China: West should do more

[david_dawei]

China: West should do more to cope with warming

-------------------

 

I found this very interesting since the message from china is one that I have stated over the last year here, concerning per capita issues...

 

Chinese representative to the world conference on Saturday questioned the fairness of binding cuts when China¡¯s per capita emissions are only about one-sixth of America's. Beijing said that it has been pumping pollutants into the atmosphere for a mere of three decades, whereas the Western developed countries have done so for hundreds of years.

"China is in the process of industrialization and there is a need for economic growth to meet the basic needs of the people and fight against poverty," said Su Wei, a top climate expert for Chinese government and member of its delegation at the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Bali, Indonesia.

 

"I just wonder whether it's fair to ask developing countries like China to take on binding targets," Su said. "I think there is much room for the United States to think whether it's possible to change its lifestyle and energy consumption patterns in order to contribute to the global climate."

 

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I've posted this here in the hopes it receives better reception and response; If you can't stay to topic nor avoid baiting comments.. stay out of the thread or risk being deleted. Let's have a civil discussion if that's possible.

 

I'm not sure that there can be far-reaching international agreement at all on what to do; it will probably fall mostly to independent measures being applied domestically. I do think that those at the top of the heap should curb their appetite more so (and I mean measured by population, so per capita).

 

My final hope is that some countries will not hide behind the "it will hurt our economy" cry... if you sleep in your bed, you should make it as well.

[Shenzhen K-1]

China: West should do more to cope with warming

-------------------

 

I found this very interesting since the message from china is one that I have stated over the last year here, concerning per capita issues...

 

Chinese representative to the world conference on Saturday questioned the fairness of binding cuts when China¡¯s per capita emissions are only about one-sixth of America's. Beijing said that it has been pumping pollutants into the atmosphere for a mere of three decades, whereas the Western developed countries have done so for hundreds of years.

"China is in the process of industrialization and there is a need for economic growth to meet the basic needs of the people and fight against poverty," said Su Wei, a top climate expert for Chinese government and member of its delegation at the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Bali, Indonesia.

 

"I just wonder whether it's fair to ask developing countries like China to take on binding targets," Su said. "I think there is much room for the United States to think whether it's possible to change its lifestyle and energy consumption patterns in order to contribute to the global climate."

 

----------

 

I've posted this here in the hopes it receives better reception and response; If you can't stay to topic nor avoid baiting comments.. stay out of the thread or risk being deleted. Let's have a civil discussion if that's possible.

 

I'm not sure that there can be far-reaching international agreement at all on what to do; it will probably fall mostly to independent measures being applied domestically. I do think that those at the top of the heap should curb their appetite more so (and I mean measured by population, so per capita).

 

My final hope is that some countries will not hide behind the "it will hurt our economy" cry... if you sleep in your bed, you should make it as well.

 

I read this article in the Chicago Tribune today and very thought provoking!! Yes we as the world leader need to take a real stance and help in curbing this problem. But.....how many here??

 

1. Recycle??

2. Use E85 fuel??

3. Drive a vehicle that gets over 25 mpg??

4. Turn your heat or A/C down and use a programable thermostat??

5. Have your vehicle's A/C serviced properly and not allow freon into the air??

6. Keep oil and other stuff down the drain??

7. Etc..

[iyan46]

China: West should do more to cope with warming

-------------------

 

I found this very interesting since the message from china is one that I have stated over the last year here, concerning per capita issues...

 

Chinese representative to the world conference on Saturday questioned the fairness of binding cuts when China’s per capita emissions are only about one-sixth of America's. Beijing said that it has been pumping pollutants into the atmosphere for a mere of three decades, whereas the Western developed countries have done so for hundreds of years.

"China is in the process of industrialization and there is a need for economic growth to meet the basic needs of the people and fight against poverty," said Su Wei, a top climate expert for Chinese government and member of its delegation at the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Bali, Indonesia.

 

"I just wonder whether it's fair to ask developing countries like China to take on binding targets," Su said. "I think there is much room for the United States to think whether it's possible to change its lifestyle and energy consumption patterns in order to contribute to the global climate."

