Infrastructure: East Beats West?

[Dennis143]

There are advantages in starting from scratch (middle ages say) in the late 20th century. Just as things in Europe were more advanced from building up again after WW2. Our disadvantage is that we haven't been bombed into a Stone Age and rebuild up from that.

 

That is the problem. We had building booms in the 1950's & 60's. That is post WW2. But it was about fifty years ago. Technology has changed from then and we are not up on it. the country has grown but the infrastructure did not keep up.

 

In the fifties and sixties China also did much building but it was cheap and barely adequate. There was no choice but to replace crumbling infrastructure.

 

We need to stop patching and replace. Maybe then L.A. will stop having rolling blackouts.

I can't be the only one when returning from China who feels like our cities are simple villages by comparison?

 

Cripes, when flying over LA after returning from Nanning it was really weird to hardly see any building over a few stories tall. It really was a bit humbling to not see a building crane. Made me wonder how we rate as the worlds richest country with so few people.

 

China is so rich and vibrant. I suppose, unless you live in downtown Manhattan nothing else compares.

 

I am missing China terribly tonight.

 

 

Am I off topic?

[Dan R]

There are advantages in starting from scratch (middle ages say) in the late 20th century. Just as things in Europe were more advanced from building up again after WW2. Our disadvantage is that we haven't been bombed into a Stone Age and rebuild up from that.

 

That is the problem. We had building booms in the 1950's & 60's. That is post WW2. But it was about fifty years ago. Technology has changed from then and we are not up on it. the country has grown but the infrastructure did not keep up.

 

In the fifties and sixties China also did much building but it was cheap and barely adequate. There was no choice but to replace crumbling infrastructure.

 

We need to stop patching and replace. Maybe then L.A. will stop having rolling blackouts.

I can't be the only one when returning from China who feels like our cities are simple villages by comparison?

 

Cripes, when flying over LA after returning from Nanning it was really weird to hardly see any building over a few stories tall. It really was a bit humbling to not see a building crane. Made me wonder how we rate as the worlds richest country with so few people.

 

China is so rich and vibrant. I suppose, unless you live in downtown Manhattan nothing else compares.

 

I am missing China terribly tonight.

 

 

Am I off topic?

 

Perhaps the difference is China's history of multifamily dwellings and that you don't own the land. In the USA we have the frontier spirit. Daniel Boone would move as soon as he could see the next neighbor's house from his home. We also have the American Dream of house and land ownership.

 

I am glad L.A. is mostly 1 or 2 stories high. After all we do have earthquakes. They say the most deaths and injuries, when the big one comes, will be from falling glass downtown.

[Dan R]

There are advantages in starting from scratch (middle ages say) in the late 20th century. Just as things in Europe were more advanced from building up again after WW2. Our disadvantage is that we haven't been bombed into a Stone Age and rebuild up from that.

 

That is the problem. We had building booms in the 1950's & 60's. That is post WW2. But it was about fifty years ago. Technology has changed from then and we are not up on it. the country has grown but the infrastructure did not keep up.

 

In the fifties and sixties China also did much building but it was cheap and barely adequate. There was no choice but to replace crumbling infrastructure.

 

We need to stop patching and replace. Maybe then L.A. will stop having rolling blackouts.

I can't be the only one when returning from China who feels like our cities are simple villages by comparison?

 

Cripes, when flying over LA after returning from Nanning it was really weird to hardly see any building over a few stories tall. It really was a bit humbling to not see a building crane. Made me wonder how we rate as the worlds richest country with so few people.

 

China is so rich and vibrant. I suppose, unless you live in downtown Manhattan nothing else compares.

 

I am missing China terribly tonight.

 

 

Am I off topic?

 

Perhaps the difference is China's history of multifamily dwellings and that you don't own the land. In the USA we have the frontier spirit. Daniel Boone would move as soon as he could see the next neighbor's house from his home. We also have the American Dream of house and land ownership.

 

I am glad L.A. is mostly 1 or 2 stories high. After all we do have earthquakes. They say the most deaths and injuries, when the big one comes, will be from falling glass downtown.

 

As for missing China..... shut up Dennis. Ping isn't back yet and I am really in need of a vacation.

[Dan R]

There are advantages in starting from scratch (middle ages say) in the late 20th century. Just as things in Europe were more advanced from building up again after WW2. Our disadvantage is that we haven't been bombed into a Stone Age and rebuild up from that.

 

That is the problem. We had building booms in the 1950's & 60's. That is post WW2. But it was about fifty years ago. Technology has changed from then and we are not up on it. the country has grown but the infrastructure did not keep up.

 

In the fifties and sixties China also did much building but it was cheap and barely adequate. There was no choice but to replace crumbling infrastructure.

 

We need to stop patching and replace. Maybe then L.A. will stop having rolling blackouts.

I can't be the only one when returning from China who feels like our cities are simple villages by comparison?

 

Cripes, when flying over LA after returning from Nanning it was really weird to hardly see any building over a few stories tall. It really was a bit humbling to not see a building crane. Made me wonder how we rate as the worlds richest country with so few people.

 

China is so rich and vibrant. I suppose, unless you live in downtown Manhattan nothing else compares.

 

I am missing China terribly tonight.

 

 

Am I off topic?

