Living in China

[rogerluli]

For all of us planning to retire in China this visa question seems to be the most problematic. If your wife remains a Chinese citizen then you have visa problems from both governments... If you are both USC then you just have China to worry about. If it is true that the Z (work) visa is so easy to get by having an emplyer register you even if you are not a real employee then that sounds like a possible solution. If they find out it is a fraudulent arrangement do you get unceremoniously shipped out? I have almost exactly 7 years to go until I retire, I only hope there is a new permanent resident program by then to make everything easy and legal...

[Guest pushbrk]

For all of us planning to retire in China this visa question seems to be the most problematic. If your wife remains a Chinese citizen then you have visa problems from both governments... If you are both USC then you just have China to worry about. If it is true that the Z (work) visa is so easy to get by having an emplyer register you even if you are not a real employee then that sounds like a possible solution. If they find out it is a fraudulent arrangement do you get unceremoniously shipped out? I have almost exactly 7 years to go until I retire, I only hope there is a new permanent resident program by then to make everything easy and legal...

215981[/snapback]

I have a similar level of concern regarding my wife's ability to maintain her permanent resident status. It appears that once conditions are removed, she can remain outside the US for any period less than two years without obtaining a reentry permit. However there is a caveat that absense of any length can be considered for loss of permanent resident status. I don't see this happening without a good reason, considering she's the wife of a USC.

 

Citizenship for the wife would then limit the visa concerns to China. I'm planning more like 5 years in the future, so things may change on the China side. I doubt the US regs on this will change much.

 

http://www.uscis.gov/graphics/howdoi/PermRes.htm

 

International Travel

A Permanent Resident of the United States can travel freely outside of the US. A passport from the country of citizenship is normally all that is needed. To reenter the US a Permanent Resident normally needs to present the green card (Permanent Resident Card, Form I-551) for readmission. A reentry permit is needed for reentry for trips greater than one year but less than two years in duration.

 

You can find more information about travel documents from "How Do I Get a Travel Document?"

 

Maintaining Permanent Residence

Maintaining Permanent Residence You may lose your permanent residence status if you commit an act that makes you removable from the United States under the law in section 237 of the Immigration and Nationality Act. If you commit such an act, you may be brought before the immigration courts to determine your right to remain a Permanent Resident.

 

You may be found to have abandoned your permanent resident status if you:

 

 

Move to another country intending to live there permanently.

Remain outside of the US for more than one year without obtaining a reentry permit or returning resident visa. However in determining whether your status has been abandoned any length of absence from the US may be considered, even if it is less than one year.

Remain outside of the US for more than two years after issuance of a reentry permit without obtaining a returning resident visa. However in determining whether your status has been abandoned any length of absence from the US may be considered, even if it is less than one year.

Fail to file income tax returns while living outside of the US for any period.

Declare yourself a nonimmigrant?on your tax returns.

[Stone]

It appears that once conditions are removed, she can remain outside the US for any period less than two years without obtaining a reentry permit. 

 

No , it should be once conditions are removed, she can remain outside the US for any period less than two years With a reentry permit.

[Stone]

For all of us planning to retire in China this visa question seems to be the most problematic. If your wife remains a Chinese citizen then you have visa problems from both governments... If you are both USC then you just have China to worry about. If it is true that the Z (work) visa is so easy to get by having an emplyer register you even if you are not a real employee then that sounds like a possible solution. If they find out it is a fraudulent arrangement do you get unceremoniously shipped out? I have almost exactly 7 years to go until I retire, I only hope there is a new permanent resident program by then to make everything easy and legal...

215981[/snapback]

If you win a Nobel Prize before you retire in 7 years, it very possible for the Chinese government to grant you a Chinese Green Card (Permanent Resident of China). Otherwise, retiring on a Z visa in China would be very difficult if not impossible (do you forget the infamous TPC – Third Part Correspondence?).

 

If you want to retire in China on an L visa, you need to renew your L every six months for 2-3 times max, then must leave and come back to China again. Be prepared to pay lots of fees whenever you extend your L visa. So the easiest way that I can think of is for you to win a Nobel Peace Prize before you move to China. During the meantime, I am working on my Physics.

