Englishphobia anyone ?

[ken88]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

[Randy W]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

 

 

#1. DITCH THE INTERPRETER. It's a world of difference when you're talking with her, rather than the interpreter. Use babelfish to translate her IM's to you, she can use whatever tool at her end to translate yours to her.

 

She's probably not very far behind my wife (now)

[ken88]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

 

 

#1. DITCH THE INTERPRETER. It's a world of difference when you're talking with her, rather than the interpreter. Use babelfish to translate her IM's to you, she can use whatever tool at her end to translate yours to her.

 

She's probably not very far behind my wife (now)

 

My wife does not know how to use a computer (which she may be able to learn quickly, I hope). She does not know pin Yan, without which she can not use babelfish, right?

 

Ken88

[Randy W]

 

My wife does not know how to use a computer (which she may be able to learn quickly, I hope). She does not know pin Yan, without which she can not use babelfish, right?

 

Ken88

 

 

No - Babelfish and any Windows program accepts Chinese characters by whatever input method, including character recognition (the only one my wife knows). She can buy a writing pad with character recognition software for under $10.

[ken88]

 

My wife does not know how to use a computer (which she may be able to learn quickly, I hope). She does not know pin Yan, without which she can not use babelfish, right?

 

Ken88

 

 

No - Babelfish and any Windows program accepts Chinese characters by whatever input method, including character recognition (the only one my wife knows). She can buy a writing pad with character recognition software for under $10.

 

 

Tell me the how the whole thing worked out for you. Is babel fish free? Does it need any set up? If she goes to a netcafe with this writing pad would she be able to use it there, you think?

 

I took my wife to a dentist. We communicated with a computer. When I typed a question, he clicked on it, and it came out in Chinese. He typed the answer in Pin yan. When he clicked on it, it came out English. Is this babelfish you think?

 

Ken88

[Randy W]

 

Tell me the how the whole thing worked out for you. Is babel fish free? Does it need any set up? If she goes to a netcafe with this writing pad would she be able to use it there, you think?

 

I took my wife to a dentist. We communicated with a computer. When I typed a question, he clicked on it, and it came out in Chinese. He typed the answer in Pin yan. When he clicked on it, it came out English. Is this babelfish you think?

 

Ken88

 

No - babelfish is a website - http://babelfish.yahoo.com/?fr=avbbf-us - google has an equivalent site.

 

I think pinyin is the most popular input method, but anyone who went to school during the Cultural Revolution would not have learned that in school. There are also encoding methods that professionals use for speed - but they have to memorize a code for each character.

 

I bought my wife a computer fairly early on - this is a very good investment. She had someone set it up. Kingsoft and other programs work in the way you describe.

 

I doubt that she would be able to install any software on a computer at a netcafe - she would probably have to use whatever they had

[2mike&jin]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

 

 

Ken88 --

 

OK, First Breakfast -- and NOW communication?

 

Ok, a little suggestion --- start learning Chinese. Then you can bring up the fairness issue --- she must learn English....You can meet in the middel. My gal and I -- speak half Chines and half English ---- I never really notice which language is being used...UNTIL I GET CORRECTED for having my "subject & time" in the wrong sentence location. I must own 50 Chinese books -- from Mandarin for Dummies...to an intense Harvard Mandarin Grammar Book. Nothing is easy --- but after a year plus of Putonghua --- I think it is much easier than learning English...no plurality, no tenses, no conjugation of verbs, simple negative-positive structures...and an intense desire to balance and abbreviate ever conversation. Time for you to start studying -- and cooking breakfast!

 

(Sorry to be firm...but that's what old men try to do)

[chilton747]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

 

 

Ken88 --

 

OK, First Breakfast -- and NOW communication?

 

Ok, a little suggestion --- start learning Chinese. Then you can bring up the fairness issue --- she must learn English....You can meet in the middel. My gal and I -- speak half Chines and half English ---- I never really notice which language is being used...UNTIL I GET CORRECTED for having my "subject & time" in the wrong sentence location. I must own 50 Chinese books -- from Mandarin for Dummies...to an intense Harvard Mandarin Grammar Book. Nothing is easy --- but after a year plus of Putonghua --- I think it is much easier than learning English...no plurality, no tenses, no conjugation of verbs, simple negative-positive structures...and an intense desire to balance and abbreviate ever conversation. Time for you to start studying -- and cooking breakfast!

 

(Sorry to be firm...but that's what old men try to do)

 

A great way to do it. My wife and I do the same. It works really well.

[Dennis143]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

 

 

Ken88 --

 

OK, First Breakfast -- and NOW communication?

