Homersimpson

[RogerJune]

Reading your post made me anxious about my upcoming visit to GUz. I feel so bad for you because I know how tough it has been waiting all this time...one year....for this process to take its course. I remember how ticked off I was when June got denied for a visitor visa and all we wanted was an opportunity for her to meet my parents and family. How naive I was back then! Now, after finding CFL, I know one can be well prepared and they still don't give you due diligence. I'll pray for you guys and your patience. I'll pray that your overcome will be effective and you guys will finally be together.

[DongDong]

I am sorry to hear this, homersimpsons. Best of luck and I hope there is quick resolution.

[Richard & Li]

You have our sympathy as well.

 

There is some good advice here, i.e.: Handle this with a cool head.

 

It's not over, just delayed.

[steveandrong]

Sorry to hear that.....I can also feel your pain.....we got blue also.

All these blues makes me blue, too. Why? So many time lines seems pretty normal and straightforward: common ways of meeting; frequent visits; lots of time.

 

I hope all of yours turn out as ours did (with a visa) but not with all the agony before the ecstasy.

 

In answer to the KTV question: my wife knew what KTV was, but not the John Denver song. It couldn't be (but it should be) "Almost Heaven", so which one is it?

yes....that's the one

[IllinoisDave]

Homer,

Sorry to hear about your blue result. I've been reading both of your threads and am a little confused and have a couple questions. You got pink at the interview but when you went to pick it up you had the blue slip correct? Your wife was only asked a couple questions at the interview. You wrote that one was: "1.) Do you know your husband lives in the USA?" Is that actually what the question was or was it: "Do you know WHERE your husband lives in the USA?"

 

Then your wife was asked how you met and she said through her uncle in San Fran. Others may disagree, but to me this might raise a red flag for a VO. But, according to your posts, you got the pink from that VO at the interview right? That strikes me as pretty strange given the fact that you got blue later. Not questioning it, just seems weird.

 

I assume from the limited info in your posts that you're Chinese born and your family has been living here since 1979 correct?

 

Assuming I've got my facts straight I'll just throw out there my opinion about what may have happened and why you ultimately got the blue. I could be way off. It's all just my opinion.

 

First,I think that either the VO your wife saw either had major second thoughts after the interview or obviously someone else did. I think at least part of the reason has to do with the fact that you're Chinese and that your wife indicated that you met through her relative in the States. As unfair as it would be, I think this may have raised a HUGE red flag with somebody, maybe that VOs supervisor post-interview? Asking if you had family in China adds to this point I think.

 

I think the VO looked at your pictures and financial docs and was satisfied,at least at the time, that your relationship was bona fide. I say this because you mentioned that you had been there five times I think. So you obviously would've had plenty of pictures in plenty of different places.

 

This tends to point more toward a supervisor having more questions after reviewing the interview IMHO. I think the super concentrated on the fact that you met through her relative in the States and probably didn't get past that fact to look at pics or financials. I think he/she decided then and there that you were going to have to provide more evidence.

 

That's why I think your overcome slip asked for letter of evolution and more importantly, how you spent your time together during your five trips.

 

This is pure speculation on my part, but, trying to get into the head of whoever is questioning your case, this is what I see:

 

A Chinese citizen meeting a Chinese-born USC through HER relative in the US. He comes to China to marry her and makes numerous trips. Is he making those trips to see HER or his relatives who live here? Is this a marriage for love or for someone's financial gain? I'm not trying to be insulting, just trying to think like a very suspicious GUZ supervisor.

 

Having laid out all this negative stuff, I actually think this COULD be a fairly simple overcome. I base this on the fact that someone seems to be very preoccupied with HOW you spent your time together in China. I think that if you can, through your evolution of relationship letter and DETAILED explanation of each trip to China and what you did while there, show that you were there actually building a relationship, that should satisfy GUZ.

 

Someone else will correct me if I'm wrong on this but I believe the same VO who interviewed your wife will review your overcome evidence. And if I'm right and a supervisor has told that VO to make sure his/her original pink was justified, then the letters you provide should do that.

 

So, in your letter, I would be VERY detailed about the trips, including exact dates and locations etc. Someone else may disagree and say it's overkill, and I know you included them at the interview already, but you could also provide the corresponding pictures from each trip, marked to show Trip 1, Trip 2 etc. That would make it much easier for whoever is reviewing your case to decide in your favor.

