DCF Australia - Refused, Advice Please

[audelair]

It seems the one thing we were least worried about (the legitimacy of our relationship) was the one thing they didn't accept :-(

 

We had our interview in Sydney today (my chinese wife applied there). The VO simply did not believe in the legitimacy of our relationship. Here is the timeline of our relationship

 

- Met 9/2001 in China

- Became close friends when I lived there for about a year

- Left China and kept in touch by email and phone

- January 2005, decided to take our relationship further (romantic)

- March 2005, met for about 12 days in Norway/Denmark

- Talked on the phone for over an hour a day starting in March and until the day I arrived in Australia in July. (showed him phone logs)

- Got married in August

- Interview yesterday

 

He says they hesitate when issuing visas to people of lesser developed countries and found it unlikely that we had a bona fide relationship. I showed chatlogs, emails, and phone logs, and he said that it still didn't look legit to him.

 

There was still some administrative stuff they needed to do, but they said they cannot approve the visa, and that he would have to think about it. He mentioned that he might call Beijing to see how they would handle the situation (although, i think he'll end up talking to Guanzhou).

 

We asked what else we can offer, and he agreed that a written statement from us that describes our relationship might help. But given his demeanor and his attitude, we are incredibly pessimistic. We think this might lead to a rejection.

 

Can anyone offer any advice on how to handle this?

 

Thank you very much.

[The Jeff]

Pictures, photos of of him with your family and vice versa. Letters from your family members might help, too. Kissing pictures, perhaps a video...

 

Don't know really know about the Australian process, but it sure does sound like a lot of racist BS on the part of the VO.

[sailorboy]

Holy Cow!! Tell me this isn't so! First, I am so sorry you had this difficulty. Given your evidence (which seems a far cry better than mine), I am stunned he didn't believe you. In fact, it seems like this guy's a rookie or something if he has to call Beijing and find out what they would do in this case. I hope you find a way to overcome this.

 

I thought DCF was the easiest of all ways to get a visa. What's this guy trying to do, flex his power??? This sucks!

 

Now I'm starting to panic a little!!

 

Dave

[Randy W]

It seems incredulous to me that this guy could evaluate your marriage, and turn it down like that without a very specifc reason. How can he "simply not believe"?

 

Maybe you can appeal to someone else at the consulate?

 

What a nightmare!

Edited September 13, 2005 by Randy W (see edit history)

[david_dawei]

I'm shocked ! Hard to believe they are questioning the marriage...

 

I don't recall all your details.. have you been together since your marriage? If not, maybe they question why not.

 

All I can think for evidence is letters from people stating knowledge of the long relationship, and more pictures with the family.. any exchanges of letters with family from her ?? And any letters from her family (probably needing to be translated).

 

I guess on a certain level, one can see their concern as a consulate in lesser developed country folk showing up at their doorstep... in a sense, side stepping their country process... but I would say that they are simply not exposed to enough of them and so hesitate on how to deal with it (ergo, they want to talk to a embassy in China).

[audelair]

I'm shocked ! Hard to believe they are questioning the marriage...

 

I don't recall all your details.. have you been together since your marriage? If not, maybe they question why not.

 

All I can think for evidence is letters from people stating knowledge of the long relationship, and more pictures with the family.. any exchanges of letters with family from her ??  And any letters from her family (probably needing to be translated).

 

I guess on a certain level, one can see their concern as a consulate in lesser developed country folk showing up at their doorstep... in a sense, side stepping their country process... but I would say that they are simply not exposed to enough of them and so hesitate on how to deal with it (ergo, they want to talk to a embassy in China).

153643[/snapback]

thanks for the advice everyone. as far as the details of our relationship, we've been living together since July and plan on living together in Australia until January, and then return to the U.S. together.

 

We plan on typing out a timeline of our relationship for the consulate, and can provide more details.

