our real lives, not expected

[Guest enight]

you are very welcome, keep the light then, ha.

[Guest enight]

Edit: My grandfather is 80-something, and I see him several times a month.  Usually you get more conservative as you age-- but Karl Marx would call my G'pa "far left"     Makes for delightfully lively arguments.  He did not raise me, but he raised tha man who raised me, and look how I came out.

that's very nice of you!

[Guest hakkamike]

My grandfather is 80-something, and I see him several times a month??? Man, I don¡¯t believe it, more than likely waiting for some inheritance money. This behavior is quite strange for Americans? I promise to more nice from now on..

LOL LOL, Later, Michael Perez

[Jeikun]

... teach me, why should put the kids on the first place ?

 

they would visit you once a week; a month; a year when you are 70?

 

they gave you financial support when you need them as most of kids do to their parents in China?

 

they send you a gift pack; a card or a phone call on father's day or you brithday; Christmas? 

 

or...

 

they would carry your name (or not), so 'Mr. Smith' would be known after 100 years?

There are many reasons one's own children should be put first, but this one is the "bottom line":

 

Your children are YOUR children - you brought them into the world. They did not ask to be born. They are dependent on you financially and emotionally and this dependance is LEGALLY BINDING.

 

As far as the financial support, that's not your choice. Divorced or not. Steve has to send child support money, period. As far as emotionally - family comes before a new relationship.

 

It's not about what you get... visits, money, cards... whatever - you might be dead before you're 80 anyway. It's about what you owe these little people that you brought into the world.

 

True, many people can have kids, get divorced - pawn them off on their mother and just start a whole new life. Personally I think that kind of person must be selfish, short sighted, and nearly emotionless - not the kind of person a woman should want to have her own kids with anyway.

[se_lang]

I will make this point my kids will never come second to anyone nor will my wife, the kids are kids and need us to raise them right, However once they are adults and on their own then they no longer need us so why should they come before the woman I sleep with, HOWEVER if the woman I sleep with is wrong then she is wrong.

[Jeikun]

Of course - when they're adults it's a different story

[oregonknl]

Well,

 

As I discovered in Beijing, and see it reflected to some extent in this thread -- there are Chinese people that have a very practical (vs. loving) take on kids. On a personal level, it was very shocking, stepping back after the shock and pain wore off, --- intellectually I'm not surprised, since I know from several close accounts just how sinister some Chinese can be with their new born baby girls (and I'm not talking about those who abandon them -- I am saddened, but still grateful to both of my daughter's birth mothers --- where every they are in China --- God Bless them --- Wish I could just send them one simple message telling them that their daughters are in good, loving hands..)

 

So why ~? Jason and Michael P. make seperate points that combine to be a definitive answer.. We raise em' and love em' first, because it is our obligation. And I believe most parents, including Chinese (maybe especially Chinese?) want their children to be better then they were --- I hope it for my girls..

 

I happen to believe children define family, and yes, that includes singles like myself (hopefully not for much longer --- are you reading this in the GZ Consulate?!?!) Love for children makes a family -- so important is that that I am happy to include same sex couples in the formula..

 

But the OBLIGATION asside, I just love them...

 

they ENTERTAIN me!

 

..... and yes, when they are bad, test my parenting skills. They are bright, funny, sometimes conniving, (especially Eve, who still occasionally reverts to her orphanage ways), and as a package, just a blast to be around.

 

I enjoy their company more than I enjoy the company of many adults who I know socially, but yes, also there are times for adult interaction exclusively...

 

.... and Fei has nothing to worry about --- she is the apple of my eye --- Our relationship just grows and grows --- as it did on this trip ! .... and spans every emotions from tenderness to raw lust... and I already know she will be great with Jet and Eve! How lucky is that?

 

----Kim

[oregonknl]

"Kind of a self-fullfilling prophesy reap-what-you-sow sort of deal"

 

MoonCarolCafe --- so true.

 

My father really had very little time for me and my siblings... Later in life, he regreted it -- but I still never felt I really knew him very well. I would say my brother and sister felt the same. And he died a lonely man, even though my brother and sister were caring for him to the end.

 

Could Jet and Eve take off on me when I'm old? Of course!

 

But if that is the case, I will still die knowing I did what I could to be a good father, (and also with a lot of fond memories of the good times we had together when they were young)

[Guest enight]

too practical? who is not practical in this world?

 

just the level of practicality might be different.

