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#1 Randy W

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Posted 14 November 2014 - 01:51 AM

Can't say that I'm sympathetic to the plight of Visa and Master Card here, but this article may be of interest to those of us who like to use our credit cards. It's from Caixin

Visa, MasterCard Confront China's Stacked Deck

Visa and MasterCard executives eager to expand in China were thrilled recently when Premier Li Keqiang seemed to suggest that a door would open to them for bank card yuan business in the country.

 

But they had read Li wrong: The premier's statement in late October did not signal an opening to overseas bank card firms. Instead, it signaled tougher times.

 

 . . .

 

On November 3, UnionPay's grip tightened with a central bank announcement that "new financial integrated cards issued by all banks must conform to the PBOC 3.0 standards."

 

These standards govern the electronic language through which a bank card transmits an account holder's data at a checkout counter or at an ATM. They are used by only UnionPay and are incompatible with the so-called EMV standards adopted years ago by MasterCard and Visa. EMV stands for the former Europay, which MasterCard bought in 2002, MasterCard and Visa.

 

Even if Beijing were to open for bank card clearing services, the latest rule forces every company except UnionPay to adjust its business practices before being allowed to operate in China. For example, retail point-of-sale (POS) terminals for band-card swiping as well as ATM operations will have to conform to the new standards.

 

The changeover won't come cheap: A UnionPay technician said changing just one machine to meet the new standards could cost several hundred yuan.

 

 . . .

 

Smart cards are considered safer than magnetic strip cards and can be equipped with more functions, such the ability to use near-field communication technology to move money.

 

A central bank official working in the bank's payment division said the new smart card standards are designed to protect account holder data while also meeting China's sovereignty requirements.

 

China's smart cards and EMV cards are incompatible because they use different encryption methods,

 

 



#2 Randy W

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Posted 14 November 2014 - 01:53 AM

The article doesn't mention the Discover card, which, as far as I know, is still usable anywhere in China that the Union Pay card is accepted. It's unclear how the new BOC 3.0 standards would affect this agreement. I have yet to hear of anyone actually using their card in China, however.

 

Use Your Discover Card in China



#3 danb

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Posted 14 November 2014 - 10:48 AM

Hi,  Randy do you have and use a Discovery card in China?  From personal experience is that easy to use the Discovery card in China.  I am wondering if I should apply for one before my next trip to China.  Is there anyone else who can share their experiences using their Discovery card in China?  I used to think that the Discovery card was somehow linked to Sears Credit cards.  I am not sure why I thought that.

 

 In the past I have tried to use my American credit cards in China.   Sometimes I can and sometimes I can't.  We will select something that we wanted to buy.  The sales clerk would ring it up and filled the paperwork out and then brings it over to that desk where money/ credit card is handle.  That is where I have the problem.  They run the card thru the C.C. machine.  Sometimes it works and sometime it don't work.  Very rarely did those clerks speak English.  Phone inquiry calls are made but normally at that point I end up having to find a different way of paying for it.  The time that it would be nice to be able to used CC in China is when buying something around 500 to 1200 USD when I don't want to use up my spending money cash.  You know what I mean?  Danb



#4 tsap seui

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Posted 14 November 2014 - 11:13 AM

Nice to see them making more cards open to use but I don't think we are going to see much widespread use of any of our credit cards outside of big cities in China that see many western visitors. I could use my cards in Beijing, but Fushun, a puddle jump by Chinese standards city of 1.2 mil, there were only two places in the entire city that took a card...LOL  Not much incentive for a business to go through the hurdles to use western cards when there are maybe 5 or 10 folks in the city at any given time who wanted to use a card, so I would jest estimate ahead of how much spending cash we'd need and W/U the funds before I flew over. No guesswork needed.

 

Like anything, when you get enough demand, you'll get supplied.  :victory:

 

Almost every week Wenyan gets an app for DIscover, and the other two cards....into file 86 they go for a rest, by HER hand. She's got a nice AMX card and a visa card that she keeps paid down real low...LOL In Chinartucky she jes uses the tried and true payment form.  It is too easy to W/U ahead of her trips.


Edited by tsap seui, 14 November 2014 - 11:23 AM.


#5 Randy W

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Posted 14 November 2014 - 11:27 AM

Hi,  Randy do you have and use a Discovery card in China?  From personal experience is that easy to use the Discovery card in China.  I am wondering if I should apply for one before my next trip to China.  Is there anyone else who can share their experiences using their Discovery card in China?  I used to think that the Discovery card was somehow linked to Sears Credit cards.  I am not sure why I thought that.

 

 In the past I have tried to use my American credit cards in China.   Sometimes I can and sometimes I can't.  We will select something that we wanted to buy.  The sales clerk would ring it up and filled the paperwork out and then brings it over to that desk where money/ credit card is handle.  That is where I have the problem.  They run the card thru the C.C. machine.  Sometimes it works and sometime it don't work.  Very rarely did those clerks speak English.  Phone inquiry calls are made but normally at that point I end up having to find a different way of paying for it.  The time that it would be nice to be able to used CC in China is when buying something around 500 to 1200 USD when I don't want to use up my spending money cash.  You know what I mean?  Danb

 

 

No - I don't have one myself, and I haven't heard of anyone using it. My wife uses her Union Pay cards all the time - supposedly, Discover is accepted by the same machines.

