Babies in China

[Guest R2D2]

Two things come to mind. Like Owen states, this is a third world country. When I used to go down to Mexico to do a little diving and deep sea fishing in the Sea of Cortez, The Mexican authorities alway had their hand out for a bribe and kick back. The man that issued the visas and had to type them up, did not know how to type until you put a dollar on the counter. Then he could type 120 words a minute. The other thing that comes to mind is that the Chinese authorities make a lot of money on westerners adopting babies. In order to do so, they must be charging exorbitant fees for expedited visas for those babies. You can check what the fee is, but I bet it is a lot more than what your wife told you. I would trust her over some trouble maker that you might find on an internet site. Just my 2 cents....

[Guest jimb]

I am from China.  I have seen this many times.  They all trusted.  I wish you luck.

you have personal experience?

jimb

[youmolide]

Actually both the process and the fee seem about right. When I lived in Shanghai I met a girl who had 5 ! brothers and sisters and she was the second oldest at 22 (her older sister was 23). I asked her how her parents pulled this off and her answer was that her father was very rich (and she was very spoiled and that he just paid the fee. The fee was about 20,000 to 25,000 rmb for each kid. As for the process. the 'bargaining' is a VERY normal thing in China ... you'd be amazed at what you can haggle for. So first, I would say your girl is a peach ... she was willing to bargain (she didnt have to you know ... she could have just picked a number out of a hat) and second she was willing to stand her ground for your future family. Sounds like a winner to me.

 

While I was in Shanghai I also saw a number of people get killed right near my house in traffic accidents. When I asked my friends they said that a taxi driver who killed someone had to pay a fine ... 20,000 rmb.

 

So there you have the price of a life in China ... about $ 2500 US. The Chinese can be very logical about these things.

 

[Guest jade_yan]

none of you get it, do you?

It's not Mexico, he isnt fishing. he is being reeled in. Its not the government. Yes they will get a share, thats how the system works. They wont get it all.

Yes, I have seen it a number of times. Not personal experience in the respect that I have done it, and I resent the anonymous implication. Maybe I am naieve, but I expect better.

[Dave G.]

none of you get it, do you?

It's not Mexico, he isnt fishing.  he is being reeled in.  Its not the government.  Yes they will get a share, thats how the system works.  They wont get it all.

Yes, I have seen it a number of times.  Not personal experience in the respect that I have done it, and I resent the anonymous implication. Maybe I am naieve, but I expect better.

I think I get it. Please don't get me wrong...I have loved all my adventures in China. The people, the sights, and that wonderful Sichuan food (hao la!). China is an ancient land with a rich history. But, they have a problem. They have one foot in the past and one planted firmly into the present. They want to tout the "hammer and sickle" philosophy while trying to enter the world of free trade and capitolism. Opposing ideals. Unfortunately, it is the great people of China who get stuck in the middle. They do what they can to survive.

 

I was told that even teachers in school get kickbacks, so to say. If a child misbehaves, he/she has to pay 5 RMB for "the crime." Teachers sell textbooks, for a small "handling fee." Why? Because the gov pays so little.

 

I tend to disagree that China is third world. Their economy is growing too fast and it is industrialized. Yet, from some conditions we've all seen suggests third world. Confusing, isn't it? Where is the money going? Well, it's not to the people, that's for sure.

 

I hate being conned. I hate being ripped off. But, who am I to try to change a culture's ways? I just do the best I can to keep my eyes open and minimize the damage. As my fiancee says, "The Chinese are very clever." She's right. That's why I found it is always better for a Chinese to negotiate with another Chinese. We just don't have a full understanding of the bartering process. Trust me...I tried and got eaten alive.

 

Good luck to all. What we're doing is no small feat....and it is even more complicated for some. But, because we fell in love with all these wonderful women, we also agreed to become a part of their world just as they agreed to physically and emotionally enter ours. Don't try to change it.....just do your best to get around it.

[konajim]

Hi Everyone.