[Guest pushbrk]

It appears that once conditions are removed, she can remain outside the US for any period less than two years without obtaining a reentry permit. 

 

No , it should be once conditions are removed, she can remain outside the US for any period less than two years With a reentry permit.

215999[/snapback]

Right, duh. So if you come back to the US once a year, no problem.

[rogerluli]

For all of us planning to retire in China this visa question seems to be the most problematic. If your wife remains a Chinese citizen then you have visa problems from both governments... If you are both USC then you just have China to worry about. If it is true that the Z (work) visa is so easy to get by having an emplyer register you even if you are not a real employee then that sounds like a possible solution. If they find out it is a fraudulent arrangement do you get unceremoniously shipped out? I have almost exactly 7 years to go until I retire, I only hope there is a new permanent resident program by then to make everything easy and legal...

215981[/snapback]

If you win a Nobel Prize before you retire in 7 years, it very possible for the Chinese government to grant you a Chinese Green Card (Permanent Resident of China). Otherwise, retiring on a Z visa in China would be very difficult if not impossible (do you forget the infamous TPC – Third Part Correspondence?).

 

If you want to retire in China on an L visa, you need to renew your L every six months for 2-3 times max, then must leave and come back to China again. Be prepared to pay lots of fees whenever you extend your L visa. So the easiest way that I can think of is for you to win a Nobel Peace Prize before you move to China. During the meantime, I am working on my Physics.

216000[/snapback]

Okay I will start work on the great American novel which should win me the Nobel...

 

If "then must leave and come back to China again" means walking across the border for a weekend in Vietnam, or taking a day cruise up to South Korea from Weihai... then...okay...

[rogerluli]

I have been communicating with an American who retired to China,

 

http://www.geoexpat.com/

 

on this expat forum. He and his wife are both USC and they bought an apartment in Zhuhai, Guangdong. He assures me that all he had to do was register their marriage at a Chinese embassy in the US (a notarized copy), show proof of owning real estate in China, obtain 1 year multiple-entry visas...and badda-bing...they're set. He just gets new visas every year. If this is true, and I can't imagine he's lying to me for the fun of it, then this is an easy solution to living in China...EXCEPT FOR...the new regs about foreigners not being able to buy property. As these have not gone into effect yet I'm thinking we will be able to purchase our apartment in October in joint ownership. And even if not, as long as you buy a place in your spouses name while they are still a Chinese citizen you should be okay...

[Stone]

I have been communicating with an American who retired to China,

 

http://www.geoexpat.com/

 

on this expat forum. He and his wife are both USC and they bought an apartment in Zhuhai, Guangdong. He assures me that all he had to do was register their marriage at a Chinese embassy in the US (a notarized copy), show proof of owning real estate in China, obtain 1 year multiple-entry visas...and badda-bing...they're set. He just gets new visas every year. If this is true, and I can't imagine he's lying to me for the fun of it, then this is an easy solution to living in China...EXCEPT FOR...the new regs about foreigners not being able to buy property. As these have not gone into effect yet I'm thinking we will be able to purchase our apartment in October in joint ownership. And even if not, as long as you buy a place in your spouses name while they are still a Chinese citizen you should be okay...

239410[/snapback]

Maybe someday you will look like that, Roger?

 

http://www.southcn.com/news/gdnews/gdtodayimportant/200503170940_494776.jpg

[Stone]

Roger:

 

According to the Chinese law, if you have stayed in China consecutively for 5 years (9 month of each year must be in China), and you have married with your wife (who remains a Chinese citizen) for five years, and you can show proof of stable income and residence, and your wife lives in China permanently, then you are eligible for a Chinese green card.

 

Those are the words from the Shanghai Entry/Exit Administration Bureau. Have your wife read the following article:

 

http://www.nyconsulate.prchina.org/chn/xw/t156416.htm

[Dan R]

Darn, does wife live in china permanently mean she needs to stay there are would having property suffice? The current word is "you go, I stay"

[Stone]

Roger, by the time when you retire (5-7 years), the U.S. might have the following in place to persuade you NOT to emigrate to China:

 

(1) The nation debt is cut in half from $8.4 trillion to $4.2 trillion, as the country is running a budget surplus each year

(2) Every senior citizen can start enjoy Social Security Income at the age of 60 with Full Benefits

(3) Universal health insurance coverage at very affordable rate

(4) Gas price goes back to less than $2 per gallon and inflation rate is low.

