts should speak for themselves. to be honest i'm not sure if i have the finances to start all over again?

 

everything the interviewer needed was with the first submittal. she asked for more about my marriage documents and financial information which of course they already had. the dna request was totally off base i believe. a stalling tactic for sure.

 

have you ever seen the movie Uncle Buck? if you get the chance i see a similarity between the interviewer and the principal that uncle buck confronts. after being denied at the initial interview and then again based on the additional information i always think of that when i think oh her even though i have never met her. these people in their seeming disdain for human beings can't help but bring out these types of reactions and sterotypes.

 

take care.

 

rich

 

Next time you go to China and you arrive at the airport,theres always a nice gentle Chinese woman or polite Chinese man to greet you,When you arrive in an American airport,your greeted with an attitude "get in line...your in the wrong line... O V E R H E R E !!!!!! We went to get my wifes SSN card,and had a woman with a big time freakin attitude....anyway....it sounds like you had some similar issues.

Get married and do the k3 or cr1 because waiting for the k1 to return back to the states,going to take some time.and a lawyer....do you really want to know my opinion on them? hahaha.anyway, Address all the issues you think might have led to your '"NON BONAFIDE RELATIONSHIP"address it up front in your k3 or cr1....I think the cr1 is better,but takes a little longer so it has been said....my wife actually ended up with the IR1 because when she entered USA,we were already married 2 years,and so she got her 10 year green card.Also,i really do believe being there at Guz for her interview makes a big difference,I am not saying it is a guareentee a visa,but really it just makes sense to be there.At the ACH,I must say I had a very pleasant male VO,allowed me to ask all my questions,did not blow me off,was very attentive,typed alot of it into the computer......also from the description my wife gave me of her VO,it sounded like the guy i had.So the second time around for my wife,was a pleasant experience.quick interview.anyway,good luck whatever you decide to do.

 

Jimi

 

 

Jimi;

 

Thanks for all your help and thanks also to all who have and will respond.

 

I said earlier that I would change three thigs and do them differently. I had forgotten that I would be a regular on this site. so much information and peoples first hand experience. caring real people just like guiling and i.

 

i as well will skip an attorney this time other than perhaps a consultation over the whole process and tips in regard to the details.

 

i don't have a thing really against my attorney it's just a crap-shoot?

 

I agree with you and have believed it since the denial and request for more information after my fiancees interview last december. It was fully determined and dictated who would and who would not get appoved.

 

i do not believe that it was a coincidence that while my fiancee and her daughter were waiting at the embassy for their interview and they were there early. every person who went into the room with the male vo came out passed. every single individual that came out of the female vo's room failed or needed more information.

 

the interview was just to go thru the formality and hone in on a reason to deny it. in our case use the daughter to request a dna test to prove she was my fiancee's real daughter.

 

one of two possibilities i believe. one: delay and deny approval by requesting a totally unnecessary test. not to mention very expensive.

 

two: some lowlife scammers or worse were able to con them and get some people thru before they caught on. a cousin in place of a daughter who knows? so now the typical bureaucratic reaction is to make all honest hardworking everyday people have an expensive and unnecessary test while the scammers have moved on to some new loophole.

 

anyway, thanks again for all the help. i'll look up the CR and IR information to decide what may be the best way for us to proceed.

 

after bad wrapping them on this site we probably have no chance of getting approved.

 

i read on here that perhaps the consulate people look in on here to get a feel for what people are thinking and hopefully experiencing so that they get a real sense of what their actions truly mean to us in real terms of being needlessly kept apart from our loved one.

 

if they are then i'm sure they know how i feel about the process.

 

i hope they feel the same way and work to change it.

 

if it was my job i would be working and finding ways to get it back thru the chain of command to get it fixed.

 

there are plenty of people here in the states that want it. that would support fair change.

 

how can they stand in front of the news cameras and tell people follow the rules do it right and legal and then you get chewed to bits by the system. how can you face people and tell them don't sneak over the border, when in the next breath you are talking about granting amnesty to all of those individuals that have not followed the rules. what justice for us that have?

 

if it was me i'd probably do anything i could to get here.

 

i don't have a thing against the people who have. if i stand a diminished chance what chance would they have?

 

 

take care and god bless you all.

 

rich

 

 

Rich,

From more than just a few folks comes a statistic that 8 out of 10 couples break up after a denial. Even if that number isn't accurate I believe that it DOES play a part in GUZ's decisions. Especially where you have a case where there is a quick meeting after a divorce, a short courtship before a marriage/proposal and the subsequent petition being filed. I believe that GUZ simply finds a reason to send the P&B back to the 'Drawing Board' knowing that it will take up to another year, and sometimes longer, for the P7B to get back to the stage of another interview. I'm sure they'd like to see if you are one of the couples who have a meltdown because of the denial.

I would suggest to you that you consider another K-1 filing due to the ease of your fiancee's daughter being included in the K-1 petition process-I don't think you'll have to file much additional paperwork to include her in her mother's visa, and that is the biggest benefit to going back along the K-1 route.