 

We've found a hotel or two or three that would accept my western cards, but it hardly seems worth the trouble (and fees for doing so).

 

Like the article says, if Visa and Master Card want to try to enter the Chinese market, they will need to upgrade to the "PBOC 3.0 standards" (Chinese standards). Until then, it's a "convenience" offered by a very few merchants - one that you pay for.

 

The Discover Card is a credit card, issued primarily in the United States. It was announced by Sears in 1985 and was introduced nationwide the following year. Discover was part of Dean Witter, and then Morgan Stanley, until 2007, when Discover Financial Services became an independent company. Novus, a major processing center, was once partners with the company. The Novus logo was retired, replaced by the Discover Network logo.

 



#6 danb

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 07:25 PM

Hello!!! I hope all and your loved ones are doing well this new year. Question. I did a couple of searches on this forum but can't find something. There was an article about using the Discover Credit card in China. Sometimes the merchant do not recognize/accept the card. This happen to me in Beijing last week at a hotel. Last year there was a topic that displayed an explanation card that we could show merchants. I think the card stated that the Discover card was accepted for used in China, the same as the Union Paid card is. Anyone remember where this article is? Thanks. Danb

#7 Randy W

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 09:01 PM

Hello!!! I hope all and your loved ones are doing well this new year. Question. I did a couple of searches on this forum but can't find something. There was an article about using the Discover Credit card in China. Sometimes the merchant do not recognize/accept the card. This happen to me in Beijing last week at a hotel. Last year there was a topic that displayed an explanation card that we could show merchants. I think the card stated that the Discover card was accepted for used in China, the same as the Union Paid card is. Anyone remember where this article is? Thanks. Danb

 

 

Look about 3 posts up in this thread, but I'm finding that it IS turned down a lot, even after they put it through the machine. It's of course fairly awkward when they do, so I'm considering just giving up on it. Even some who used to accept it now don't. I'm thinking maybe the Union Pay people just don't want to bother with having to get my money from the U.S.



#8 wawster

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 05:47 AM

It's good to see this thread.

 

The last three trips, I've WU'd money over to Yifang ahead of time, and I've always kept a few hundred yuan in my wallet for taxis, etc. The Hotels in Guangzhou and Shenzhen, and even Changsha took my Visa card just fine, but I verified it with them before I traveled. Yifang also lived in a teeny town in Hunan - Lanshan - who has about 200,000 folks there...they don't have any idea what a Visa card is.  (Shoot, I was the solo laowai there, and have never seen another in any of my visits there). So there, we used cash for everything.

 

I had thought about reviving my Discover card, but after reading this, I figure it's good to leave it lie.



#9 danb

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 11:12 PM

Hello. Randy, thank you for the reply. Before posting I did do a search for info on this topic. I did recheck the post above that you mentioned. I got the discover card a year ago because I thought I might be able to use the discover card easier than other American credit cards. I just seem to recall a post that had a wallet size card picture that one could use to show to merchants that did not hear of the discover card in China. I also went to my discover card site to see if I could find that wallet size card. Thank You. danb

#10 danb

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 11:31 PM

Randy, After writing my reply I did some "Yahoo-ing" on the net. Was able to find an explanation wallet card at this site:
link to www.discover.com/credit-cards/help-center/faqs/assets/DN_CUP_Wallet_Card.pdf

Do you think this would be usefully to carry around? danb

#11 Randy W

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 11:51 PM

I found it to be completely useless - the 'pinless entry' procedure is simply for YOU to enter '000000' or just hit 'Enter'. The only thing THEY need to do is to TRY the card - either swipe it, or to enter the chip side.

 

The Union Pay logo MAY convince them to try, but the particular machine either accepts it or not.



#12 Randy W

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 07:44 AM

 

Hello!!! I hope all and your loved ones are doing well this new year. Question. I did a couple of searches on this forum but can't find something. There was an article about using the Discover Credit card in China. Sometimes the merchant do not recognize/accept the card. This happen to me in Beijing last week at a hotel. Last year there was a topic that displayed an explanation card that we could show merchants. I think the card stated that the Discover card was accepted for used in China, the same as the Union Paid card is. Anyone remember where this article is? Thanks. Danb

 

 

Look about 3 posts up in this thread, but I'm finding that it IS turned down a lot, even after they put it through the machine. It's of course fairly awkward when they do, so I'm considering just giving up on it. Even some who used to accept it now don't. I'm thinking maybe the Union Pay people just don't want to bother with having to get my money from the U.S.

 

 

 

I'm thinking that for me, Discover is pretty much DOA in China - I haven't used it since the above post. I even tried in Hong Kong because of the no foreign currency fee - they wouldn't take it, either. 

 

They are still advertising their Union Pay connection.

 

Fortunately, my Chase Amazon Visa worked just fine - my new cell phone was $5398HKD. It was charged to my card in HKD, which came to $692.20USD, for an exchange rate of 7.798. The official rate is 7.799.

 

My other cards' foreign currency fees would have made that about $20USD more expensive.





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