(5) Kids can afford to attend the schools of their dream at very affordable tuition so parents don’t have to worry

(6) Very low unemployment rate so even senior citizens are in high demand for jobs with decent wages

(7) Low crime rate and virtually no terror threat whatever

(8) Clean environment where we have ozone-friendly products made and used here

(9) Dollar is getting stronger against all other major currencies due to the huge U.S. trade surplus

 

Will all those persuade you to stay?

[Stone]

Darn, does wife live in china permanently mean she needs to stay there are would having property suffice? The current word is "you go, I stay" 

239474[/snapback]

Wife living permanently in PRC was my 'interpretation' (I could be wrong ). I guess they actually want proof of wife's HuKou or Registration of Legal Residence.

[rogerluli]

Roger, by the time when you retire (5-7 years), the U.S. might have the following in place to persuade you NOT to emigrate to China:

 

(1) The nation debt is cut in half from $8.4 trillion to $4.2 trillion, as the country is running a budget surplus each year

(2) Every senior citizen can start enjoy Social Security Income at the age of 60 with Full Benefits

(3) Universal health insurance coverage at very affordable rate

(4) Gas price goes back to less than $2 per gallon and inflation rate is low.

(5) Kids can afford to attend the schools of their dream at very affordable tuition so parents don’t have to worry

(6) Very low unemployment rate so even senior citizens are in high demand for jobs with decent wages

(7) Low crime rate and virtually no terror threat whatever

(8) Clean environment where we have ozone-friendly products made and used here

(9) Dollar is getting stronger against all other major currencies due to the huge U.S. trade surplus

 

Will all those persuade you to stay?

239476[/snapback]

This is quite a laundry list...It sounds like a politician's election year promises... I still want to go to China. I just find it a more interesting place. Laopo tells me I won't feel that way after some time. Who can be sure about such a major change?

Edited August 22, 2006 by rogerluli (see edit history)

[Yuanyang]

Roger, by the time when you retire (5-7 years), the U.S. might have the following in place to persuade you NOT to emigrate to China:

 

(1) The nation debt is cut in half from $8.4 trillion to $4.2 trillion, as the country is running a budget surplus each year

(2) Every senior citizen can start enjoy Social Security Income at the age of 60 with Full Benefits

(3) Universal health insurance coverage at very affordable rate

(4) Gas price goes back to less than $2 per gallon and inflation rate is low.

(5) Kids can afford to attend the schools of their dream at very affordable tuition so parents don’t have to worry

(6) Very low unemployment rate so even senior citizens are in high demand for jobs with decent wages

(7) Low crime rate and virtually no terror threat whatever

(8) Clean environment where we have ozone-friendly products made and used here

(9) Dollar is getting stronger against all other major currencies due to the huge U.S. trade surplus

 

Will all those persuade you to stay?

 

Wow! I think I'm going to sell umbrellas because we'll have a lot of pigs flying overhead when those things happen.

[rogerluli]

Roger, by the time when you retire (5-7 years), the U.S. might have the following in place to persuade you NOT to emigrate to China:

 

(1) The nation debt is cut in half from $8.4 trillion to $4.2 trillion, as the country is running a budget surplus each year

(2) Every senior citizen can start enjoy Social Security Income at the age of 60 with Full Benefits

(3) Universal health insurance coverage at very affordable rate

(4) Gas price goes back to less than $2 per gallon and inflation rate is low.

(5) Kids can afford to attend the schools of their dream at very affordable tuition so parents don’t have to worry

(6) Very low unemployment rate so even senior citizens are in high demand for jobs with decent wages

(7) Low crime rate and virtually no terror threat whatever

(8) Clean environment where we have ozone-friendly products made and used here

(9) Dollar is getting stronger against all other major currencies due to the huge U.S. trade surplus

 

Will all those persuade you to stay?

 

Wow! I think I'm going to sell umbrellas because we'll have a lot of pigs flying overhead when those things happen.

 

And HELL will be a very cold place...