But if you prefer, you can go the CR-1/K3 route with the CR-1 giving you the advantage of being able to electronically file your petition through the National Visa Center and it will cut about 2-3 months off the entire process. It also is cheaper to go the CR-1 route as you will not have to pay the Adjustment of Status fee of approximately $1010 if she gets the visa and comes to the US. Look into it.

In the meantime, plan your next petition filing carefully. Make at least another trip and document everything, right down to the taxi car receipts. Take bunches of pictures with you and your new family that have a time/date stamp ON the photos, and in many different places. Print the chat logs if you guys talk online, get copies of the phone call logs, keep copies of the emails you send between you both, etc. PROVE the bona fide of your relationship!

Maybe that doesn't seem like such clear advice right now to you because you are still angry about how they have treated you (we got a white slip also so I know the things you are feeling). Don't waste your time on trying to get your congressmen or representatives involved-they're useless, except for making periodic inquiries into the status of your returned petition. Forget the Freedom of Information Act requests as they will take almost a year and all you will get are copies of the I-129F that you filed, and a DOS/DHS letter saying 'we have more than this but we won't give it to you because it involves a visa refusal, and we don't have to cough that up...'.

Attention To Detail is what you will have to begin thinking as you put together your next petition. Document everything about your relationship.

You'll be ok. Some people just take longer to get their visas than others, and your time will come.

If you have any questions you're welcmoe to PM me.

 

 

Splinterman

 

Hi Splinterman;

 

Thanks for you advice. i think i would like to chat with you sometime. i'm not sure how the PM would work?

 

you give me sound advice. we did have all the particulars covered. daily everyhting and every receipt from three trips to china in a little over 2 years to visit her and her family twice and a 2 week vacation to sanya the middle trip.

 

i think as several people have now mentioned, the short timeframe between the divorce with my ex and us getting together was a negative that certainly didn't help.

 

i have a few delicate issues about our choice of which method to pursue. i appreciate your willingness to help.

 

rich

[fineart]

Rich,

From more than just a few folks comes a statistic that 8 out of 10 couples break up after a denial. Even if that number isn't accurate I believe that it DOES play a part in GUZ's decisions. Especially where you have a case where there is a quick meeting after a divorce, a short courtship before a marriage/proposal and the subsequent petition being filed. I believe that GUZ simply finds a reason to send the P&B back to the 'Drawing Board' knowing that it will take up to another year, and sometimes longer, for the P7B to get back to the stage of another interview. I'm sure they'd like to see if you are one of the couples who have a meltdown because of the denial.

I would suggest to you that you consider another K-1 filing due to the ease of your fiancee's daughter being included in the K-1 petition process-I don't think you'll have to file much additional paperwork to include her in her mother's visa, and that is the biggest benefit to going back along the K-1 route.

But if you prefer, you can go the CR-1/K3 route with the CR-1 giving you the advantage of being able to electronically file your petition through the National Visa Center and it will cut about 2-3 months off the entire process. It also is cheaper to go the CR-1 route as you will not have to pay the Adjustment of Status fee of approximately $1010 if she gets the visa and comes to the US. Look into it.

In the meantime, plan your next petition filing carefully. Make at least another trip and document everything, right down to the taxi car receipts. Take bunches of pictures with you and your new family that have a time/date stamp ON the photos, and in many different places. Print the chat logs if you guys talk online, get copies of the phone call logs, keep copies of the emails you send between you both, etc. PROVE the bona fide of your relationship!

Maybe that doesn't seem like such clear advice right now to you because you are still angry about how they have treated you (we got a white slip also so I know the things you are feeling). Don't waste your time on trying to get your congressmen or representatives involved-they're useless, except for making periodic inquiries into the status of your returned petition. Forget the Freedom of Information Act requests as they will take almost a year and all you will get are copies of the I-129F that you filed, and a DOS/DHS letter saying 'we have more than this but we won't give it to you because it involves a visa refusal, and we don't have to cough that up...'.

Attention To Detail is what you will have to begin thinking as you put together your next petition. Document everything about your relationship.

You'll be ok. Some people just take longer to get their visas than others, and your time will come.

If you have any questions you're welcmoe to PM me.

 

 

Splinterman

That is a very wise advice, Splinterman. Many people can benefit from your advice.

 

I have seen some couples failed in K-1 the first time, then applied CR, and succeeded in CR1 the second time.

Edited November 24, 2009 by fineart (see edit history)

[david_dawei]

i have a few delicate issues about our choice of which method to pursue. i appreciate your willingness to help.

Maybe we can all agree that there are three people who are easy to cast blame on... and the amount we cast is often not realistic since we do it on subjectively emotional grounds:

1. Ourselves and our preparation (of course, not our dirty selves)

2. The lawyer or whoever we paid (promises... that dirty liar)

3. GUZ... those dirty rats are easy to blame

Edited November 29, 2009 by DavidZixuan (see edit history)

[splinterman]

http://arctec.com/blog/

 

This is the link to the Complaint narrative along with a link to some of the appendices contained in Mr. Roth's writings.

 

Splinterman

 

If you're looking for information or assistance with your petition, visit this website:

 

http://www.chineseimmigrationsupport.com/.