 

----------

 

I've posted this here in the hopes it receives better reception and response; If you can't stay to topic nor avoid baiting comments.. stay out of the thread or risk being deleted. Let's have a civil discussion if that's possible.

 

I'm not sure that there can be far-reaching international agreement at all on what to do; it will probably fall mostly to independent measures being applied domestically. I do think that those at the top of the heap should curb their appetite more so (and I mean measured by population, so per capita).

 

My final hope is that some countries will not hide behind the "it will hurt our economy" cry... if you sleep in your bed, you should make it as well.

 

I read this article in the Chicago Tribune today and very thought provoking!! Yes we as the world leader need to take a real stance and help in curbing this problem. But.....how many here??

 

1. Recycle??

2. Use E85 fuel??

3. Drive a vehicle that gets over 25 mpg??

4. Turn your heat or A/C down and use a programable thermostat??

5. Have your vehicle's A/C serviced properly and not allow freon into the air??

6. Keep oil and other stuff down the drain??

7. Etc..

I recycle, Drive a car that gets about 32 mpg, use a programable thermostat in my home, have my AC serviced at a reputable dealership, and never pour anything onto the ground .... no chemicals of any kind.

 

We don't have E85 fuel here yet.

 

I work for the Parks and Recreation dept for the county i live in and recycling is very important, and i live on the Gulf of Mexico ... If you've ever heard of " Red Tide " you'd understand why i'd never put anything into or onto the ground. the rest is just common sense stuff everyone should make it a habbit of doing without thought.

[david_dawei]

Slightly on a different front... I was traveling to NC this past week and was at a Pinehurst country club restuarant!! This premiere spot, much to the apparent chagrin of the setting, was serving water in disposable styrofoam cups

 

Sad to say, travel anywhere else in the US and water is wasted without a thought... I don't know what impact their action will have on an international scale, but I'm sure that the few locals will possibly take note...

[Shenzhen K-1]

Slightly on a different front... I was traveling to NC this past week and was at a Pinehurst country club restuarant!! This premiere spot, much to the apparent chagrin of the setting, was serving water in disposable styrofoam cups

 

Sad to say, travel anywhere else in the US and water is wasted without a thought... I don't know what impact their action will have on an international scale, but I'm sure that the few locals will possibly take note...

 

Funny, but sad. One of the first things that set me back in China was watching my feng buy napkins. I also found out later that China buys more of our recycled goods then anybody else, go figure!

[LeeFisher3]

The chief U.N. climate scientist, Rajendra Pachauri, said it was next to impossible to expect the developing poor countries to agree to cuts when their per capita emissions are so much less than the West.

 

"What is absolutely essential is to see that the developed countries establish a record of action and commitment, which I think will induce and provide a moral basis for developing countries to assume the burden," Pachauri said.

 

"In the absence of that, I don't think anything is going to happen. With per capita levels being so different, it's not likely that anybody in the developing world would accept binding commitments."

I'm sure moral concerns would outweigh economic concerns in the future, as if that has worked in the past.

 

When the developing countries are willing to step up to the plate and make the same level of commitment they are asking the more developed nations perhaps something of substance will get done.

 

As it stands the developing nations are demanding that they are allowed to catch up in polluting the world with the developed nations before they are required to do anything toward solving the problem.

 

So unfortunately it appears that nothing will be accomplished other than people telling everyone else what they should do and no one doing anything other than making the situation worse.

[heyjimi]

China: West should do more to cope with warming

-------------------

 

I found this very interesting since the message from china is one that I have stated over the last year here, concerning per capita issues...

 

Chinese representative to the world conference on Saturday questioned the fairness of binding cuts when China¡¯s per capita emissions are only about one-sixth of America's. Beijing said that it has been pumping pollutants into the atmosphere for a mere of three decades, whereas the Western developed countries have done so for hundreds of years.

"China is in the process of industrialization and there is a need for economic growth to meet the basic needs of the people and fight against poverty," said Su Wei, a top climate expert for Chinese vernment and member of its delegation at the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Bali, Indonesia.

