Recent Divorce and Red Flags

[Roebel]

I started the K-1 process in September. Since then I have learned that being recently divorced is a red flag.

 

I met my fiancee online in June of this year while being separated, and my divorce was final in mid-August. My ex-wife (also an American) had a job that required travel (it's how I became interested in China) and she spent most of her time in the U.K. over the last year making it difficult to fit in the court dates to finalize everything. Also I have no children from the marriage.

 

So my question is, is this a reason for concern? Or is it more significant when the beneficiary is recently divorced?

 

Also there is an age gap with my fiancee, but on the positive side, she speaks excellent English and should be able to explain the situation if needed.

 

So my concern is the divorce and also the speed of the relationship with my new found love. Even though we have only known each other since June we have either texted, or video chatted on Skype twice a day for hours since meeting. We have gotten to know each other so well that we are now watching videos, reading stories to each other, and asking trivia questions just to keep the conversation going. I have hundreds of pages of chat logs if needed. I think we have ask and answered just about every personal and relationship question possible. Also, we spent two weeks together in late August, and we will meet again in late November for another two weeks.

 

This is my first attempt at sponsoring anyone for a visa.

 

Any input is greatly appreciated.

[Sam and Fen]

I am no expert on this topic and Dan is probably the best person to give you advise.

Here's my 2 cents

 

My divorce was finalized in August 08, I met my now wife in October of 08 and went to meet her in November of 08 , filed for K1 in Feb 09 and went to see her again in June 09 and again for the Interview in October 09. (It has been a long time so the dates might be a little off).

 

We basically sailed thru the process.

 

I have no proof of this but here is why I think we sailed thru:

 

1. My first marriage lasted 19 years.

2. My divorce decree only had child support payments and based on my income that was not an issue.

3. My credit score was in the top 15%

4. My fiancées first marriage lasted 9 years and it was almost 6 years after her divorce that we met and also she had a very good Government job in China. I think this was probably the #1 reason why we had no issues.

 

Every case is different and there is no one size fits all.

IMO you meeting your fiancée before the divorce was finalized could be a Red Flag.

 

Good Luck in your journey.

[dnoblett]

Only issue at this point is you are asking this question after filing the I-129F, a recommendation is to attached to the petition filing a letter documenting relationship and exposing the possible issues to USCIS.

 

A good read from Marc Ellis: http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0323-ellis.shtm

[Roebel]

Only issue at this point is you are asking this question after filing the I-129F, a recommendation is to attached to the petition filing a letter documenting relationship and exposing the possible issues to USCIS.

 

A good read from Marc Ellis: http://www.ilw.com/a...0323-ellis.shtm

 

So is this a major concern, minor concern, is there a possibility it won't even be mentioned?

 

And the documentation mention is something I should have attached to the I-129F?

 

Would it help to have a letter of explanation at the interview?

 

I could even get a letter from my ex-spouse stating the she was out of the country which delayed the process, we are on good terms.

[david_dawei]

This is one of those questions where "Yes-No" cannot apply... it "depends" on so many factors based on trends; in other words, what is the pulse of the consulate and the actual VO she will get 8 months from now and what day of the week is it and did they get their morning coffee hot enough, etc. We see the completely explainable and explainable in regards to such issues.

 

As Dan suggests, the best practice is to show knowledge of some issues with the initial filing of the I-129F. The reason this is missed by most is actually not a surprise since we do not recommend it for USCIS (who only cares if you qualify) but for GUZ, who will get the case file and thus an explanation of the issues. But at this point, it is not really necessary to talk about 'what should of been done' but rather what can be done now.

 

In general, previous marriages and timing to that divorce, fast courtships, fast filings, age difference, her city, her lack of english, her age, your income, may be 'unwritten' considerations but interview trends over the years show they can matter in some cases... and emphasis is on a moving target called, some cases.

 

Also in general, time together is more important than any amount of log files or emails you want to claim... 10,000 emails don't compare to a month together. So don't get any high hopes that the VOs care to see you produce 100 lbs of evidence since they don't care about evidence one wants to impress by volume; Time together is the one thing that seems to be the best indicator among the various factors at work. Since you have 2 trips already you are showing yourself to be different and that is a plus. If you can go one more time before the interview then you have set yourself apart even more.

 

My personal opinion having tracked interviews for many, many years now is that this is the best evidence to give them, absent a long relationship; time together. We have seen them deny people in suggesting they need to spend more time together first... and file again later. It is never quote spoken that way but that is their point. They don't always trust the fast relationship given the relationships they see come through each day/month/year claiming 'new found love'. They are realists and not optimists. I advise people to play their cards the same way.

 

What you can do:

1. Continue as you are... talk, chat and learn more about each other. Ultimately she is the one who faces the VO and answers the questions. She needs to know your life more intimately than you might think.

2. For the interview, you can prepare the kind of letter we said should go in the I-129F which is called an EOR "Evolution of Relationship". I would post it here for review (or in PM if you want to keep it private) and get some feedback... but you don't need to do this till closer to the interview as you'll have more time together at that point.

