Please help, I-864 mess

[trickyspark]

I decided to repost here, had posted in the general chat but I got bumped down to the middle of page 2 a few times got worried no one'd see my post, and topics seem more stable here.

 

This was my first post

just got the I-864 paperwork and need a little help. My job recently cut back, and I was one of the lucky one's selected. They opted a service contract with an IT company, rather than have an IT guy full time.

 

When I came back from China, I decided to crash at my parents home both out of the fact, that I just found it comforting to be around people I know, instead of alone in some apartment and to save the money I'd waste on rent and what not so that Ying could decide where she'd like us to live, California, New York, wherever (she came all this way for me, so it's her choice when she gets here).

 

Since I now only have part time work , I will probably need joint sponsor or whatever. I noticed something on the form about adding income of people in the household related to me by birth. My folks have no problem being a joint sponsor, what I wonder is...should I do the household member thing? the joint sponsor thing?

 

It's been 8 months since I came back from China and been living here, so I have the 6 month deal covered as well. Originally was going to use my full time job, and parents to show we have way more than enough.

 

I get a little lost as to what is the best, and what forms to use with which one. Any advice would be most appreciated.

 

Anyone give me a little pointer on what would probably be best? And what forms to fill out for whatever you suggest?

 

 

 

This was my second

 

Also, I don't know if this will have an effect on how I do it, or what forms to use, but my parents file jointly and both are willing to help in any way. I am looking for the best way, it doesnt have to be the quickest

 

 

This was a reply from David

It's good that you think through this.. the financial aspect is often cut and dry, but your situation is good to think carefully through.

 

My quick thoughts on this are as follows:

1) It will also ask you about your current employment (4.A )

2) And will ask about your household size (4.B )

3) The I-864 is going to ask you for your most recent tax info (part 4.C ) based on the poverty guideline number (4.D ).

 

Your current employment is more important than last years (most recent) tax info... but It's not clear if you filed anything last year. Can you clarify that.

 

Start with this, IMO:

- See if your current employment income exceeds the poverty level.. this will require you to project out your income for the rest of the year.

- The only issue I see is whether you are falling into a self-employed status or will still be an 'employee' of the company, please clarify that.

 

My gut says, right now with what I read... if your current year income will exceed the poverty limit, your good to go using yourself as the only sponsor. Just have to figure out how to justify that number (ie: employer letter or self-employed status).

 

As a backup, your parents can be 'joint-sponsors'... this is not uncommon and so they see lots of these. But you only use them IF you do not meet or exceed the poverty limit... And just because you are living with them, I would not consider them 'household members'... Treat it more like you renting a room IMO...

 

Hopefully others (and I'm thinking particularly of Frank) will add some insight from their point of view on this sometimes tricky issue...

 

This is the 'public charge' aspect of the process.. it's very important to get it right as far as possible, in terms of satisfying the VO... and since you need to get this back to NVC, I understand that time is important...

 

 

 

This was my last post

 

I will answer the questions as best I can.

 

1. Current employment is now Part time, works out to less than poverty

level.

2. Household size if I count parents and me is 3 (not sure if I count wife

as she isn't here yet)

3.My most recent tax return for 2005 more than met the poverty level

for a family of 4

 

4. I did file last year. It was more than double what I needed.

 

5. My current income in my part time job does not meet poverty level.

6. I am not self employed.

 

 

I am unsure whether to use my parents as Household member sponsor or Joint Sponsor, either is ok with them. I hope I included what was needed to help you help me on this decision.

 

 

Last time I tried linking something it kept appearing to me as broken, I'll try again http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18883

[yuehan123]

I would use the parents for joint sponsors. I would not include them in my household size because I am not responsible for their support. Your wife will be part of your household for purposes of the poverty level calculation so you should include her.

[david_dawei]

I guess a VO might consider last year's income irrelevant.

 

Use the parents as joint sponsors.  As David said, lots of sponsors have successfully done that.

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One last question, If i use them as joint sponsor, what determines the household size for them or how much of their income is considered applicable to me and my wife? There would be the 2 of them, What I wonder is, would my wife be added as a 3rd to calculate the poverty level?

 

My job now produces an income that is about 30% below poverty, I had to grab the first thing I could find and like i said it's temporary until i find something else, hopefully I can show proof of the new job at a later time.

227294[/snapback]

[david_dawei]

I would use the parents for joint sponsors.  I would not include them in my household size because I am not responsible for their support.  Your wife will be part of your household for purposes of the poverty level calculation so you should include her.

227278[/snapback]

Just saw the thread over here.. I think your right to move it here for now.

