Confused about I-864 and I-864a

[larry sellers]

Hello all. We're a DCF at P3 now. Couple questions about the I-864:

 

1. We're using my Dad as a joint sponsor, so I know that he has to fill out an I-864, and provide 3 years of tax returns, a copy of his contract at work, and a copy of his passport photo. Does he need to provide anything else? He's really hesitant to do this and I'm trying to keep the number of personal documents he needs to provide to a minimum.

 

2. My Dad and mom are still married, and my mom works. Under what circumstances does she need to file an I-864a? My Dad's income is enough to qualify for the joint sponsorship, but I'm not sure if they file their income taxes jointly or separately.

 

3. My parents are weirded out by the idea of sending these personal documents (tax returns) via FedEx to China. Is it ok to scan and print documents like the work contract, tax returns, and I-864? If so, which documents are ok to scan and email to my wife in China for printing?

 

4. I'm back in the USA now. Is it ok that my address on the I-864 is a US address, or should I just put the Chinese address I used on the I-130?

 

5. Does Guangzhou care if the I-864 joint sponsor is a family member or a friend? The whole joint sponsor thing is putting a strain on my relationship with my parents. I have a friend who would willingly joint-sponsor my wife. Which is better?

 

Thanks in advance for anyone who has any thoughts. This green card process is driving me nuts.

[dnoblett]

1) Should be sufficient, the consulate should be satisfied with that level of financial evidence.

 

2) I-864A only needed in cases where the person providing I-864 has insufficient income and needs to add a household member's income. The attached W2/1099 for returns should show father's income is enough.

 

3) I-864 needs to be the original signed form so needs to be mailed over, Supporting docs can be scanned and printed.

 

I would get IRS transcripts, so that would not need to send a FULL Return over there, a FULL return involves 1040, and all forms attached showing where the numbers on the 1040 came from (W2, 1099 etc...). IRS transcripts are free and can be ordered online. http://www.irs.gov/I...er-a-Transcript Transcripts can be scanned and emailed over there without issue.

 

4) Use US address it goes to show domicile, as well as save you from having to file an I-865 after spouse arrives in the USA showing your change of address.

 

5) Joint sponsor can be a friend or family domiciled in the USA. One member of this board acted as a joint sponsor for a friend and the consulate had no issue. Just be aware that the joint sponsor needs to be aware that the .GOV can come after them should the immigrant use means tested benefits and the primary is unable to repay the government.

[larry sellers]

Dnoblett,

Thanks so much for your prompt reply, especially the info that the tax docs can be scanned and printed. Really cleared things up and will make things easier. This I-864 is really the only snag left for us because the consulate seems satisfied with the legitimacy of our relationship in that they didn't require any P2 docs (and we are a legit couple, we've been together for 9 years).

Thanks again.

[warpedbored]

. Just be aware that the joint sponsor needs to be aware that the .GOV can come after them should the immigrant use means tested benefits and the primary is unable to repay the government.

This is technically true however I don't know of any cases where this has been enforced except one where a divorce court judge decided to use it as a basis for a man to pay alimony.

[dnoblett]

. Just be aware that the joint sponsor needs to be aware that the .GOV can come after them should the immigrant use means tested benefits and the primary is unable to repay the government.

This is technically true however I don't know of any cases where this has been enforced except one where a divorce court judge decided to use it as a basis for a man to pay alimony.

True, however Joint sponsor is signing a legal document with the US Government so should be aware of what they are signing.

 

The I-864 is enforceable until:

• Joint sponsor dies
  
• Immigrant dies
  
• Immigrant works and is credited with 40 quarters of work, in this case primary sponsor's work is also counted while they remain married so can be as little as 5 years
  
• Immigrant naturalizes
  
• Immigrant leaves the country and relinquishes residency (green-card)
  

Joint sponsor should also be aware that any time the move, they need to file an I-865 until one of the above conditions is met.

[larry sellers]

Yes, there are legal obligations to being a joint sponsor. I've actually arranged for a friend who understands the legal obligation to be my wife's joint sponsor, and he is enthusiastic about doing so.

I had one other question as a follow up to my original post. On form DS-230, since I'm now in the USA would it be better to put my USA address on that one as well as the I-864? I'm assuming yes, but I just want to make sure.

[dnoblett]

Yes, there are legal obligations to being a joint sponsor. I've actually arranged for a friend who understands the legal obligation to be my wife's joint sponsor, and he is enthusiastic about doing so.

I had one other question as a follow up to my original post. On form DS-230, since I'm now in the USA would it be better to put my USA address on that one as well as the I-864? I'm assuming yes, but I just want to make sure.

Yes, because that is where she will live once arriving in the USA.

[larry sellers]

Awesome, thanks!

[larry sellers]

So my friend that is joint sponsoring came through and provided the following: past 3 years full tax returns plus W2s, most recent three months pay stubs, passport copy, signed I-864, and a signed letter saying how happy he is to be helping sponsor my wife. Think all that will be enough? (he makes 30k per year, not a lot but well over 125% the poverty level)

[dnoblett]

That should work sounds like a plan.

