China's garbage

[tonado]

http://www.boston.com/business/articles/20...nds_of_garbage/

[GDBILL]

http://www.boston.com/business/articles/20...nds_of_garbage/

 

 

On the plus side, recycling in China is much better than it is in the US.

[amberjack1234]

I suppose that this would offer proof that the more wealthy folks in the cities are doing much better and sending more sorrow and problems to the country. It sounds to me like that the economic boom is a double edged sward. Wonderful for the ones in the city that can afford it and more misery for the rural folks.

 

Of course it is not just confined to the rural areas.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33228978/ns/us...7/?beginSlide=1

 

Larry

Edited October 12, 2009 by amberjack1234 (see edit history)

[Guest Pommey]

I suppose that this would offer proof that the more wealthy folks in the cities are doing much better and sending more sorrow and problems to the country. It sounds to me like that the economic boom is a double edged sward. Wonderful for the ones in the city that can afford it and more misery for the rural folks.

 

Of course it is not just confined to the rural areas.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33228978/ns/us...7/?beginSlide=1

 

Larry

 

 

 

been to any landfills in the USA ?

[Randy W]

I suppose that this would offer proof that the more wealthy folks in the cities are doing much better and sending more sorrow and problems to the country. It sounds to me like that the economic boom is a double edged sward. Wonderful for the ones in the city that can afford it and more misery for the rural folks.

 

Of course it is not just confined to the rural areas.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33228978/ns/us...7/?beginSlide=1

 

Larry

 

 

 

been to any landfills in the USA ?

 

 

Do you even know where the one is for your town's garbage? I don't

[amberjack1234]

I suppose that this would offer proof that the more wealthy folks in the cities are doing much better and sending more sorrow and problems to the country. It sounds to me like that the economic boom is a double edged sward. Wonderful for the ones in the city that can afford it and more misery for the rural folks.

 

Of course it is not just confined to the rural areas.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33228978/ns/us...7/?beginSlide=1

 

Larry

 

 

 

been to any landfills in the USA ?

As a matter of fact I do know where three are at. When I was a child many of my clothes and toys came from one of them. I am not ashamed that my family was poor. Why do you think I speak up for the poor people in China.

 

It's hard to feel for poor people when your belly is full.

 

Larry

[Guest Pommey]

I suppose that this would offer proof that the more wealthy folks in the cities are doing much better and sending more sorrow and problems to the country. It sounds to me like that the economic boom is a double edged sward. Wonderful for the ones in the city that can afford it and more misery for the rural folks.

 

Of course it is not just confined to the rural areas.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33228978/ns/us...7/?beginSlide=1

 

Larry

 

 

been to any landfills in the USA ?

As a matter of fact I do know where three are at. When I was a child many of my clothes and toys came from one of them. I am not ashamed that my family was poor. Why do you think I speak up for the poor people in China.

 

It's hard to feel for poor people when your belly is full.

 

Larry

 

 

 

your argument was sending misery to the poor rural chinese, by your own admission and my eyes here many USC get alot from landfills here too, so whats the difference except that with a smaller population we create more garbage than china.

Edited October 14, 2009 by Pommey (see edit history)

[amberjack1234]

I suppose that this would offer proof that the more wealthy folks in the cities are doing much better and sending more sorrow and problems to the country. It sounds to me like that the economic boom is a double edged sward. Wonderful for the ones in the city that can afford it and more misery for the rural folks.

 

Of course it is not just confined to the rural areas.

 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33228978/ns/us...7/?beginSlide=1

 

Larry

 

 

been to any landfills in the USA ?

As a matter of fact I do know where three are at. When I was a child many of my clothes and toys came from one of them. I am not ashamed that my family was poor. Why do you think I speak up for the poor people in China.

 

It's hard to feel for poor people when your belly is full.

 

Larry

 

 

 

your argument was sending misery to the poor rural chinese, by your own admission and my eyes here many USC get alot from landfills here too, so whats the difference except that with a smaller population we create more garbage than china.

No argument just the facts unless YOU are looking for an argument. When the Chinese incinerate their garbage they produce 10 times more dioxin that the incinerators in America. Did you even read the article?

 

Oh by-the-way have you ever even seen a garbage dump?

 

Larry

Edited October 14, 2009 by amberjack1234 (see edit history)

[whome?]

When I read the article it seems very similar to ones I have read here in the US newspapers regarding the government trying to locate incinerators and landfills in poor communites. The "not in my backyard" arguement. The comments from the people in the community about the pollution and that government not caring about them are the same I have seen in many US articles.

 

This does not mean it is not a problem in China but it means that most of us in the USA are as sheltered from the "real America" (real to many poor and disadvantaged people) as we are from what others like to call the "real China".