 

thanks for all the advice on overcome evidence. we plan on doing all of those, but pictures are minimal unfortunately. Neither of us thought of taking many pictures back then :-(

[david_dawei]

I don't think a ton of pictures are necessary.. any little bit helps.. any receipts from everything you did together... Was there restaurants you frequented alot... Other shopkeepers who got to know you two.. get a letter from them, etc. Best to you.

[audelair]

Thanks for the encouragement and ideas, guys.

 

I posted this on Visajourney, which is a recap of what happened...

 

------

 

the CO was initially skeptical as to our legitimacy as a couple. Mainly because we started off as a platonic relationship for years before becoming intimate. My wife and I always felt that this is why we have such a strong relationship, because we know each other and trust each other so much. But the CO had a negative perspective on it.

 

He asked me if her parents paid me to marry her, to which I said no.

 

He asked for evidence of a bona fide relationship. I provided the following, and unfortunately, he did not give it more than a glance before handing them back:

- about 70 pictures of us from 2001 until the present

- chatlogs over the past 9 months or so

- emails from 2002 until present

- phone logs over a 5 month period, showing an average hour per day phone conversation from overseas.

 

After all this, he still was not convinced, since our "intimate" relationship happened relatively recently and occurred mostly over the phone as detailed here:

- After 3+ years of friendship, we took our relationship to the next level last January 2005. Because we were so close as friends, it escalated fast. I also already knew i wanted to spend the rest of my life with her before I even asked her if she loved me.

- In March, I visited her for about 2 weeks. We decided to get married

- I came back to the states, preparing to live with her in Australia for the duration of her studies there (6 months). I took a leave of absense from work and arrived end of July 2005. Got married August 2nd, 2005 and have been living with her since.

 

the CO said the 2 weeks together in March was not enough, and that it seems that I am just doing her a favor to go to the U.S.

 

He asked for more evidence of a bona fide relationship, and unfortunately that was all we had.

 

He told us: "I'll have to think about it. From what you say, it sounds like a wonderful relationship, but I find it highly unlikely to be true."

 

I asked him if there was anything else I could do, and he told me there was administrative processing to be done anyway.

 

I asked him if a statement of our relationship would help, and he told us to include a timeline and to fax it to the office, which we are working on right now.

 

They initially were going to hold onto her passport to wait for the administrative processing, but because the interview was not passed, he said that he would hand us back the passports, which he did, and that they would contact us.

 

I asked again what we can do, and he said nothing. He said he might call Beijing to see how they would handle such a case, but right now, he's not convinced of a bona fide relationship.

 

I think that covers it, but please let me know if there are any details I missed.

 

----

 

The 221g that I got from them did not say anything at all about the lack of a bona fide relationship. It did say that there was administrative processing that needed to be done. Their exact words was that "We need to contact Washington and wait for a response".

 

And also, they returned the passports which to me, meant they weren't ready to issue a visa.

 

Any idea what happened, and where we are in the process? Does the 221g usually mention something about a bona fide relationship needing to be proven, or do I just have to take it verbally from the VO?

 

thanks again, for everything.

[audelair]

and one more thing... another thing i posted on visajourney which we are considering...

 

---

I was just having lunch with my wife and talking about how desperate we are to be able to be together in the U.S. and plan our future. We thought of what kind of "drastic" measures we would be willing to take. A few ideas popped in our heads, and it sounded to us like it might be ridiculous, bordering on insane, to propose these to the consulate. But we so badly want her to pass (and not have to reapply next year in China and wait) that we'd be willing to do anything to prove our legitimate love for each other.

 

The ideas were:

- Find some way to swear before a notary or something under perjury of law that our relationship is legitimate, and perhaps find some way to set a condition on it... i.e. if we get divorced in 10 years, for instance... or if we get divorced EVER, we'd be subject to imprisonment or something? is this even possible to do????

- We were planning on having a baby soon, but for obvious reasons, wanted to take care of the visa and return to the U.S. with a secure job with good healthcare, before conceiving. Would it be crazy to propose to the consulate that we'd be willing to conceive early and send the doctor's report? This is something we'd only be willing to do, if it was a guaranteed visa, since I can't take the risk of being left stranded without a visa, with no decent outlook for our future, and a pregnant wife!