 

I know you're thinking to yourself that "They had all this at the interview, why didn't they just ask?, why do I have to give it to them again?" You're right, it's stupid and unfair. But in some cases, that's the way GUZ is. You have no choice but to give them what they ask for.

 

Sorry for being so long-windedly blunt. I'm just trying to give you a possible reason for why they're asking for what they're asking for to maybe ease your mind about having to do it. And I could be wrong about that WHY part. But the one thing that won't change whether I'm right or wrong is that you will have to give them what they want.

 

Best of luck to both of you.

Edited June 16, 2008 by IllinoisDave (see edit history)

[homersimpsons]

IllionisDave,

 

I think that's exactly what happened. Because I was introduced to her by her uncle in the USA, I believe they think it's a sham marriage to help her gain entry to the states either to help her cousins or my cousins.

 

Or here's another crazy consipracy because of the questions they asked on the blue sheet.

They asked if I have family member in China and why I came to China to marry on the blue sheet. I'm thinking they are thinking I came to China to marry her so she can gain entry to the states , once she becomes a citizen, she divorce me and then marry my cousin and apply for him to come to the state. This sounds crazy, but why else would they ask if I have family in China? And I'm guessing Family does not mean immediate family, but relatives and cousins since they should have access to my family residences already.

 

You know, this would never have happened if I was dishonest and told them I met her when I bummed into her while in China as a tourist.

 

That's a lesson for you Chinese guys meeting your spouse through introductions by friends/relatives.

[IllinoisDave]

 

You know, this would never have happened if I was dishonest and told them I met her when I bummed into her while in China as a tourist.

 

That's a lesson for you Chinese guys meeting your spouse through introductions by friends/relatives.

Keep in mind that any claim you make is subject to being proven. So if someone in the future chooses to do what you suggest, they should make sure they have receipts and pictures from that "meeting" to back up the story if it comes to that.

 

Otherwise, I think it's probably a good suggestion for guys/gals in your situation.

 

Back to your situation. IMHO, if you provide the necessary facts and evidence that illustrate the evolution of your relationship via your trips, it SHOULD satisfy GUZ, especially if I'm right and the original VO handles the overcome.

 

Good luck.

Edited June 16, 2008 by IllinoisDave (see edit history)

[rogerinca]

Dave, excellent assessment !! I reached the same conclusions, exactly as you have upon looking at all of the issues outlined and also with what insights I have gained here and elsewhere.

 

Although not real common, I can recall at least two others in the past year or so, who had the Pink changed to Blue, within a day or two of the actual interview.

 

Yes, there appears to be an internal audit and/or post interview review of each case file, again after the interview, and before the visa is actually issued. My conclusion is that this is a trained specialist most likely at the supervisory level, who is making these final review assessments, along with the interviewing VO.

 

Two days after my wife’s interview, when I went up to the US Citizen Services window to inquire on the availability of my wife and daughter’s visa (I did this on my own, I did not learn this trick here) the woman pulled up my case number in her computer and stated to me…”I see your petition is clear, it is ready for visa to be issued, it should be at the P.O. tomorrow…”

 

Moreover, in looking at my wife’s Pink slip, it states clearly on the first page….”Although your visa has been approved, you should not purchase tickets until you have received and inspected your visa. In certain rare instances, the US Consulate must retract a decision to issue a visa. In this case, your passport, along with a letter explaining why we have retracted our decision will be given to the Post Office, they will call to arrange for you to pick up….”

 

And yes, it is all about ‘flags’ which are also referred to as ‘indicators’ which form a profile.

 

I also agree, that if these doubts are adequately overcome with the precise evidence they are seeking, the Pink will follow in short order. If however, there is ‘more to the story‘, as we say where I work, then it can become more problematic. The fact remains, that visa/relationship fraud out of China, continues at [very] high levels, according to sources I have, who have close ties to USCIS in Los Angeles/LAX.

 

Sometimes, those who are completely innocent, can get pulled into the vortex, if they are on the fringes of the profile.

