U.S. or China

[slw268]

 

If you have a flexible personality, then go for it - try living abroad. If you're stuck in your ways, save yourself the pain, and stay where you are.

 

I think that's some of the best advice I've seen on this board, and goes for anywhere -- not just China.

Yep. I can't handle more than a few weeks and I'm more than ready to leave. Couldn't live there on a bet.

Knew I wasn't the only one. B)

[david_dawei]

Having a heart attack and being allowed to die in the waiting room because you don't have the cash in your pocket to pay for treatment at that specific moment is not about having an open mind.

Use common sense. If your a candidate for a heart attack, don't leave the US. That would include most

[bullmastiff]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

[Randy W]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

 

 

Former Chinese citizens can, at any time, renounce their foreign citizenship and regain their Chinese citizenship, apparently at the discretion of the local authorities.

 

It is MUCH more difficult for a (born) foreigner to gain citizenship.

[weiaijiayou]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

If you had to go back that far and do that much research to learn about one possible case of it happening (and in this alleged case it was even a Chinese born foreigner), I'd guess it's pretty darn rare! Even without knowing anything else about the issue, I assume that since China does not recognize dual citizenship, you would first of all need to renounce your US citizenship. As for the requirements, given how hard it is to get a Chinese "green card," I assume you would need to make some serious investments or do something very special related to China. (again, since this is an inference, I could be wrong. for example, maybe you can get citizenship easily based on need -- e.g., if you are a refugee.) I don't even think Dashan is a Chinese citizen...

[JamesnYuHong]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

If you had to go back that far and do that much research to learn about one possible case of it happening (and in this alleged case it was even a Chinese born foreigner), I'd guess it's pretty darn rare! Even without knowing anything else about the issue, I assume that since China does not recognize dual citizenship, you would first of all need to renounce your US citizenship. As for the requirements, given how hard it is to get a Chinese "green card," I assume you would need to make some serious investments or do something very special related to China. (again, since this is an inference, I could be wrong. for example, maybe you can get citizenship easily based on need -- e.g., if you are a refugee.) I don't even think Dashan is a Chinese citizen...

 

Some people with connections to Hong Kong obtain or reclaim Chinese citizenship. They generally, but not always, have Chinese roots. There is a pretty famous caucausian, can't remember his name, who took Hong Kong Chinese citizenship.

 

On the mainland, I think demand is pretty low for citizenship. For someone without roots in China, I think it would be awkward, because what hukou would you go into? In China, social/administrative stuff always goes back to the hukou. Without it, you'd be like an unperson.

[weiaijiayou]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

If you had to go back that far and do that much research to learn about one possible case of it happening (and in this alleged case it was even a Chinese born foreigner), I'd guess it's pretty darn rare! Even without knowing anything else about the issue, I assume that since China does not recognize dual citizenship, you would first of all need to renounce your US citizenship. As for the requirements, given how hard it is to get a Chinese "green card," I assume you would need to make some serious investments or do something very special related to China. (again, since this is an inference, I could be wrong. for example, maybe you can get citizenship easily based on need -- e.g., if you are a refugee.) I don't even think Dashan is a Chinese citizen...

 

Some people with connections to Hong Kong obtain or reclaim Chinese citizenship. They generally, but not always, have Chinese roots. There is a pretty famous caucausian, can't remember his name, who took Hong Kong Chinese citizenship.

 

On the mainland, I think demand is pretty low for citizenship. For someone without roots in China, I think it would be awkward, because what hukou would you go into? In China, social/administrative stuff always goes back to the hukou. Without it, you'd be like an unperson.

I doubt if citizenship is an option for bullmastiff, but if it were, I suppose he could be added to his spouse's hukou?

[bullmastiff]

article 7 of PRC Nationality Laws covers foreigners who choose naturalization route. Not clear what are the steps involved in naturalization . Do they have to be a permanent residence first for x number of years , having good moral characters, passed the civic tests..... etc..... not clear at all what is it all about ???

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationality_L...public_of_China

[Kwyjibo]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

Were you were referring to Qian Xuesen?

[weiaijiayou]

article 7 of PRC Nationality Laws covers foreigners who choose naturalization route. Not clear what are the steps involved in naturalization . Do they have to be a permanent residence first for x number of years , having good moral characters, passed the civic tests..... etc..... not clear at all what is it all about ???

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationality_L...public_of_China

Are you thinking about trying to do this or are you just curious?

[GDBILL]

Out of curiousity , are there any foreigners who get Chinese citizenship ??? what countries are they from ? What are the requirements ??? If my history reading is correct, at the end of Korean war, there was an Chinese born American physicist who went back to China and reembarce his old citizenship.

If you had to go back that far and do that much research to learn about one possible case of it happening (and in this alleged case it was even a Chinese born foreigner), I'd guess it's pretty darn rare! Even without knowing anything else about the issue, I assume that since China does not recognize dual citizenship, you would first of all need to renounce your US citizenship. As for the requirements, given how hard it is to get a Chinese "green card," I assume you would need to make some serious investments or do something very special related to China. (again, since this is an inference, I could be wrong. for example, maybe you can get citizenship easily based on need -- e.g., if you are a refugee.) I don't even think Dashan is a Chinese citizen...

 

You do need to renounce your current citizenship so that would pretty much be a deal-breaker for US citizens.