 

Ok, a little suggestion --- start learning Chinese. Then you can bring up the fairness issue --- she must learn English....You can meet in the middel. My gal and I -- speak half Chines and half English ---- I never really notice which language is being used...UNTIL I GET CORRECTED for having my "subject & time" in the wrong sentence location. I must own 50 Chinese books -- from Mandarin for Dummies...to an intense Harvard Mandarin Grammar Book. Nothing is easy --- but after a year plus of Putonghua --- I think it is much easier than learning English...no plurality, no tenses, no conjugation of verbs, simple negative-positive structures...and an intense desire to balance and abbreviate ever conversation. Time for you to start studying -- and cooking breakfast!

 

(Sorry to be firm...but that's what old men try to do)

It's commendable that you've learned Chinese to enable you to communicate with you wife. However, if any Chinese wife (or husband) want to have a successful transistion to a life in America they will need to learn English. I find it rather curious for anyone (on either end of the relationship) to not accept this reality and the importance of learning English.

[izus]

imo going half way with the language is 101 basic marriage 50/50.

 

i know a guy who is going through this right now, his lady friend does not speak any english and he has this wall up in his head that its impossible to learn chinese. everything is going through the translator. his attitude is im not worried, she'll learn english.

 

once you dive into the chinese language, your average joe would be very surprised on how basic it really is and how well things work together.

Edited July 1, 2008 by izus (see edit history)

[Zhen's Tiger]

I send my wife to school to learn English. I paid for a 6 month course. She quit after 2 months. She says that there is no way that she can ever learn English! She said the only way is that I have to learn Chinese!

 

How is your wife/gf handling English?

 

(PS : We IM 2-3 times a week using an interpreter. And this interpreter is alway on standby. I think that is spoiling her!)

 

 

Ken88 --

 

OK, First Breakfast -- and NOW communication?

 

Ok, a little suggestion --- start learning Chinese. Then you can bring up the fairness issue --- she must learn English....You can meet in the middel. My gal and I -- speak half Chines and half English ---- I never really notice which language is being used...UNTIL I GET CORRECTED for having my "subject & time" in the wrong sentence location. I must own 50 Chinese books -- from Mandarin for Dummies...to an intense Harvard Mandarin Grammar Book. Nothing is easy --- but after a year plus of Putonghua --- I think it is much easier than learning English...no plurality, no tenses, no conjugation of verbs, simple negative-positive structures...and an intense desire to balance and abbreviate ever conversation. Time for you to start studying -- and cooking breakfast!

 

(Sorry to be firm...but that's what old men try to do)

It's commendable that you've learned Chinese to enable you to communicate with you wife. However, if any Chinese wife (or husband) want to have a successful transistion to a life in America they will need to learn English. I find it rather curious for anyone (on either end of the relationship) to not accept this reality and the importance of learning English.

I have to agree with Dennis on this one. While I am also learning Cantonese & a little Mandarin, it is so I can communicate with her friends & family when we visit more than anything else. If your wife hopes to have any kind of successful, happy life in the US, English is a necessity. Just imagine your life if you lived in China with no way to communicate... I would really try to get her to change her point of view on this!

[shaffej7070]

Yes, English is an absolute necessity if your lady wants to be independent, and her English skills determine the level of independence she is pursuing.

 

My wife's English skills were rudimentary at best when she arrived here exactly one year ago as we still depended on the pocket translator. She enrolled in ESL classes at the college and attended 5 days a week, 4 hours per day. Her determination and discipline allowed us to communicate less with the translator.

 

After 3 months of ESL instruction, she had to abruptly leave to tend to her ailing mother in China. When she arrived stateside 3 months later, she forgot much of what she learned since she was out-of-practice, but didn't take long to jog her memory.

 

In the meantime, she acquired a job at a nearby Japanese steakhouse and trained to be a hibachi chef. Much of what she's learned stems from the interaction with co-workers and patrons, especially slang and euphemisms. She doesn't attend ESL classes any longer, but has a private tutor twice a week and diligently studies every night before bed.

 

We now rarely use the translator and can hold conversations for hours. It is also your duty to be the teacher. Always correct her grammar and never laugh at her pronunciation, unless she cues you to laugh. Ultimately, her desire to be independent will determine her progress, and your encouragement and support will determine her success.

[tsap seui]

I once tried to get my firlfriend to teach me Chinese and she flat out told me, "you no needa. I needa you teacha me english".

 

When I met her she knew two words of english and she packed a cheap lil' electronic translator and a note book whech she wrote down english words and wrote the definition by them in Chinese, and how to pronounce them. On my second trip I gave her David's list of 100 questions. She took that list and her lil' translator and broke them down word for word.

 

On my third trip she handed me 75 questions that she had written down in english for me and asked me to start asking her those questions twice a day on our calls. Now, she had notebooks full of words and she would ask me over and over how to pronounce words.

 

I still hear her flipping pages in her note books asking me how to pronounce something, or looking up a word to tell me.