[Randy W]

So my friend that is joint sponsoring came through and provided the following: past 3 years full tax returns plus W2s, most recent three months pay stubs, passport copy, signed I-864, and a signed letter saying how happy he is to be helping sponsor my wife. Think all that will be enough? (he makes 30k per year, not a lot but well over 125% the poverty level)

 

"Enough" isn't necessarily enough. It's at the discretion of the VO's who are REQUIRED to look at the "totality of circumstances" in determining whether your wife might become a public charge in the U.S.

[larry sellers]

So my friend that is joint sponsoring came through and provided the following: past 3 years full tax returns plus W2s, most recent three months pay stubs, passport copy, signed I-864, and a signed letter saying how happy he is to be helping sponsor my wife. Think all that will be enough? (he makes 30k per year, not a lot but well over 125% the poverty level)

 

"Enough" isn't necessarily enough. It's at the discretion of the VO's who are REQUIRED to look at the "totality of circumstances" in determining whether your wife might become a public charge in the U.S.

 

Yeah, I know they can do whatever they want. I just want to do all I can to prevent them from saying no.

[lhp]

Another couple of i-864/i-864a questions, specifically about joint tax returns.

 

1. My wife and I filed jointly last year. On the i-864 should I list only my 2012 income in pt 6, #5 (which by itself exceeds 125% of the poverty line) and then also list hers below in 6c? Or should I just leave hers out since my income alone exceeds the poverty line?
   Also, Since we both work for Chinese companies, neither of us have a W-2…any suggestions as to what to do about that?
   I've got more than double the poverty line in savings, so I will also include that on the form and include bank statements.
2. ​Since I work in China and have not yet looked for a job in the US (the wife is a Party member and will have to get a background check…I don't feel right looking for a job until I know when we'll be back), my mother is acting as a joint sponsor, just in case.
   Like me, my mother files a joint tax return (with my father, who is retired) and her income alone exceeds the poverty line. Does my father need to fill out i-864a, or can he just be left out since my mother's W2 will show her income?

​

Thanks guys. We go in a week from Monday and I've got the jitters.

[Randy W]

Another couple of i-864/i-864a questions, specifically about joint tax returns.

 

1. My wife and I filed jointly last year. On the i-864 should I list only my 2012 income in pt 6, #5 (which by itself exceeds 125% of the poverty line) and then also list hers below in 6c? Or should I just leave hers out since my income alone exceeds the poverty line?

   Also, Since we both work for Chinese companies, neither of us have a W-2…any suggestions as to what to do about that?

   I've got more than double the poverty line in savings, so I will also include that on the form and include bank statements.

2. ​Since I work in China and have not yet looked for a job in the US (the wife is a Party member and will have to get a background check…I don't feel right looking for a job until I know when we'll be back), my mother is acting as a joint sponsor, just in case.

   Like me, my mother files a joint tax return (with my father, who is retired) and her income alone exceeds the poverty line. Does my father need to fill out i-864a, or can he just be left out since my mother's W2 will show her income?

​

Thanks guys. We go in a week from Monday and I've got the jitters.

 

You're getting caught up in semantics here - your income in China won't apply once you move to the U.S., so why not make it simple and just report on your I-864 what you reported to the IRS?

 

What I recommended for filing your income tax is to file a Form 4852 (Substitute for Form W-2), but it won't hurt to include it at this point.

 

A general rule of thumb for evidence is to include that which you HAVE, or can reasonably acquire, and DON'T include what you don't have.

 

I think we place WAY too much emphasis on the 125% of poverty line requirement - "enough" is not necessarily ENOUGH when it comes to showing income. It's up to you to show that she will have MORE than enough support to be able to avoid becoming a public charge. This CAN include evidence that you are looking for a job in the U.S.

[dnoblett]

Another couple of i-864/i-864a questions, specifically about joint tax returns.

 

1. My wife and I filed jointly last year. On the i-864 should I list only my 2012 income in pt 6, #5 (which by itself exceeds 125% of the poverty line) and then also list hers below in 6c? Or should I just leave hers out since my income alone exceeds the poverty line?

   Also, Since we both work for Chinese companies, neither of us have a W-2…any suggestions as to what to do about that?

   I've got more than double the poverty line in savings, so I will also include that on the form and include bank statements.

2. ​Since I work in China and have not yet looked for a job in the US (the wife is a Party member and will have to get a background check…I don't feel right looking for a job until I know when we'll be back), my mother is acting as a joint sponsor, just in case.

   Like me, my mother files a joint tax return (with my father, who is retired) and her income alone exceeds the poverty line. Does my father need to fill out i-864a, or can he just be left out since my mother's W2 will show her income?

​

Thanks guys. We go in a week from Monday and I've got the jitters.

Answering #2

 

No Father does not need to provide an I-864A it is only needed when the primary/joint sponsor's income alone is insufficient and needs to add income from a household member.

 

If your mother can show her income separately from spouse on her I-864, then should be fine without the I-864A