[GDBILL]

When I read the article it seems very similar to ones I have read here in the US newspapers regarding the government trying to locate incinerators and landfills in poor communites. The "not in my backyard" arguement. The comments from the people in the community about the pollution and that government not caring about them are the same I have seen in many US articles.

 

This does not mean it is not a problem in China but it means that most of us in the USA are as sheltered from the "real America" (real to many poor and disadvantaged people) as we are from what others like to call the "real China".

 

Well, there actually is a slight difference ...

 

At home citizens have remedies which can be effective in many instances. In China a common remedy involves staying home so that you don't get beaten by municipal security or worse, soldiers.

[amberjack1234]

When I read the article it seems very similar to ones I have read here in the US newspapers regarding the government trying to locate incinerators and landfills in poor communites. The "not in my backyard" arguement. The comments from the people in the community about the pollution and that government not caring about them are the same I have seen in many US articles.

 

This does not mean it is not a problem in China but it means that most of us in the USA are as sheltered from the "real America" (real to many poor and disadvantaged people) as we are from what others like to call the "real China".

 

The difference here is that the people have the say so where they go. We had the same situation and three locations were evaluated before a site was chosen to satisfy the people. I am reasonably sure in China the first indication that a landfill is going in within 100 yards of your little town is when the first truck load arrives and they are powerless to stop it because the local government official has already pocketed the payoff money to let it cone in. Another thing is that the Chinese modern landfills are lined with plastic so I have read in some articles but as one of the articles said the plastic is so thin that it is just a show more or less putting it in it tears so easily. The toxins leach right on in the ground water.

 

I think that New York City is the probably the worst. They use to just take it off into the ocean and dump it. I don't know what they are doing with it now I haven't checked. I can't check everything as I am typing so I will assume they are still doing that. Some of it was even showing up here on our North Carolina beaches. They once ran several barges up and down the east coast of the us trying to pay someone to take it. They went all the was to Texas in the Gulf of Mexico and no one would take it so they had to return it to New York.

 

So no the problem is not confined to China but the problem is magnified just like the burning of the rubbish and releasing 10 times more dioxins into the air that the more efficient American incinerators. My reasoning is why not build one less skyscraper in Beijing and build some efficient incinerators but that would not make the billionaire government officials there any richer would it that would cost them money wouldn't it.

 

At the same time the landfill issue was taking place the US Navy wanted to take up several thousand acres of farm land for an auxiliary landing field. the people fought that and won and they moved it to another location where the local people wanted it in their neighborhood. Why didn't they do that in the first place put it where the people wanted it instead of trying to push it down folks throat that did not want it. It would have saved the American people millions of dollars in legal fees. The people spoke and won. I wonder what the outcome would have been in China.

 

Larry

Edited October 15, 2009 by amberjack1234 (see edit history)

[whome?]

When I read the article it seems very similar to ones I have read here in the US newspapers regarding the government trying to locate incinerators and landfills in poor communites. The "not in my backyard" arguement. The comments from the people in the community about the pollution and that government not caring about them are the same I have seen in many US articles.

 

This does not mean it is not a problem in China but it means that most of us in the USA are as sheltered from the "real America" (real to many poor and disadvantaged people) as we are from what others like to call the "real China".

 

The difference here is that the people have the say so where they go. We had the same situation and three locations were evaluated before a site was chosen to satisfy the people. I am reasonably sure in China the first indication that a landfill is going in within 100 yards of your little town is when the first truck load arrives and they are powerless to stop it because the local government official has already pocketed the payoff money to let it cone in. Another thing is that the Chinese modern landfills are lined with plastic so I have read in some articles but as one of the articles said the plastic is so thin that it is just a show more or less putting it in it tears so easily. The toxins leach right on in the ground water.

 

I think that New York City is the probably the worst. They use to just take it off into the ocean and dump it. I don't know what they are doing with it now I haven't checked. I can't check everything as I am typing so I will assume they are still doing that. Some of it was even showing up here on our North Carolina beaches. They once ran several barges up and down the east coast of the us trying to pay someone to take it. They went all the was to Texas in the Gulf of Mexico and no one would take it so they had to return it to New York.

 

So no the problem is not confined to China but the problem is magnified just like the burning of the rubbish and releasing 10 times more dioxins into the air that the more efficient American incinerators. My reasoning is why not build one less skyscraper in Beijing and build some efficient incinerators but that would not make the billionaire government officials there any richer would it that would cost them money wouldn't it.

 

At the same time the landfill issue was taking place the US Navy wanted to take up several thousand acres of farm land for an auxiliary landing field. the people fought that and won and they moved it to another location where the local people wanted it in their neighborhood. Why didn't they do that in the first place put it where the people wanted it instead of trying to push it down folks throat that did not want it. It would have saved the American people millions of dollars in legal fees. The people spoke and won. I wonder what the outcome would have been in China.