 

----

 

Looks like two of us are agreeing on the idea to use parents as J-S and NOT include them as household members... you don't support them, so don't include them.

 

You would submit an I-864 as the sponsor; your parent would submit an I-864 as a J-S...

 

I would calculate the poverty level as two; yourself and your SO...

[trickyspark]

I would use the parents for joint sponsors.0„2 I would not include them in my household size because I am not responsible for their support.0„2 Your wife will be part of your household for purposes of the poverty level calculation so you should include her.

227278[/snapback]

Just saw the thread over here.. I think your right to move it here for now.

 

----

 

Looks like two of us are agreeing on the idea to use parents as J-S and NOT include them as household members... you don't support them, so don't include them.

 

You would submit an I-864 as the sponsor; your parent would submit an I-864 as a J-S...

 

I would calculate the poverty level as two; yourself and your SO...

227301[/snapback]

Would my parents need to figure her into the poverty level calculations in order to prove that in case I fail to support her they will be able to support themselves and her?

[david_dawei]

I would use the parents for joint sponsors.0„2 I would not include them in my household size because I am not responsible for their support.0„2 Your wife will be part of your household for purposes of the poverty level calculation so you should include her.

227278[/snapback]

Just saw the thread over here.. I think your right to move it here for now.

 

----

 

Looks like two of us are agreeing on the idea to use parents as J-S and NOT include them as household members... you don't support them, so don't include them.

 

You would submit an I-864 as the sponsor; your parent would submit an I-864 as a J-S...

 

I would calculate the poverty level as two; yourself and your SO...

227301[/snapback]

Would my parents need to figure her into the poverty level calculations in order to prove that in case I fail to support her they will be able to support themselves and her?

227305[/snapback]

I believe that as a [joint] sponsor, they will figure her in, just as you did (as her sponsor)...

 

Hoping that anyone with J-S experience/knowledge will chime in...

[trickyspark]

I would use the parents for joint sponsors.0„2 I would not include them in my household size because I am not responsible for their support.0„2 Your wife will be part of your household for purposes of the poverty level calculation so you should include her.

227278[/snapback]

Just saw the thread over here.. I think your right to move it here for now.

 

----

 

Looks like two of us are agreeing on the idea to use parents as J-S and NOT include them as household members... you don't support them, so don't include them.

 

You would submit an I-864 as the sponsor; your parent would submit an I-864 as a J-S...

 

I would calculate the poverty level as two; yourself and your SO...

227301[/snapback]

Would my parents need to figure her into the poverty level calculations in order to prove that in case I fail to support her they will be able to support themselves and her?

227305[/snapback]

I believe that as a [joint] sponsor, they will figure her in, just as you did (as her sponsor)...

 

Hoping that anyone with J-S experience/knowledge will chime in...

227311[/snapback]

Thanks for that info, it'll get me started in the right direction.

 

I may put it off until after the 4th of July , hopefully I will have some type of supplemental income or a REAL job by then to add. Plan to head to Florida tomorrow and sign up for all the local staffing agencies.

 

I swear, of all friggin times to loose a job, a few weeks before this form comes along, wish it woulda lasted long enough to put on the form.

[trickyspark]

If approved by the US, is there still a possibility that once the interview comes, the VO might look at the income, even though it will exceed the poverty level with help by a nice margin, and say Nah, your husband doesn't make enough, try again later.

 

This is just so I can settle the bile that seems to be rising up.

 

I'm a little confused how to enter her name as well, seems most Chinese names have 2 parts, like my wife's "Ying Ying". Unsure whether to count that as a middle name, don't want problems with namecheck, but I know if I put first name as YingYing, it's probably wind up as Yingying, or something totally wrong.

Edited June 28, 2006 by trickyspark (see edit history)

[david_dawei]

I'm down in FL.. send me a PM or email and let me know what your plans are or where your thinking of going... I might have some thoughts for you...

 

---

 

Don't worry about the VO not accepting the J-S... they look at this issue as documentary proof of supporting the beneficiary (ie: it's legally binding). Again, it's not that uncommon to have a J-S.

 

---

 

Name issue:

 

I'm of the opinion to enter her non-family characters as one [first] name... Remember, they will have the original chinese characters to determine the true name, but how you list it on forms seems to determine how they put it in documents and visas.

 

You've already started putting her name down on some documents.. and she will need a passport if not already in her possession. I told my wife how to put her name on the passport request... then we were able to apply my "two characters as one first name" for the entire process, and her passport matched that.

[david_dawei]

From another thread:

I guess a VO might consider last year's income irrelevant.

 

Use the parents as joint sponsors.  As David said, lots of sponsors have successfully done that.