3. You should have your prior wife's complete information including contact info and SSN ready to hand over at the interview.

4. Pictures, pictures, pictures... varying settings of informal pictures are the best. She should have about 20 of the best for the interview...

5. Visit again if you can.

6. Prepare your fiancee mentally and psychologically that the interview is simply a review of the process and they will decide if it is ok to go to US now or you need to do something more... Most everyone thinks way too much like this is an entitlement; make sure you do let her simply rest on some belief that she should get this without any issue. This is not meant to be a worry to her. It is very simple: You applied and they decide something. Don't let it get emotional nor personal. Your life goal is to be together in the US and this is but one step you need to do... and the interview will let you know what is next. It is that simple. If they give the visa, she can come. If they deny or ask for info or whatever.... don't sweat it as unexpected... you do what they say to do... She needs to think of this as an important step (be prepared for the interview) and acceptance of the outcome (be prepared to pursuit the direction they say you need to go).

[david_dawei]

I going to post again as to the idea of 'red flags' but I won't go into my usual grilling to you... but simply:

1. what is the age difference (each age)

2. what city is she from

3. does she have previous marriage/children

4. why is her english so good

5. has she traveled outside of china to other countries

[dnoblett]

At interview the consulate has been known to request an EOR "evolution of relationship" letter.

 

Letter should detail prior relationship how it ended and how you met your fianc¨¦e.

 

A visit while I-129F is processing would help.

[Roebel]

I going to post again as to the idea of 'red flags' but I won't go into my usual grilling to you... but simply:

1. what is the age difference (each age)

2. what city is she from

3. does she have previous marriage/children

4. why is her english so good

5. has she traveled outside of china to other countries

 

1. I am 45, she is 22.

2. Foshan, but attending University in another city.

3. No

4. She has studied English throughout her schooling and is a member of the English society in her University.

5. She went with me to Thailand for a week.

 

I appreciate the help!

[knloregon]

Age here with the other considerations could be a problem.

 

My opinion, (from here-say mostly) is that a recent divorce, coupled with a much younger Chinese woman is inherently suspect --- the theory being that you are on the rebound, and thus, vulnerable to a visa scam. Coupled with that, is your limited contact with her in China.

 

Personally, if I were in your position, I'd put it off until you can spend more time with her in China, and build a better case for a committed relationship. ----Her good English is very much on the plus side. Still, if I were you, I'd spend more time in China to build a better case --- and yes, my wife is substantially younger than I am...

 

Remember, its the long experience here at the Candle, that some Consulate rejections, are never overcome.

[Roebel]

This is one of those questions where "Yes-No" cannot apply... it "depends" on so many factors based on trends; in other words, what is the pulse of the consulate and the actual VO she will get 8 months from now and what day of the week is it and did they get their morning coffee hot enough, etc. We see the completely explainable and explainable in regards to such issues.

 

As Dan suggests, the best practice is to show knowledge of some issues with the initial filing of the I-129F. The reason this is missed by most is actually not a surprise since we do not recommend it for USCIS (who only cares if you qualify) but for GUZ, who will get the case file and thus an explanation of the issues. But at this point, it is not really necessary to talk about 'what should of been done' but rather what can be done now.

 

In general, previous marriages and timing to that divorce, fast courtships, fast filings, age difference, her city, her lack of english, her age, your income, may be 'unwritten' considerations but interview trends over the years show they can matter in some cases... and emphasis is on a moving target called, some cases.

 

Also in general, time together is more important than any amount of log files or emails you want to claim... 10,000 emails don't compare to a month together. So don't get any high hopes that the VOs care to see you produce 100 lbs of evidence since they don't care about evidence one wants to impress by volume; Time together is the one thing that seems to be the best indicator among the various factors at work. Since you have 2 trips already you are showing yourself to be different and that is a plus. If you can go one more time before the interview then you have set yourself apart even more.

 

My personal opinion having tracked interviews for many, many years now is that this is the best evidence to give them, absent a long relationship; time together. We have seen them deny people in suggesting they need to spend more time together first... and file again later. It is never quote spoken that way but that is their point. They don't always trust the fast relationship given the relationships they see come through each day/month/year claiming 'new found love'. They are realists and not optimists. I advise people to play their cards the same way.

 

What you can do:

1. Continue as you are... talk, chat and learn more about each other. Ultimately she is the one who faces the VO and answers the questions. She needs to know your life more intimately than you might think.

2. For the interview, you can prepare the kind of letter we said should go in the I-129F which is called an EOR "Evolution of Relationship". I would post it here for review (or in PM if you want to keep it private) and get some feedback... but you don't need to do this till closer to the interview as you'll have more time together at that point.

3. You should have your prior wife's complete information including contact info and SSN ready to hand over at the interview.

4. Pictures, pictures, pictures... varying settings of informal pictures are the best. She should have about 20 of the best for the interview...