 

Anyway, hope we're not going off the deepend here. And of course, we're going to do the normal routes of having friends write testimonials, etc., before we would go the next step, but I just wanted to have some ideas thrown around as to how other people might approach this.

 

My wife and I also agreed that we have the truth on our side, and given enough time, we would surely pass. But we're afraid that the consulate just doesn't want to approve us, and is planning to just drag their feet with this "administrative process" they are talking about, and wait for us to leave Australia. We feel so robbed. The consulate practically invited us to apply as a 3rd country national under a student visa, saying it was perfectly okay. They were so courteous in their correspondence. And now the "3rd country national under a student visa" is their main criteria for questioning our relationship!

 

Thanks again for any insight.

---

 

we're pretty much open to anything that might be helpful in proving our relationship. Has anyone done anything drastic that really helped, or is the standard stuff like pictures, testimonials, etc? We're just so afraid of losing everything we've done and leaving Australia and not being able to continue in GZ, and end up starting all over :-(

[beijingjenny]

so sorry! that's horrible. maybe she should get preg, that always helps.... seriously though, he sounds worse than all those at GZ.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

We asked what else we can offer, and he agreed that a written statement from us that describes our relationship might help. But given his demeanor and his attitude, we are incredibly pessimistic. We think this might lead to a rejection.

 

Can anyone offer any advice on how to handle this?

 

Thank you very much.

153599[/snapback]

I would take photos of him, tape his conversations. Do not lose contact with him. This guy needs to be exposed.

[audelair]

What kind of responses have you gotten from brits and VJ?

 

Personally, I'd hold off on the affidavits you mentioned. It seems to me that would muddy the waters more.

 

On the documentation you are preparing to submit, rather than faxing it in, take it to the consulate and have them notarize it. Prepare a place on the bottom for them with sworn statment language. I don't recall it off the top of my head, but I think a couple members here know it by heart. Hopefully one of them will give you the verbiage.

154016[/snapback]

Lots of encouragement and ideas on VJ. Similar ideas about testomonies from friends and a few perspectives on what might be happening. Someone considered that perhaps it is just cage rattling and we have nothing to worry about? Hard to say, i suppose. I have not posted on Brits yet. I will post on there tomorrow.

 

As for bringing documents to the consulate, it is hard for 2 reasons. We are far away from Sydney, and don't have the time to fly there right now, as my wife is busy with her studies and assignments. Plus, it is expensive for us to keep travelling. Also, we need an appointment to get into the consulate, except on Thursday morning walk-ins and she has classes on Thursdays. I think we will fax for now, and say that all statements are available to be notarized if needed.

 

Hopefully we can at least get a response after they get a few testimonies.

[audelair]

We asked what else we can offer, and he agreed that a written statement from us that describes our relationship might help. But given his demeanor and his attitude, we are incredibly pessimistic. We think this might lead to a rejection.

 

Can anyone offer any advice on how to handle this?

 

Thank you very much.

153599[/snapback]

I would take photos of him, tape his conversations. Do not lose contact with him. This guy needs to be exposed.

154017[/snapback]

There's no way we'd get through security with a camera and tape recorder. They are very strict there. And if we pull out a camera, there is no way we are walking out of there, unfortunately.

[david_dawei]

Your living together.. how can anything be more drastic evidence than that ?

 

I would not do the statement idea as it looks desperate and not what they want to see (ie: desperation)... The worst case is possibly to reapply later , after more time living together ??

[bearbear]

Audelair, I think you got enough evidence to prove your relationship. It's not fair they refused to issue your visa. My evidence is even worse, we only have less than 10 emails, we don't chat online. We plan to get a phone log, but the phone number wasn't registered under our names, before marrying, we lived with parents. What else can I present to the VO other than pictures? I'm getting nervous.

 

I wish you luck. God bless.