 

"I just wonder whether it's fair to ask developing countries like China to take on binding targets," Su said. "I think there is much room for the United States to think whether it's possible to change its lifestyle and energy consumption patterns in order to contribute to the global climate."

 

----------

 

I've posted this here in the hopes it receives better reception and response; If you can't stay to topic nor avoid baiting comments.. stay out of the thread or risk being deleted. Let's have a civil discussion if that's possible.

 

I'm not sure that there can be far-reaching international agreement at all on what to do; it will probably fall mostly to independent measures being applied domestically. I do think that those at the top of the heap should curb their appetite more so (and I mean measured by population, so per capita).

 

My final hope is that some countries will not hide behind the "it will hurt our economy" cry... if you sleep in your bed, you should make it as well.

 

 

the problem is...it will hurt the ecomomy ...of all countries,it is after all one of the reasons killing our ecomomy right now(the high price of oil),thats why no one wants to do anything...but what bothers me is that everyone points to America to clean up their act,I been to Russia and China,both are polluting the air like no ones business,they do not have regulations on emissions like we have,absolutely mind boggling the pollution in these two countries.The sad thing "oil" is what makes all these countries run.it would be interesting to see if the Middle East stopped pumping oil to America,or any of these countries,how long we could survive,they would simply collapse. my opinion only....hope i didn't get too political,sorry if i did.

we could hope for alternative fuels,but do you really think this will happen...not until the very last drop of oil is pumped out of the ground

it is all about money.the oil companies will not let this happen.its that simple.

and as far as global warming,Mars is also having a global warming ,and there is no human up there causing it.....global changes are all natural.

[chilton747]

Slightly on a different front... I was traveling to NC this past week and was at a Pinehurst country club restuarant!! This premiere spot, much to the apparent chagrin of the setting, was serving water in disposable styrofoam cups

 

Sad to say, travel anywhere else in the US and water is wasted without a thought... I don't know what impact their action will have on an international scale, but I'm sure that the few locals will possibly take note...

 

They are taking note now in Atlanta believe me. We are in a severe drought now.

[IllinoisDave]

and as far as global warming,Mars is also having a global warming ,and there is no human up there causing it.....global changes are all natural.

 

Do we know how Mars got the way it is? Do we know that humans or an equivalent entity didn't do to Mars in the very distant past what we're doing to Earth right now? Are we really willing to bet the future of this planet on humans having no effect and thus do nothing? Do we really know that turning into a lifeless orb of dust and ice is inevitable?

[david_dawei]

China: West should do more to cope with warming

-------------------

 

I found this very interesting since the message from china is one that I have stated over the last year here, concerning per capita issues...

 

Chinese representative to the world conference on Saturday questioned the fairness of binding cuts when China¡¯s per capita emissions are only about one-sixth of America's. Beijing said that it has been pumping pollutants into the atmosphere for a mere of three decades, whereas the Western developed countries have done so for hundreds of years.

"China is in the process of industrialization and there is a need for economic growth to meet the basic needs of the people and fight against poverty," said Su Wei, a top climate expert for Chinese vernment and member of its delegation at the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Bali, Indonesia.

 

"I just wonder whether it's fair to ask developing countries like China to take on binding targets," Su said. "I think there is much room for the United States to think whether it's possible to change its lifestyle and energy consumption patterns in order to contribute to the global climate."

 

----------

 

I've posted this here in the hopes it receives better reception and response; If you can't stay to topic nor avoid baiting comments.. stay out of the thread or risk being deleted. Let's have a civil discussion if that's possible.

 

I'm not sure that there can be far-reaching international agreement at all on what to do; it will probably fall mostly to independent measures being applied domestically. I do think that those at the top of the heap should curb their appetite more so (and I mean measured by population, so per capita).

 

My final hope is that some countries will not hide behind the "it will hurt our economy" cry... if you sleep in your bed, you should make it as well.