 

Her transformation was amazing. She tried an englixh class in her city but said it was too slow, that I could teach her quicker. We talk for hours each day on the phone now. She is one adult that no kid is gonna come to america and pick up the language quicker than.

 

I never saw someone work so hard, and it still makes my eyes a lil' damp to think of her work, her determine to understand, and her dedication. I was in awe when she handed me those pages with her writing in english of those 75 questions. We worked those questions twice a day for over three months on the phone and in person. And, she got asked 31 of those questions at her interview.

 

She may not have gotten her visa, but it wasn't from any lack of effort on her part.

 

She has a couple of friends who have gone to america and never lifted a finger to learn ANY english. They tell her they don't want or need to understand english...plus, they don't want their husbands to ask them questions they don't want to talk about. Yeah, there's a couple of bona fide relationships there for ya.

 

She still works on her english and we both know it will be at least 2 1/2 or 3 more years, if ever, before we make another application. I can only hope to work half as hard to learn any Chinese, for when I move over next year sometime, as she worked to learn english.

 

My hat is off to those ladys who set goals and work so hard to understand english. It's truly inspirational.

 

tsap seui

[shushuweiwei]

 

Tell me the how the whole thing worked out for you. Is babel fish free? Does it need any set up? If she goes to a netcafe with this writing pad would she be able to use it there, you think?

 

I took my wife to a dentist. We communicated with a computer. When I typed a question, he clicked on it, and it came out in Chinese. He typed the answer in Pin yan. When he clicked on it, it came out English. Is this babelfish you think?

 

Ken88

 

I agree with the idea that if she's coming here there is the potential for her to be miserable with no English skills. My fear about that was that my fiancee would be overly dependent on me if that were the case and making friends would be very difficult.

 

I wonder if the teacher was a problem. Maybe too strict or too critical. There could be a conflict there where she just doesn't want to go back to that style of teaching. Maybe she can explore other teachers.

 

My fiancee took an English class for only 3 months and then was able to make progress really well from our conversations. If she can use a computer at a cafe, etc., we have had a good time on livemocha.com. She can change the language to Chinese at the upper left and view everything in Hanzi.

 

It is nice because we can "correct" each others lessons and there are written and spoken lessons. There are also tutors who will help you/her out if you need it and you can try conversing with other native speakers (as can she, if she is embarrassed to make mistakes with you). If you sign up for Mandarin and she signs up for English its a good way (imo) to have that feel of we're working together on learning each others language.

 

I did make it clear to her, however, that learning English would be so important to her transition here that for now we'll converse in English so she can learn faster. I assured her that after she is here, I would study Mandarin with more intensity and we would speak it at home some days so I could practice.

 

Her progress has really been dramatic and I've been very proud of her. We talk about 2 hours a day now without help. On a recent visit she was able to act as translator between her family and I and I think that has finally given her confidence that she really is doing well with English. We continue to work on livemocha.com and the other day she had a conversation with a 13 year old from Turkey who was hitting on her. I said this is good you learn to deal with this situation before you come to America!

 

When I visited last I brought her some children's books, Snow White and that sort of things and she was very happy to have these to read. We read them together and made sure she knew all the words. To show her fairness, I said I'd like her to do the same and she got me a little book to learn the names of vegetables and fruits. I figure that we'll continue this tradition of buying each other simple books that match our level of usage.

 

Sorry about the length. Just thought I'd throw out the various ways we dealt with this issue and maybe some will be helpful. Good luck!

 

Joe

[jim_julian]

Ken ... what kind of a six month English course was your wife enrolled in, in China?

 

Was it a traditional classroom environment one or two times a week? Maybe at night?

 

Was the instructor Chinese?

 

At the risk of generalizing we have not had too much luck with this kind of course in China. My wife attended and I sat in a few times. The quality of instruction was very poor. If your wife had this type of class I can understand why she became frustrated and quit.

 

We tried another kind of English course in China for our daughter. It was more of a total immersion. The school was open 15 hours a day, seven days a week. They gave you a placement test and then set you up in core classes. You could spend as much time at the school as you liked. In addition to the core classes there was computer assisted practice and instruction, conversation groups of various abilities and subjects, and English movies and TV shows. The staff was 50% non-Chinese, mostly from Australia, Canada, and the US. You had a counselor, progress tests, and progress reports. This kind of class was MUCH better and our daughter learned quite a bit. If your wife was in this type of school and quit you may have some worries.

 

English instruction in America also varies widely. Be wary of the local free ESL class, given by the public school system, and taught by folks that are barely qualified. Here in SoCal these course are dominated by Hispanics and there is more Spanish being spoken than English. Now my wife goes to English classes 4 days a week at the local Community College extension. Instructor quality is high. Only English is spoken. The students are much more motivated.

 

As many have observed above if she is going to become integrated, productive, and happy in America she must learn English. Good luck! Think positive! Be supportive!