 

I truly wish everyone here could enjoy immediate success on getting the visa after this long process. However there are many others, individuals and groups of individuals, outside of our control, who have created an illicit trade in human beings, which ultimately impacts all of us, in one way or another.

Edited June 16, 2008 by rogerinca (see edit history)

[IllinoisDave]

Good points Rog. I'm still curious as to whether it's true that the original VO does the review for the overcome. Anyone have a concrete answer to that? Dan? Randy?

[Tom & Jen]

I think Dave and Roger got it right and you suspected it too. I didn¡¯t even think about that possibility before. In addition to giving them detailed information on what they are asking for in the Blue Slip, I think you should also get as many people as you can to write testimonial letters for you. These should be your parents, colleagues, supervisors, long time friends. The letters should state how long they have known you, your character, work ethics, how long and what you have been telling about your wife and your relationship. Notarized letters are probably better.

 

What they may have is suspicion. If you back your case with facts, evidence, and credible testimonies, I can¡¯t see they how they would have any other choice but to approve your wife¡¯s visa. Bring her home!

[jim_julian]

I think Dave and Roger got it right and you suspected it too. I didn¡¯t even think about that possibility before. In addition to giving them detailed information on what they are asking for in the Blue Slip, I think you should also get as many people as you can to write testimonial letters for you. These should be your parents, colleagues, supervisors, long time friends. The letters should state how long they have known you, your character, work ethics, how long and what you have been telling about your wife and your relationship. Notarized letters are probably better.

 

What they may have is suspicion. If you back your case with facts, evidence, and credible testimonies, I can¡¯t see they how they would have any other choice but to approve your wife¡¯s visa. Bring her home!

 

Tom, I see two possible issues with the extra material you suggest:

 

1. The "doth protest too much" syndrome. Something that could be seen as an over reaction may only raise suspicion.

 

2. One of the names or relationships with people providing testimonies could open up a new line of inquiry. Always be careful at introducing new names into you file.

 

I would recommend giving just what they asked for ... no more.

[Richard & Li]

GAWD, I HOPE YOU ARE WRONG!!!

 

I met Li through her family in America. It never occurred to me until I read from Dave's assessment on down that it could be a red flag.

 

I don't disagree with what you've said: It makes sense. I just hope it's not an 'automatic' red flag.

 

I work at a university with a huge number of international faculty and students. It is not an unusual place to meet someone (or someone's family) from outside the U.S.

 

We've been 100% honest so far. We'll stick with that and see what happens...

[IllinoisDave]

GAWD, I HOPE YOU ARE WRONG!!!

 

I met Li through her family in America. It never occurred to me until I read from Dave's assessment on down that it could be a red flag.

 

I don't disagree with what you've said: It makes sense. I just hope it's not an 'automatic' red flag.

 

I work at a university with a huge number of international faculty and students. It is not an unusual place to meet someone (or someone's family) from outside the U.S.

 

We've been 100% honest so far. We'll stick with that and see what happens...

Didn't mean to scare you Richard. I don't think by any means it's an automatic red flag. I'm sure any suspicion raised depends on the other factors involved as well. You could be less prepared than Homer and get by with a pink or more prepared and get a blue. Just depends on the particular VO and possibly whichever supervisor happens to review the case on that particular day. I know that probably doesn't make you feel any better.

 

All you can do is prepare as best you can, give as much info as required while being careful,as Jim suggested, to not give anything that could open up another can of worms. Based on your situation it may be prudent to go ahead and type up the kind of evolution of relationship letter with emphasis on how you spent your time in China that Homer is having to do. So you have it ready in case. Just a suggestion.

 

Best of luck on the 23th.

Edited June 21, 2008 by IllinoisDave (see edit history)

[Richard & Li]

Thanks Dave.

 

I keep telling Li: "We're very well prepared and organized. We have followed the advice of both experts and those who have gone before us. Do your best at the interview and everything will be OK."

 

I actually believe myself.

 

I have a first version of an 'Evolution of Relationship' letter typed up. Hopefully, I won't need it. But, over the past year, I've gotten in the habit of being prepared.

 

By this time tomorrow we won't be guessing anymore.

[tsap seui]

Hang in there big guy, you've got it all together and the lil' lady will do GOOD tomorrow!!

 

tsap seui

Edited June 22, 2008 by tsap seui (see edit history)