China on the South China Seas

[Randy W]

China is well prepared for the result . . . from Quartz

 

TRASH TALK

Choice insults Beijing has hurled at the international tribunal about to rule on the South China Sea

 

It’s safe to say China’s leadership doesn’t think highly of the Permanent Court of Arbitration (PCA) in The Hague.

 

. . .

 

 

Last week state-controlled media ran articles describing the PCA as a “law-abusing tribunal” with “widely contested jurisdiction.” In May, senior diplomat Xu Hong said the tribunal of acted unjustly by taking up the case.

“China sees itself as a global super power that shouldn’t be questioned,” says Anders Corr of Corr Analytics. “So here they have this sort of upstart court out in the middle of nowhere that is somehow challenging their historical claim, and they see that as impudent. China reacts intensely against any country or any organization, whether it be the UN or an international court, that’s trying to impinge on what it sees as its backyard.”

First, the urgent priority is to stop the arbitration case initiated by the Philippines. If the tribunal insisted on its way and produced an “award,” no one and no country should implement the award in any form, much less to force China into implementation… The arbitral tribunal has no jurisdiction over this case.

 

Sonya Sceats, an associate fellow of international law at Chatham House, believes China’s fury over the case belies legal insecurities. But she notes Beijing is on a hiring spree of international lawyers and is gearing up to play a bigger role in international law.

Meanwhile, a sense of paranoia can be detected in China’s attacks on the tribunal. An editorial in the state-controlled Global Times described the ruling (link in Chinese) as “obviously American-back and supported” and said the court was “playing the fool,” pretending to not know that the Philippines was trying to do: use the tribunal to claim territory. The proceedings, it said, were a trap laid out to discredit China.

Beijing also complained that a Japanese citizen participated in the formation of the tribunal, saying that’s inappropriate because Japan has its own maritime disputes with China. When the Philippines filed the case in early 2013, Shunji Yanai was president of the International Tribunal on the Law of the Sea. Because China refused to participate in the case, the president, per standard procedure, chose two judges on China’s behalf to sit on the five-judge tribunal. (Yanai himself did not sit on the tribunal.)

Last week Hong Lei, a spokesperson for China’s foreign ministry, said the entire case was “an abuse of international law and the international arbitration mechanism.”

He added—in case anyone had missed it—that China would not accept the verdict.

 

[danb]

It can not be denied that there is a dispute(s). A dispute among many countries in that South China Sea area. Each party has own beliefs, justifications, reasons, desires, proofs, etc to support their claim. Who should really decide what is right, just and legal? An individual country, a regional authority or ????

 

The Chinese do not want some court/tribunal in the Netherlands making that decision. “So here they have this sort of upstart court out in the middle of nowhere that is somehow challenging their historical claim, and they see that as impudent. China reacts intensely against any country or any organization, whether it be the UN or an international court, that’s trying to impinge on what it sees as its backyard.” Are the Chinese just in their objections? I am not sure but I do think that all parties should find a reasonable and peaceful way of resolving this issue. They need a platform where they can all present their case. I hope they find one. Danb

[Randy W]

in the SCMP


China violated Philippines’ sovereign rights in South China Sea, international court rules

Permanent Court of Arbitration says Beijing interfered with Philippines’ fishing, created serious risk of collision with Philippines vessels and caused severe harm to the coral reef environment

The full press release from the Permanent Court of Arbitration in the Hague (pdf)

The tribunal also held that fishermen from the Philippines had traditional fishing rights in Scarborough Shoal in the South China Sea, and that China had interfered with these rights by restricting their access to the area.
The court held that Chinese law enforcement vessels unlawfully created a serious risk of collision when they physically obstructed Philippine vessels in the region.

China had caused severe harm to the coral reef environment in the South China Sea, the court ruled.
It said Beijing had violated its obligation to preserve and protect fragile ecosystems and the habitat of depleted, threatened or endangered species.

. . .

“There is no legal basis for China to claim historic rights to resources within the sea areas falling within the nine-dash line,” the court said.

Beijing did so by interfering with the Philippines’ fishing and petroleum exploration, building artificial islands in the waters and failing to prevent Chinese fishermen from fishing in the zone, according to the ruling by the Permanent Court of Arbitration in the Hague on Tuesday evening.

 

[amberjack1234]

It can not be denied that there is a dispute(s). A dispute among many countries in that South China Sea area. Each party has own beliefs, justifications, reasons, desires, proofs, etc to support their claim. Who should really decide what is right, just and legal? An individual country, a regional authority or ????

 

The Chinese do not want some court/tribunal in the Netherlands making that decision. “So here they have this sort of upstart court out in the middle of nowhere that is somehow challenging their historical claim, and they see that as impudent. China reacts intensely against any country or any organization, whether it be the UN or an international court, that’s trying to impinge on what it sees as its backyard.” Are the Chinese just in their objections? I am not sure but I do think that all parties should find a reasonable and peaceful way of resolving this issue. They need a platform where they can all present their case. I hope they find one. Danb

I thought that is the reason for the existence of this court and the reason that it was created by all countries of the world in 1945. To settle disputes like this. If they have no authority we need to dis-ban it and save a lot of money.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Court_of_Justice

 

Let's just fess up we have Chinese wives so we are somewhat swayed in our thinking towards China's interest but it does not make everything that they are doing legal and moral just like the United States has a few skeletons in the closets too.

