I Am Now Officially At Wit's End

[Eric&Yuhui]

Here it is - with your permission - what has been the cause of the misinformation and long-term delays:

 

careful.. It might not be the cause of the problem....

I'm just offering one possible explanation, which I personnally think can very well happen and in my mind is very logic. As I have no reason to believe CA would lie to us and "making up" a clearance date as we call. And in my mind does explain a lot of this cleared./not cleared business.. and multiple computer screen divergeances...

I know this is one point I sure would love GZ/CA to clarify for us.

I think we are basically also dealing besides the above with 4 groups

 

1/ DoS Line -1225 number. No clue. Last to know

2/ CA Washington.. More clues than 1/ .

3/ GZ info line... No clue... Same as 1/ Just read computers for what they are allowed to see

4/ GZ consular officers.. More clues than 3/

 

Problem is.. we get info from all 4.... that will NEVER match. At this point , dump 1 and 3... Stick with 2 and 4

[Mick]

 

Here it is - with your permission - what has been the cause of the misinformation and long-term delays:

 

careful.. It might not be the cause of the problem....

I'm just offering one possible explanation, which I personnally think can very well happen and in my mind is very logic. As I have no reason to believe CA would lie to us and "making up" a clearance date as we call. And in my mind does explain a lot of this cleared./not cleared business.. and multiple computer screen divergeances...

I know this is one point I sure would love GZ/CA to clarify for us.

I think we are basically also dealing besides the above with 4 groups

 

1/ DoS Line -1225 number. No clue. Last to know

2/ CA Washington.. More clues than 1/ .

3/ GZ info line... No clue... Same as 1/ Just read computers for what they are allowed to see

4/ GZ consular officers.. More clues than 3/

 

Problem is.. we get info from all 4.... that will NEVER match. At this point , dump 1 and 3... Stick with 2 and 4

I agree Eric. 4 sources, four different answers. Keep 2 and 4. Problem is, at least from this end, #4 is hard to get to sometimes. Will try from this end however. Owen also may be quite helpful in this as he understands the computer systems much better than I do. He should be back in Shenyang by the weekend.

[Eric&Yuhui]

 

Here it is - with your permission - what has been the cause of the misinformation and long-term delays:

 

careful.. It might not be the cause of the problem....

I'm just offering one possible explanation, which I personnally think can very well happen and in my mind is very logic. As I have no reason to believe CA would lie to us and "making up" a clearance date as we call. And in my mind does explain a lot of this cleared./not cleared business.. and multiple computer screen divergeances...

I know this is one point I sure would love GZ/CA to clarify for us.

I think we are basically also dealing besides the above with 4 groups

 

1/ DoS Line -1225 number. No clue. Last to know

2/ CA Washington.. More clues than 1/ .

3/ GZ info line... No clue... Same as 1/ Just read computers for what they are allowed to see

4/ GZ consular officers.. More clues than 3/

 

Problem is.. we get info from all 4.... that will NEVER match. At this point , dump 1 and 3... Stick with 2 and 4

I agree Eric. 4 sources, four different answers. Keep 2 and 4. Problem is, at least from this end, #4 is hard to get to sometimes. Will try from this end however. Owen also may be quite helpful in this as he understands the computer systems much better than I do. He should be back in Shenyang by the weekend.

I'll see if I can cover #2 for you Mick.... Hadn't had a chance to call today B)

[Mick]

 

Here it is - with your permission - what has been the cause of the misinformation and long-term delays:

 

careful.. It might not be the cause of the problem....

I'm just offering one possible explanation, which I personnally think can very well happen and in my mind is very logic. As I have no reason to believe CA would lie to us and "making up" a clearance date as we call. And in my mind does explain a lot of this cleared./not cleared business.. and multiple computer screen divergeances...

I know this is one point I sure would love GZ/CA to clarify for us.

I think we are basically also dealing besides the above with 4 groups

 

1/ DoS Line -1225 number. No clue. Last to know

2/ CA Washington.. More clues than 1/ .