227271[/snapback]

One last question, If i use them as joint sponsor, what determines the household size for them or how much of their income is considered applicable to me and my wife? There would be the 2 of them, What I wonder is, would my wife be added as a 3rd to calculate the poverty level?

 

My job now produces an income that is about 30% below poverty, I had to grab the first thing I could find and like i said it's temporary until i find something else, hopefully I can show proof of the new job at a later time.

227294[/snapback]

I agree with David that you should not consider yourself part of your parent's household. Be a tenant at their address.

 

Your wife appears on line B2 on any I-864. So she'll appear on yours and on your co-sponsor's I-864 and appear as part the total of each "household".

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[trickyspark]

I'm down in FL.. send me a PM or email and let me know what your plans are or where your thinking of going...  I might have some thoughts for you...

 

---

 

Don't worry about the VO not accepting the J-S... they look at this issue as documentary proof of supporting the beneficiary (ie: it's legally binding).  Again, it's not that uncommon to have a J-S.

 

---

 

Name issue:

 

I'm of the opinion to enter her non-family characters as one [first] name...  Remember, they will have the original chinese characters to determine the true name, but how you list it on forms seems to determine how they put it in documents and visas. 

 

You've already started putting her name down on some documents.. and she will need a passport if not already in her possession.    I told my wife how to put her name on the passport request...  then we were able to apply my "two characters as one first name" for the entire process, and her passport matched that.

227341[/snapback]

Ah, looking over the forms they sent me, apparently they've decided for me that the second "Ying" is a middle name. It consists of 3 characters, a doodad with lines,2 squigglies some lines, and 2 squigglies some lines.

 

The doodad being Zhao, and each one of the 2 squigglies with lines being a Ying. She has it written different ways on her mail from the college she attended, she writes it YingYing in english, sometimes Ying Ying, don't think she cares, lol. I still don't say it right, she pronounces it Yeung, or Young, something like that, I asked if I could call her Ying, she says sure lol.

[david_dawei]

I still don't say it right, she pronounces it Yeung, or Young, something like that, I asked if I could call her Ying, she says sure lol.

227347[/snapback]

Since we don't see the characters.. maybe it's 'third tone' Ying... this often changes what we expect as the pronounciation... Once you figure out the tone number, you're almost there.. that is your almost there to total confusion !!

[frank1538]

The new I-864 regulations seem to have made it a little easier.

 

In the past many believed that "household size'' was so broadly defined that it picked up all related people at the same residence whether they were dependent on the sponsor for support. The new regulations now allow you to exclude the types of relatives. The upshot of this is the sponsor may elect to treat these non support relatives as household members if she or he chooses. This means such relatives, such as parents, who are not dependent on you, can execute the I-864A rather than a separate I-864 for a joint sponsor if you've resided with them for six months or longer. The upside of this is that the parent does not have to separately satisfy the income threshholds. Rather, by signing the I-864A, their income is aggregated with the primary sponsor (you). The downside of this is that the parent would be included in the household size. At least, that's my read of the new regulations.

 

You may want to verify this for yourself by reading the new regs at http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/01...006/06-5522.htm

[david_dawei]

I read the applicable sections in the new regs.. And agree with Frank, except on one note: The six month co-residency is now removed.

 

The two key points I see, if you want to include a relative's income, if that relative is living in the same household:

- You (as the sponsor) MUST include them in the 'Household Size' section of your I-864.

- As a Joint-Sponsor, that person MUST fill out the I-864A.

 

These two steps are needed so you can 'pool' the incomes...

 

----------

 

Here's the applicable sections.. search for any parts of the below to get to those sections:

 

Definitions of ``Household Size'' and ``Household Income''

 

If, in fact, the household consists of a more extended family, the sponsor may elect to include other relatives in determining the ``household size.'' Under this alternative, the sponsor may then include in the calculation of household size any relative of the sponsor who has the same principal residence as the sponsor.

 

The final rule removes the interim rule's requirement that the household member must have resided in the sponsor's household for at least six months in order to sign a Form I-864A.

 

In determining the ``household income'' the sponsor may include the income of any other persons included in calculating the ``household size,'' but these other persons, including the sponsor's spouse or children (who must be at least 18 years old), must still sign Form I-864A in order for the sponsor to use this option. The final rule retains the Form I-864A requirement to ensure that the family member's promise of support is enforceable. As with the sponsor's spouse and dependents, the income of these other relatives in the residence may be ``pooled'' to determine the household income.

Edited June 28, 2006 by DavidZixuan (see edit history)

[frank1538]

I read the applicable sections in the new regs..  And agree with Frank, except on one note:  The six month co-residency is now removed.

227466[/snapback]

correctomundo.