5. Visit again if you can.

6. Prepare your fiancee mentally and psychologically that the interview is simply a review of the process and they will decide if it is ok to go to US now or you need to do something more... Most everyone thinks way too much like this is an entitlement; make sure you do let her simply rest on some belief that she should get this without any issue. This is not meant to be a worry to her. It is very simple: You applied and they decide something. Don't let it get emotional nor personal. Your life goal is to be together in the US and this is but one step you need to do... and the interview will let you know what is next. It is that simple. If they give the visa, she can come. If they deny or ask for info or whatever.... don't sweat it as unexpected... you do what they say to do... She needs to think of this as an important step (be prepared for the interview) and acceptance of the outcome (be prepared to pursuit the direction they say you need to go).

 

 

Thanks for the detailed response.This sounds like the most reasonable and logical way to handle this, I will follow the steps that you suggest. I'll visit as many times as possible, and hopefully there will be as much as 6-8 weeks of quality time together with lots of pictures before the interview date. Also I will make sure everything is organized and that she has the EOR letter in hand when she goes to the interview (i read somewhere it's a good idea to hand it off right in the beginning).

 

I don't wand to focus on the negative, but being prepared as much as possible is just the smart thing to do. On the upside we have some positive things going for us, so hopefully being prepared will help tilt the scales in our favor.

[david_dawei]

Age here with the other considerations could be a problem.

 

My opinion, (from here-say mostly) is that a recent divorce, coupled with a much younger Chinese woman is inherently suspect --- the theory being that you are on the rebound, and thus, vulnerable to a visa scam. Coupled with that, is your limited contact with her in China.

 

Personally, if I were in your position, I'd put it off until you can spend more time with her in China, and build a better case for a committed relationship. ----Her good English is very much on the plus side. Still, if I were you, I'd spend more time in China to build a better case --- and yes, my wife is substantially younger than I am...

 

Remember, its the long experience here at the Candle, that some Consulate rejections, are never overcome.

I think this is spot-on advice but difficult at this point to withdraw the file and explain it... but there is cause for concern more than other cases.

 

The VOs know better than anyone that a US man is a ticket out of china and a young girl with very good english would know this too. At times, there are perceptions formed, whether true or not. It is hard to overcome this but all one can do is be assured of their life decisions and file and do the best they can.

[Roebel]

Age here with the other considerations could be a problem.

 

My opinion, (from here-say mostly) is that a recent divorce, coupled with a much younger Chinese woman is inherently suspect --- the theory being that you are on the rebound, and thus, vulnerable to a visa scam. Coupled with that, is your limited contact with her in China.

 

Personally, if I were in your position, I'd put it off until you can spend more time with her in China, and build a better case for a committed relationship. ----Her good English is very much on the plus side. Still, if I were you, I'd spend more time in China to build a better case --- and yes, my wife is substantially younger than I am...

 

Remember, its the long experience here at the Candle, that some Consulate rejections, are never overcome.

I think this is spot-on advice but difficult at this point to withdraw the file and explain it... but there is cause for concern more than other cases.

 

The VOs know better than anyone that a US man is a ticket out of china and a young girl with very good english would know this too. At times, there are perceptions formed, whether true or not. It is hard to overcome this but all one can do is be assured of their life decisions and file and do the best they can.

 

Yes I am confident in the relationship. I have no worries about her intentions, but it doesn't mean others will see it that way.

 

If there is a denial, what can we expect to happen? Is there possibility she can never come here?

[Roebel]

Age here with the other considerations could be a problem.

 

My opinion, (from here-say mostly) is that a recent divorce, coupled with a much younger Chinese woman is inherently suspect --- the theory being that you are on the rebound, and thus, vulnerable to a visa scam. Coupled with that, is your limited contact with her in China.

 

Personally, if I were in your position, I'd put it off until you can spend more time with her in China, and build a better case for a committed relationship. ----Her good English is very much on the plus side. Still, if I were you, I'd spend more time in China to build a better case --- and yes, my wife is substantially younger than I am...

 

Remember, its the long experience here at the Candle, that some Consulate rejections, are never overcome.

 

By putting it off do you mean I should cancel the petition? or just delay the interview?

[warpedbored]

Put yourself in the VO's shoes and wonder, what does a 22 year old woman see in a man twice her age? A 23 year age difference between a 55 year old and 32 year old is different that a 45/22. It is also my opinion that the maturity level of an American 22 year old and Chinese 22 year old is much different. Americans encourage individualism and self reliance. Most 22 year old Chinese I have met are at about the same level as a 16-18 year old American.

[Roebel]

Put yourself in the VO's shoes and wonder, what does a 22 year old woman see in a man twice her age? A 23 year age difference between a 55 year old and 32 year old is different that a 45/22. It is also my opinion that the maturity level of an American 22 year old and Chinese 22 year old is much different. Americans encourage individualism and self reliance. Most 22 year old Chinese I have met are at about the same level as a 16-18 year old American.

 

I understand the perception. But the reality is that she is more mature than her age. I have fought with that issue myself since we met, and the more sure I become about her, the more the visa issue seems to be the problem.

 

Is there away through this? Is it an impossible situation?