3/ GZ info line... No clue... Same as 1/ Just read computers for what they are allowed to see

4/ GZ consular officers.. More clues than 3/

 

Problem is.. we get info from all 4.... that will NEVER match. At this point , dump 1 and 3... Stick with 2 and 4

I agree Eric. 4 sources, four different answers. Keep 2 and 4. Problem is, at least from this end, #4 is hard to get to sometimes. Will try from this end however. Owen also may be quite helpful in this as he understands the computer systems much better than I do. He should be back in Shenyang by the weekend.

I'll see if I can cover #2 for you Mick.... Hadn't had a chance to call today

That would be great Eric! I'll keep you posted from this end.

[Eric&Yuhui]

 

Here it is - with your permission - what has been the cause of the misinformation and long-term delays:

 

careful.. It might not be the cause of the problem....

I'm just offering one possible explanation, which I personnally think can very well happen and in my mind is very logic. As I have no reason to believe CA would lie to us and "making up" a clearance date as we call. And in my mind does explain a lot of this cleared./not cleared business.. and multiple computer screen divergeances...

I know this is one point I sure would love GZ/CA to clarify for us.

I think we are basically also dealing besides the above with 4 groups

 

1/ DoS Line -1225 number. No clue. Last to know

2/ CA Washington.. More clues than 1/ .

3/ GZ info line... No clue... Same as 1/ Just read computers for what they are allowed to see

4/ GZ consular officers.. More clues than 3/

 

Problem is.. we get info from all 4.... that will NEVER match. At this point , dump 1 and 3... Stick with 2 and 4

I agree Eric. 4 sources, four different answers. Keep 2 and 4. Problem is, at least from this end, #4 is hard to get to sometimes. Will try from this end however. Owen also may be quite helpful in this as he understands the computer systems much better than I do. He should be back in Shenyang by the weekend.

I'll see if I can cover #2 for you Mick.... Hadn't had a chance to call today

That would be great Eric! I'll keep you posted from this end.

Yes. Do harass GZ for me please

Viiiiiiiiiiiiiiiisaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa !!!!!!! Aaaaah!!!!!!

Our case number is GUZ SEND-MOI-VISA :-)

[Eric&Yuhui]

I work with this stuff all the time. Not at P.J.'s level, but at the 'owner' level. Officially, I am the data steward and responsible for the integrity of the data. That means, I also spec what I want the silly sytem to do and make the decisions on what trade-offs are acceptable. Then the techies code it. When I need to plug some data from one system to another, it's not as simple as you might think. For one thing, I don't have a clue what the 'other' system is about, where the data comes from or what it means. It takes a long time to figure that out and a lot of time testing with users to define, develop and debug the business and systems processes.

 

The political decision to REQUIRE a negative response before issuing a visa (rather than waiting 10 days and issuing if no negative response was received) did not allow time for the integration to happen. It's like a balloon....you punch one on one side and there is a bulge on the other side. Bulges are not allowed!

 

I don't think they even realized there was a problem until Nov/Dec. No one was an 'owner' who was responsible for the overall effect and no one has stepped up to the plate with the authority to do so. A few heroes did what they thought would 'trick' the system to give the desired outcome - but it didn't work. I have users who have their little tricks and they are quite creative. Good folks tried but failed.

 

We are not talking about an integrated system here. We are talking about separate stand-alones that interface. "New record...overwrite the old one". Everyone is looking at their OWN system and wondering what is going on. No wonder there are different answers to the same question.

 

This is sick and this is sad. But heaven help me, it does make sense.

Ya not rambling Don, are ya ?

[Calvin]

It's about time DOS and GZ steps aside and let somebody from outside who knows something about visa do the work for them! These guys can't see things from inside out and have no idea what they are doing. I say we mass-attack them with the same FAX letter tomorrow!

[Calvin]

It's a trail of lies all the way from DOS to GZ, my friends, that we are being led to! Believe not what you hear but what you see!