 

 

the problem is...it will hurt the ecomomy ...of all countries,it is after all one of the reasons killing our ecomomy right now(the high price of oil),thats why no one wants to do anything...but what bothers me is that everyone points to America to clean up their act,I been to Russia and China,both are polluting the air like no ones business,they do not have regulations on emissions like we have,absolutely mind boggling the pollution in these two countries.The sad thing "oil" is what makes all these countries run.it would be interesting to see if the Middle East stopped pumping oil to America,or any of these countries,how long we could survive,they would simply collapse. my opinion only....hope i didn't get too political,sorry if i did.

we could hope for alternative fuels,but do you really think this will happen...not until the very last drop of oil is pumped out of the ground

it is all about money.the oil companies will not let this happen.its that simple.

and as far as global warming,Mars is also having a global warming ,and there is no human up there causing it.....global changes are all natural.

Well said... but as Lee says, we'll point fingers till that is the only action going on.

 

If one looks at the data, per capita, Russian, China and India are far down on the list.. The US remains most wasteful in gross and per capita... a unique position. This will remain. China was not a net importer of oil till the 1990s... their dependence on coal is worrisome but their action on hydroelectric and nuclear leaves other countries as appearing to be doing nothing.

 

Australia was equally recalcitrant about the economy impact issues but the new prime minister has reversed their direction towards some action.

[heyjimi]

and as far as global warming,Mars is also having a global warming ,and there is no human up there causing it.....global changes are all natural.

 

Do we know how Mars got the way it is? Do we know that humans or an equivalent entity didn't do to Mars in the very distant past what we're doing to Earth right now? Are we really willing to bet the future of this planet on humans having no effect and thus do nothing? Do we really know that turning into a lifeless orb of dust and ice is inevitable?

 

 

no,we don't know that ,it is possible but....,you missed my point.....Mars is having a global warming, NOW !!! and humans is not causing it. that is my point.

global warming caused by what man is doing is a rubish.complete rubish,nonsense.

[david_dawei]

and as far as global warming,Mars is also having a global warming ,and there is no human up there causing it.....global changes are all natural.

 

Do we know how Mars got the way it is? Do we know that humans or an equivalent entity didn't do to Mars in the very distant past what we're doing to Earth right now? Are we really willing to bet the future of this planet on humans having no effect and thus do nothing? Do we really know that turning into a lifeless orb of dust and ice is inevitable?

 

 

no,we don't know that ,it is possible but....,you missed my point.....Mars is having a global warming, NOW !!! and humans is not causing it. that is my point.

global warming caused by what man is doing is a rubish.complete rubish,nonsense.

That may be true.. and I tend to agree more than disagree...but not the point of the thread here.. and this is often the issue that gets the thread closed quickly as fighting starts.

 

So... let's stick to the idea, that if countries should curb their current trend of using up the environment's resources... and what could be done...

[pkfops]

From what I saw on my last visit; there is a green movement in China.

 

Let's see what happens in the next few years or so.

[credzba]

I believe the Chinese people will conserve energy, if only because it is the reasonable thing to do.

This is where USA falls down I believe.

We have built stores far away from homes, and we have to travel long distances to work.

Our mass transit is pathetic, buses are rarely even 1/4 full, and they take forever to get you where you want to go.

Our time is so rushed, that we can not allocate time to walk to or from the store, so we drive.

 

I am a terrible example, and may well get training when my wife arrives.

I live only 2 miles from my work, and even less distance from shopping.

Still I drive every day, not because I am lazy, but because I don't allocate enough time in my day to walk to and from work.

 

So, yes. USA could do a tremendous amount to reduce pollution and warming. But it will come at a cost. Like all the OTHER countries say, our productivity targets will have to drop.

We will have to allow people time to walk places, our RUSH lifestyle will need to slow down. Our transit systems need to change so that it is reasonable for people to use a bus.

Our cost of driving will need to increase so that people are motivated to leave their cars parked.

Our infrastructure and zoning will have to change to allow neighborhood markets.

 

It is a great idea, but no one is willing to pay the price in USA.

 

This is why China WILL eclipse USA as the dominant country.

[Guest Mike and Lily]

I certainly believe in saving the environment, however China is claiming poverty and that China is "only" a developing country. That's a cop out. China should do as much as the USA. China is a world class pwer when they want to be. They can't choose to be a developing country just when it suits them!