 

whatever, it's to early to know the result. good luck

[Guest hakkamike]

Practical: It has a few different meaning , practical: Level-headed, efficient, and unspeculative, and yet at the end of your post you say good luck?? Luck

 

(n.)Luck: That which happens to a person; an event, good or ill, affecting one's interests or happiness, and which is deemed casual; a course or series of such events regarded as occurring by chance; chance; hap; fate; fortune; often, one's habitual or characteristic fortune; as, good, bad, ill, or hard luck. Luck is often used for good luck; as, luck is better than skill.

 

 

 

Be Practical, Good Luck

Later, Michael Perez

[keelec]

Clifford - take a look at the MASTER! She always did like to mess around with pics. 

Don,

 

Am I supposed to feel insulted by that????

 

I guess I forgot to add the Playboy magazine

http://www.wowpicture.com/design_artistic_...y_asiangirl.htm

 

I had just wanted to spend a couple of minutes throwing a few pics up on the web. Of course I would like to come back and update it, but I have many other priorities too.

 

Anyway, I can always rationalize it by explaining that I am still using dialup, and get tired of all the time wasted in "fluff". But, maybe you are right, I should probably build a very sharp "Personals" page for myself.

 

Here is the page that I made for Lina, the English instructor for Oksana, the first Russian woman I was dating a couple of years ago. Oksana had asked me to build a personals page for her.

http://www.geocities.com/clkeele/Lina.html

If I remember right, she couldn't get me any very good pictures so I had to improvise.

 

----- CK -----

[Dave G.]

Wow! I just read this thread, Where to start???

 

As a guy with a new wife who had a son (whom I love) and a past fiancee who had three kids (whom I loved), the expectations seem somehow skewed. A single guy going into a relationship where kids exist is undaunting. We're expected to put up with alot of baggage, smile, and take it in the butt while paying for it all. But, for a woman to cry "foul" despite her assurances seems wrong.

 

The gal who cuts my family hair is Chinese. Her boyfriend is also Chinese. He has two kids who refuse to accept her. She's a doll and is so hurt by the kids' choices. Somehow, it's a Chinese thing...I understand it but don't agree with it. Enight is right...kids don't come first. They are too stupid and naive to know what's going on. A healthy relationship consists of husband/wife - mother/father - children. When the husband and wife have to settle for the unrealistic/immature needs of children, they are doomed to fail. Love between spouses will offset all the past history from previous relationships. Trust me...I learned this the hard way. I tried to love a woman before with a sick, unhealthy tie to her ex. The children played the mother against me vis a vis the father and I couldn't win for losing.

 

Face it...most of use meet later in life. Boy meets girl; girl meets boy. There's a connection. Love finds a way. But, when we get greedy or selfish, it's doomed to fail. Kids are great. It's our responsibilty to care for them...they are only children. How dare we put ourselves above them. When we do, we have to take a serious look in the mirror and see how childish we are. If we are not ready to admit how selfish we are, then we have no business committing to another.

[maiyademama]

Practical: It has a few different meaning , practical: Level-headed, efficient, and unspeculative, and yet at the end of your post you say good luck?? Luck

 

(n.)Luck:  That which happens to a person; an event, good or ill, affecting one's interests or happiness, and which is deemed casual; a course or series of such events regarded as occurring by chance; chance; hap; fate; fortune; often, one's habitual or characteristic fortune; as, good, bad, ill, or hard luck. Luck is often used for good luck; as, luck is better than skill.

 

 

 

Be Practical, Good Luck

              Later, Michael Perez

Michael, You are one son of a gun...you crack me up

[Guest enight]

thanks for AD my site Clifford, even you may dislike it, ha.

 

well, I am proud of designed and built sites by myself, Alan helped me to correct all the English words. we are great teamwork in business too!

 

thanks Don, Dave and those who listened me. thanks the teacher here who was listing 20 different meanings of 'practical' as well.

 

we will go to UP State NY this morning, see ya guys and girls.. Hasta la vista...

[Jeikun]

Enight is right...kids don't come first.  They are too stupid and naive to know what's going on.  A healthy relationship consists of husband/wife - mother/father - children.  When the husband and wife have to settle for the unrealistic/immature needs of children, they are doomed to fail.

Of course. If you base your romantic choices on "I hate your girlfriend daddy" and it's not because she's mistreating them, but just childish selfishness, then yes that's stupid.

 

But if you're willing to consider "I can't accept your kids, honey. They aren't OUR family. Let's ship them off to their crackw#@re mom in Florida" then that's beyond stupid.