[JoeLiyan]

My philosophy as a IT professional ...

 

a poorly-designed system can cause a lot of pain and suffering for the people it is intended to service.

 

P.J.

Didn't Mick and Owen report they were inputing this "design" in an excel database? Changing it somehow to clean up the system?

 

It seems to me, after reviewing Eric's explanation, based on your theory, they're NOT on top of the resubmits as they should be or we'd be out of this mess by now. They WERE on top of it back in November-December, resulting in quick issuances for those recent interviews.

 

The further these "balls" get dropped the deeper the FUBAR becomes...

[ChrisD]

I worked embassy 5 years in Asia....worked on tying computers networks overseas at the US. Embassies with the computers back home in Washington. I have not worked in government or embassy for 4 years now. The computer networks between organizations require manual entry by an operator, also it is a "security issue" having computer networks at the embassies connected "real-time" on a continuous communications all the time with back home. The computers are "stand alone" dumb terminals....the data will over-write any old data and you are looking at false information. I was a network/satellite guy that worked on the communications between government and embassies overseas. I have boiling blood in my veins for the idots that designed the systems....probably right out of college 23 year-old know it alls. I was 20 years in the business but I was a dinosour to them. DOS, Guangzhou, and INS all know the system is sHiT !! Another thing ...the operating systems are not compatible....some Oracle, some Windows, some NT....even if data is sent between the computers the data gets hacked-up and lost. I am angry at all the holidays and home leave for 1 month to come back to the states to see their families, and the careless way they operate is appalling. I want my wife and daughter visa's ....I hate the embassy back then, and my blood still boils now.

Thanks, ChrisLee

[kkimm]

This is a very interesting thread that I have been reading this whole morning.

 

After all, no matter how bad the system is, it is the staff people at GZ IV sections who are using the system. The loop hole on the system could be the actualy cause of this whole mass, but the real problem is the people who manage this system did not follow procedures, or did not show their care...

 

This is sad...

 

 

[Lurker]

It's possible that Eric's scenario...

 

"Step 8: Poor clearance for resub # 1234 trying to find it's way on GZ computer, that now shows ONLY pending LAST resub # 4567 of 2/20.. No luck. Where is my resub I was clearing?"

 

...might not be. Perhaps the clearance is attached to the case number, not the resub, resulting in a hoped for NR code.

 

Of course, this may be pure blue sky wishful thinking.

[Guest David]

Even if it's attached to the case, it might remain on the spreadsheet. If a lazy-arsed worker only looks at the spreadsheet, they might never notice that the case has been cleared.

 

I would suggest this to everyone who thinks they have been caught in the situation: contact CA, tell them that your fiance/wife/husband received clearance, but has not been issued a visa yet. Tell them there has been a clerical error, and ask them to order GZ to issue it, if clearance has been received. Remember, some people did this in december after their beneficiaries did not receive the GZ letter after they were cleared. If your beneficiary received clearance, a spreadsheet entry does NOT change that.

 

 

That's what I would do. If a lot of you have this problem, write a group letter. There is no reason for anyone to refuse you. I hope that I don't end up with the same problem.

 

--David

[Guest David]

Oh yeah, and by the way, I'd jsut like to say that the blame for all of this lies directly with Guangzhou. It looks like they sat around and did jack sh*t for weeks and weeks when it was obvious that something was wrong with the system. We had to ask CA to come and do their job for them... inexcusable.

 

Why can't SOMEONE take responsibility for this crap?

[AZwolfman]

Oh yeah, and by the way, I'd jsut like to say that the blame for all of this lies directly with Guangzhou.  It looks like they sat around and did jack sh*t for weeks and weeks when it was obvious that something was wrong with the system.  We had to ask CA to come and do their job for them... inexcusable.

 

Why can't SOMEONE take responsibility for this crap?

Right on David! I don't know that GZ is to blame for ALL of this, but maybe at least for the current portion of the delay. I think they now sit on thousands of clearances, but too many damn holidays and too far away from us to make a personal visit.