 

Other than that, the immigration law states you have to have something like "strong ties" to China. Like most everything else here, they can probably define it to suit themselves and their preconceived racist ideas.

Edited May 19, 2010 by GDBILL (see edit history)

[GDBILL]

Cons

 

1.) Cost of living is not so low if you plan to buy a home.

 

2.) With the "liveliness" of China comes a loss of the private, "live and let live" type of life you can expect in the west. Everyone is into everyone else's business. And life is a complicated, sometimes tiresome web of who's looking down on whom, who has more money than whom, who's gaining face, who's losing face, who has "guanxi," who's high-class and who's low-class.

 

3.) Friendship is also a bit different. Hanging out with buddies on equal terms is less common. Friends need to be useful, and if someone befriends you, you can bet they are looking for ways in which you can be useful. If they find that you aren't, you may find that they stop coming around.

 

4.) Teaching English does not pay all that well. It is possible to make a decent income, but you may need to work hard building up a base of private students or get an additional degree in order to qualify for the top-flight jobs.

 

5.) Health care is an issue. Better have some cash savings just in case. Don't count on any hospital saying, "Let's save this guy's life first, we'll sort out payment issues later!" You may be able to buy insurance on the private market, but in an emergency, it may not do you much good.

 

6.) No one is going to set up a 401k for you in China, let alone give you matching funds, so you have to be very mindful of saving for your own retirement.

 

7.) By the way, while in China, you are most likely not paying into U.S. Social Security. Years you don't pay in bring down your overall average earnings, thus lowering your eventual check. (You can, however, pay in from China if you work for an American company or are self-employed.)

 

8.) China still does not "welcome" foreign spouses from a visa perspective. You cannot expect any permanency unless you get one of the relatively rare "green cards." Otherwise, you are on a year-to-year basis, always with the possibility that you will be kicked out of the country due to policy changes or whatever other reason. You will also never be eligible for any of China's social welfare programs, such as pensions. Not that China is rich in social welfare, but just sayin'.

 

9.) You will never, ever fit into Chinese society. It doesn't matter how long you stay, how well you speak Chinese, how successful you become. You will always be an outsider and be thought of as kind of cartoonish. Your opinions and ways of doing things will never be considered up to par, since they aren't Chinese.

(Think about how this contrasts with the United States, where foreigners can stay permanently, get the same jobs as Americans, enjoy the same rights, get the same benefits at work and from the government.)

 

10.) China's pollution may be harmful to your health, as may be the traffic.

 

Earning money may be an issue. Although one is not supposed to work without a proper work visa, many do. Although the chances of getting caught are slim, if you are unlucky enough to get nailed expect to get FITA.

 

As James stated, any work other than teaching English is extremely hard to come by. I have friends who teach English and 100% of them say that after a while it gets old dealing with employers and constant search for new jobs. They also say the pay is ok, but nothing great and they can almost never fit in with other expats here who are not teachers.

 

#9. Excellent analysis. I might add a word or two about racism. Although people will be nice to you, there are certain things that they just don't let you do because you are not Chinese. Try obtaining life or health insurance or obtaining credit from a bank.

[knloregon]

One (possible) way to be 'employed' in China is to be the American manager of a Chinese/American (family) company.... been a couple of years since we explored that, but at the time, the basic formula was this: Incorporate (Ltd.) in HK, set up the business there, once legit, allowing for a nearly seamless entry into the mainland, particularly Guangdong. Issues of bringing capital (USD) into HK were not that hard, if it was 'family' money. The Chinese family (majority stock holders) had discretion in hiring the manager, and it would pass muster to hire an American if the business required trade between the two countries...

 

It may have changed since, but that was a conceivable way to get your foot in the door, and actually have some control over your business destiny as an American in China----at least at that time..

[Kyle]

#9. Excellent analysis. I might add a word or two about racism. Although people will be nice to you, there are certain things that they just don't let you do because you are not Chinese. Try obtaining life or health insurance or obtaining credit from a bank.

 

 

I was able to get health insurance through my school, but it didn't amount to much. Anyone would be foolish not to consider traveler's insurance in their budget. We used liaison international

 

http://www.sevencorners.com/insuranceplans/travelmedical/

 

I was able to get a credit card from Citic bank. I do generally agree though with your point 9. Foreigners are generally not accepted as equals within Chinese society, at least not where we lived. Thankfully though, my wife's family did accept me as an equal part of their family - which to me was the most important status to achieve.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Kyle (see edit history)

[JamesnYuHong]

#9. Excellent analysis. I might add a word or two about racism. Although people will be nice to you, there are certain things that they just don't let you do because you are not Chinese. Try obtaining life or health insurance or obtaining credit from a bank.

 

 

I was able to get health insurance through my school, but it didn't amount to much. Anyone would be foolish not to consider traveler's insurance in their budget. We used liaison international

 

http://www.sevencorners.com/insuranceplans/travelmedical/

 

I was able to get a credit card from Citic bank. I do generally agree though with your point 9. Foreigners are generally not accepted as equals within Chinese society, at least not where we lived. Thankfully though, my wife's family did accept me as an equal part of their family - which to me was the most important status to achieve.

 

Was your wife able to be covered on the traveler's insurance? I had thought that that type of insurance only covered people who are outside their home country.