 

They have become the biggest gorilla in the room now and their true colors are coming out. I had this argument about 10 years ago with a member here when he was saying that China had NEVER infringed on ANYONE'S rights and the US was infringing on every country in the world's rights. I hope that he went back to college and took a few more courses in world history.

 

I AM NOT BASHING CHINA JUST TELLING IT LIKE IT IS. It's all in Randy's post..

[warpedbored]

I think it's pretty obvious that China wants to usurp the US as the world's leading superpower. They want control of the entire South China sea and it's resources. One only need look at the 9 dash line to see how ludicrous that is. A line in the sand has to be drawn in order to maintain important shipping lanes. Only the US has the military might to do that. I wonder if they have the balls. Perhaps a massive armada taking a long slow cruise through the area might get the point across.

[Greg.D.]

Well, this is going to be an unpleasant time for bi-national families. And, it will get unpleasanter before it gets pleasanter.my sympathies to those in the mainland.

[Randy W]

It strikes me that there are two aspects of this that I haven't seen discussed anywhere -

 

One is this - I think a lot of the current PLA fodder comes from single-child families. Even in a very limited engagement, on an individual level, these parents are not going to be happy to see their upcoming generation led off to war.

 

Two is that, for now anyway, within China it is simply on a laughing-stock level. That is, it is REAL funny that ANYONE would think that China doesn't own the South China Sea Islands already, much less a country with 2 70-year old buffoons as Presidential candidates.

 

This issue will come to a head ONLY when China needs to open their Bank Teller window to resume "one-on-one"negotiations with a "HOW can we help you today?" smile.

 

I think they'll find they've lost more than a little leverage.

[Allon]

We have three aircraft carrier groups in that area. We have flown B-52's over the water, of course, with a flight of fighters as escort.

 

The next step would be to send one of those carriers through the area and troll for action. That is usually what we do (called "innocent passage") when a country claims more than their rightful share of the high seas. It has happened before.

 

We have done some of these sorties but have not actually gone up to the full 12 mile recognized international limit. But the message was delivered.

 

Still, the Chinese continue to harass the fisherman.....

[amberjack1234]

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Especially when you put a GREAT deal of money into the mix.

[Randy W]

This is Forbes' take on the issues - there is not much new here, so I won't try to quote from it. If you're interested, take a look. Hopefully, you can get free access (I did)

China Has Defied International Law, Now What? Experts Speak Out

for example -

However, according to Luttwak, if China simply ignores the Court’s verdict, do not buy Filipino acquiescence, and continue to develop bases on other people’s reefs, every insular and peninsular country around China –all of them–will intensify strategic cooperation with the U.S., and also Australia.
. . .
Pant said that the U.S. Navy will continue its freedom of navigation patrols and other states like Japan, Australia and India (major regional naval powers) will also do this to signal that they don’t accept China’s interpretation of international maritime law.
“But for the U.S. the issue will be how far it would be willing to go to up the ante on this issue. China has lost face and the Chinese leadership can become even more obdurate under these circumstances.”

[Greg.D.]

Basically says China is in a corner. US, Australia, Japan, etc will be escalating the freedom of navigation exercises, China wasted opportunities to be a "maritime power" - with trust and help of allies supporting commerce - and can now only be a naval power, forever being in a combative position and with no allies.

 

Says look for China to buy off Philippines with a huge investment in some kind of infrastructure project which is their usual MO, especially when there are corrupt local pol's to facilitate the process, though I see the Fillipino citizens as beng very wary about deals with China.

 

Wishing for peace ...

[amberjack1234]

Money talks and bull**** walks. I have already heard from the wife reading her Chinese news sites that there already has been a meeting with China and the Philippines. China does not want the US there again what ever the cost.

[Randy W]

Money talks and bull**** walks. I have already heard from the wife reading her Chinese news sites that there already has been a meeting with China and the Philippines. China does not want the US there again what ever the cost.

 

 

Yes - that is where the ruling will put a MAJOR crimp in their style right there. Given how forceful they've become in their insistence on both Hong Kong and Taiwan embracing Beijing's interpretation of the "one China" concept, we can only hope they won't try to do the same thing with the nine-dash line.

 

Activity has increased already on both "sides", but I don't think China can afford much in the way of more bad publicity.

[Randy W]

from China Pictorial on Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/ChinaPic/photos/a.558235270968533.1073741830.553929144732479/928081937317196/?type=3&theater&notif_t=notify_me_page&notif_id=1468816864788980


 

Quote

China calls on U.S., Japan to stop twisting the facts

China urged the U.S. and Japan on Wednesday to stop distorting international law and using the "arbitration" on the South China Sea to serve their own political aims.

Cui Tiankai, China's ambassador to the U.S., said at the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington on Tuesday that these territorial issues in the South China Sea should not become issues between China and the U.S. "We will not yield to any pressure, be it in the form of military activities, media criticism or some self-claimed legal bodies," he said.

Late on Tuesday, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Lu Kang issued two statements on the ministry's website, saying China is firmly opposed to the statements made by the U.S. and Japan.

In the U.S., various Chinese groups on Tuesday called upon all Chinese across the planet to unite to defend China's sovereignty over the South China Sea in response to the ruling.

 

Edited June 6, 2021 by Randy W (see edit history)

[Greg.D.]

... or some self-claimed legal bodies ....

 

I like that.