 

Larry

The articles and instances I referred to the landfills and incinerators were built over the objections of the local people because the local people did not have the money/lawyers to fight off the government and special interests. Also some protested and where then taken away to jail with a few extra kicks/beating for good measure (according to the unreliable "poor" people).

 

Some landfills in the USA have the same issues at that stated in this article. Why? Because the company installed a cheap liner rather than the specified one to save money. Regarding the incinerators they are only as good as the scrubbers are .. meaning there are cases where incinerator operators in the USA have been fined because they did not operator the scrubber system in order to increase profits.

 

My reasoning is why not build one less skyscraper in Beijing and build some efficient incinerators but that would not make the billionaire government officials there any richer would it that would cost them money wouldn't it.

 

One can easily make this arguement about numerous USA local, state, and federal projects also....why not give more the poor, to infrastructure, to enviromental projects, etc. We piss away so much money on special interests projects it numbs most people to the point of "refusal to beleive" it is really happening.

[whome?]

When I read the article it seems very similar to ones I have read here in the US newspapers regarding the government trying to locate incinerators and landfills in poor communites. The "not in my backyard" arguement. The comments from the people in the community about the pollution and that government not caring about them are the same I have seen in many US articles.

 

This does not mean it is not a problem in China but it means that most of us in the USA are as sheltered from the "real America" (real to many poor and disadvantaged people) as we are from what others like to call the "real China".

 

Well, there actually is a slight difference ...

 

At home citizens have remedies which can be effective in many instances. In China a common remedy involves staying home so that you don't get beaten by municipal security or worse, soldiers.

 

If you change this to:

 

At home rich and/or politically connected citizens .....

 

I would agree 100%.

[amberjack1234]

When I read the article it seems very similar to ones I have read here in the US newspapers regarding the government trying to locate incinerators and landfills in poor communites. The "not in my backyard" arguement. The comments from the people in the community about the pollution and that government not caring about them are the same I have seen in many US articles.

 

This does not mean it is not a problem in China but it means that most of us in the USA are as sheltered from the "real America" (real to many poor and disadvantaged people) as we are from what others like to call the "real China".

 

The difference here is that the people have the say so where they go. We had the same situation and three locations were evaluated before a site was chosen to satisfy the people. I am reasonably sure in China the first indication that a landfill is going in within 100 yards of your little town is when the first truck load arrives and they are powerless to stop it because the local government official has already pocketed the payoff money to let it cone in. Another thing is that the Chinese modern landfills are lined with plastic so I have read in some articles but as one of the articles said the plastic is so thin that it is just a show more or less putting it in it tears so easily. The toxins leach right on in the ground water.

 

I think that New York City is the probably the worst. They use to just take it off into the ocean and dump it. I don't know what they are doing with it now I haven't checked. I can't check everything as I am typing so I will assume they are still doing that. Some of it was even showing up here on our North Carolina beaches. They once ran several barges up and down the east coast of the us trying to pay someone to take it. They went all the was to Texas in the Gulf of Mexico and no one would take it so they had to return it to New York.

 

So no the problem is not confined to China but the problem is magnified just like the burning of the rubbish and releasing 10 times more dioxins into the air that the more efficient American incinerators. My reasoning is why not build one less skyscraper in Beijing and build some efficient incinerators but that would not make the billionaire government officials there any richer would it that would cost them money wouldn't it.

 

At the same time the landfill issue was taking place the US Navy wanted to take up several thousand acres of farm land for an auxiliary landing field. the people fought that and won and they moved it to another location where the local people wanted it in their neighborhood. Why didn't they do that in the first place put it where the people wanted it instead of trying to push it down folks throat that did not want it. It would have saved the American people millions of dollars in legal fees. The people spoke and won. I wonder what the outcome would have been in China.

 

Larry

The articles and instances I referred to the landfills and incinerators were built over the objections of the local people because the local people did not have the money/lawyers to fight off the government and special interests. Also some protested and where then taken away to jail with a few extra kicks/beating for good measure (according to the unreliable "poor" people).

 

Some landfills in the USA have the same issues at that stated in this article. Why? Because the company installed a cheap liner rather than the specified one to save money. Regarding the incinerators they are only as good as the scrubbers are .. meaning there are cases where incinerator operators in the USA have been fined because they did not operator the scrubber system in order to increase profits.

 

My reasoning is why not build one less skyscraper in Beijing and build some efficient incinerators but that would not make the billionaire government officials there any richer would it that would cost them money wouldn't it.

 

One can easily make this arguement about numerous USA local, state, and federal projects also....why not give more the poor, to infrastructure, to enviromental projects, etc. We piss away so much money on special interests projects it numbs most people to the point of "refusal to beleive" it is really happening.

I can't deny any of that.

 

Larry