From my story I posted today. if you read it you can tell I was being ripped off by a beautiful Chinese woman. It took me two years to figure it out. What I did find out she was ripping off several men at the same time. Even the Chinese father of her child. She was very innocent looking and acting very good at what she was doing. Maybe I lost 3 thousand dollars. Very cheap compared to what it could've been I feel lucky I found out. That is only one person and I know there are several. I would be very weary about meeting anyone on the internet. Especially if they ask for money. Good Chinese Girls do not ask men they are not married or at least engaed to for money. My Fiancee now I would trust with My Life. In fact I believe I am allready doing that or I would not marry her. There are many more good Loving, Trustworthy Chinese women. Then There are ones You can not trust. Just be careful. I feel for all of You with Children in the process that may be difficult to bring here. I wish You all The best. There is A child involved with My fiancee. But it is a long and difficult explaination that I can not talk about now. When I find out more I will tell You later. True Love Endures ALL.

Thank You Jim

[youmolide]

' ...I resent the anonymous implication'

 

 

YOU implied the man's PREGNANT fiance' is a liar and a cheat :

 

'no...no..no...i wasnt implying that the Chinese authorities was the only party attempting to rip him off!!!!!!!'

 

and when he calls you on it and asks you for some personal experience to back your assertion up, you get your feelings hurt.

 

That's pretty illogical, especially considering that several others have pointed out that what she has done is pretty much in line with current common practice in China.

 

I would say that if you are going to say nasty things about a man's pregnant fiance', you better damn sure have a LONG post citing either personal experience, or reasoned logical evidence to back it up. All you have provided in this forum are troll-like mini-posts with no content other than snide remarks and innuendo.

 

Just because you 'are from China' doesn't make you omniscient ... it just seems to have made you quite confused.

 

 

[Guest jade_yan]

all I said was be careful...just as konajom said. i know 10 people like konajim.

[Guest jade_yan]

youyomilde, sounds like you pay for love also! What happened to when love was free?

[Guest enight]

... ask for money doesn't mean she must be a bad gal,

 

... don't ask for money doesn't mean she must be a good gal either..

 

to judge a person so easily and quickly isn't a smart way,

 

besides...

 

in Chinese way, give money to support your fiancee (wife) especially they live in a poorer condition is a very decent, generous behavior,

 

... girls usually won't pick up a stingy admirer, and families won't be happy for the gal if she choose someone doesn't treat her fairly.

 

 

... this is nothing to do with 'buying' love!

[Dave G.]

youyomilde, sounds like you pay for love also!  What happened to when love was free?

Well, it’s interesting to see how this thread deteriorated from love and concern for unborn children to new parents into fears of mistrust and betrayal. I’m sorry some have been hurt before. I understand that pain can predispose us to seeing the world differently. If you have not come to terms with heartaches from the past, perhaps it is not fair to another person to become involved with them romantically. If malfeasance is suspected, you’ll communicate that overtly or covertly. You’ll never have a completely trusting relationship, so you’ll likely set yourself up for even more pain.

 

You are a member of this site, so I assume you are in the visa process. Correct? Tell us a little more about your situation. Then, tell us how in your situation you are a better judge of “Chinese character” than we are. Or, are you Chinese coming to America? If it’s as bad as you say, can we entrust you with all the personal information we post?

 

My fiancée carries our baby inside of her. We now have new responsibilities. She needs to go to doctors, buy maternity clothes, etc. Do I say, “Forget you…you handle it.”? Do I shirk my responsibility for the mother and baby because “Ooooo...maybe she’ll have a couple of extra RMB in her pocket after I send money.” No. This is an exciting time. We are learning even more about each other in the process and will be even better prepared for marriage.

 

If money is so precious for some, then stuff it in your mattress and have something to sleep with that will keep you warm at night. But then, when you are on your money filled death bed with no one to hold your hand when you breathe that last breath, you’ll say, “Oops....I think I made a boo-boo.”

[Guest enight]

I totally agree with Dave!

[Guest jade_yan]

as many yanks are fond of saying.....oops...my bad

[Dave G.]

All you have provided in this forum are troll-like mini-posts with no content other than snide remarks and innuendo.

 

That's it? "My bad"? You make such strong points only not to accept my invitation to share more about your situation so we can understand better. Perhaps the provided quote was more accurate than I realized.

[Guest jade_yan]

I think our perspectives are very, very different. I cannot help you understand.

All I ever said was that people should be carfeul. I feel a sense of sorrow for anyone who does not recognize the potential for abuse in the situation. It is not directed at you or anyone else in particular. Just a general comment.

I am very concerned at the level of defensiveness on this issue. There must be some deeply seeded personal misgivings on the part of those who lash out when a cautionary comment is made.