 

Perhaps the difference is China's history of multifamily dwellings and that you don't own the land. In the USA we have the frontier spirit. Daniel Boone would move as soon as he could see the next neighbor's house from his home. We also have the American Dream of house and land ownership.

 

I am glad L.A. is mostly 1 or 2 stories high. After all we do have earthquakes. They say the most deaths and injuries, when the big one comes, will be from falling glass downtown.

 

As for missing China..... shut up Dennis. Ping isn't back yet and I am really in need of a vacation.

 

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

[Dennis143]

There are advantages in starting from scratch (middle ages say) in the late 20th century. Just as things in Europe were more advanced from building up again after WW2. Our disadvantage is that we haven't been bombed into a Stone Age and rebuild up from that.

 

That is the problem. We had building booms in the 1950's & 60's. That is post WW2. But it was about fifty years ago. Technology has changed from then and we are not up on it. the country has grown but the infrastructure did not keep up.

 

In the fifties and sixties China also did much building but it was cheap and barely adequate. There was no choice but to replace crumbling infrastructure.

 

We need to stop patching and replace. Maybe then L.A. will stop having rolling blackouts.

I can't be the only one when returning from China who feels like our cities are simple villages by comparison?

 

Cripes, when flying over LA after returning from Nanning it was really weird to hardly see any building over a few stories tall. It really was a bit humbling to not see a building crane. Made me wonder how we rate as the worlds richest country with so few people.

 

China is so rich and vibrant. I suppose, unless you live in downtown Manhattan nothing else compares.

 

I am missing China terribly tonight.

 

 

Am I off topic?

 

Perhaps the difference is China's history of multifamily dwellings and that you don't own the land. In the USA we have the frontier spirit. Daniel Boone would move as soon as he could see the next neighbor's house from his home. We also have the American Dream of house and land ownership.

 

I am glad L.A. is mostly 1 or 2 stories high. After all we do have earthquakes. They say the most deaths and injuries, when the big one comes, will be from falling glass downtown.

 

As for missing China..... shut up Dennis. Ping isn't back yet and I am really in need of a vacation.

 

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

No sweat bro...at least you got 3 posts out of 1. B)

 

Perhaps we should plan a trip to the MK together to fetch your Ping.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

No sweat bro...at least you got 3 posts out of 1.

 

Perhaps we should plan a trip to the MK together to fetch your Ping.

 

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

Edited January 31, 2009 by ShaQuaNew (see edit history)

[Dan R]

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

No sweat bro...at least you got 3 posts out of 1.

 

Perhaps we should plan a trip to the MK together to fetch your Ping.

 

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

 

So might you say "Don't miss the forest for the trees"? I am still working on this one. I research things until I am satisfied I know enough about them. It gives me great satisfaction but rarely do I need that much. I am trying to learn to research enough for pleasure but enjoy the bigger picture. When you apply the yin yang it kind of makes understanding or seeking unnecessary I think. Because when you quantify you limit reality.

 

Perhaps it is aging or maybe not finding meaningfullness in the search. The past few years I find myself content with having less and less which seems to be more.

 

Do I make any sense?

[rogerluli]

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

No sweat bro...at least you got 3 posts out of 1.

 

Perhaps we should plan a trip to the MK together to fetch your Ping.

 

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

 

So might you say "Don't miss the forest for the trees"? I am still working on this one. I research things until I am satisfied I know enough about them. It gives me great satisfaction but rarely do I need that much. I am trying to learn to research enough for pleasure but enjoy the bigger picture. When you apply the yin yang it kind of makes understanding or seeking unnecessary I think. Because when you quantify you limit reality.

 

Perhaps it is aging or maybe not finding meaningfullness in the search. The past few years I find myself content with having less and less which seems to be more.

 

Do I make any sense?

 

No Dan...

 

But seriously has there been even one post here that has not been... and it has been the Cali contingent that has dragged it off course the most... I think I'll go down and HIJACK youse guys meet-up thingie...

[Dan R]

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

No sweat bro...at least you got 3 posts out of 1.

 

Perhaps we should plan a trip to the MK together to fetch your Ping.

 

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

 

So might you say "Don't miss the forest for the trees"? I am still working on this one. I research things until I am satisfied I know enough about them. It gives me great satisfaction but rarely do I need that much. I am trying to learn to research enough for pleasure but enjoy the bigger picture. When you apply the yin yang it kind of makes understanding or seeking unnecessary I think. Because when you quantify you limit reality.

 

Perhaps it is aging or maybe not finding meaningfullness in the search. The past few years I find myself content with having less and less which seems to be more.

 

Do I make any sense?

 

No Dan...

 

But seriously has there been even one post here that has not been... and it has been the Cali contingent that has dragged it off course the most... I think I'll go down and HIJACK youse guys meet-up thingie...

 

Love you too Rog.

[rogerluli]

Bro, I hope you know I said shut up out of frustration and not to be rude to you.

 

Ok back to topic!

No sweat bro...at least you got 3 posts out of 1.

 

Perhaps we should plan a trip to the MK together to fetch your Ping.

 

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

 

So might you say "Don't miss the forest for the trees"? I am still working on this one. I research things until I am satisfied I know enough about them. It gives me great satisfaction but rarely do I need that much. I am trying to learn to research enough for pleasure but enjoy the bigger picture. When you apply the yin yang it kind of makes understanding or seeking unnecessary I think. Because when you quantify you limit reality.

 

Perhaps it is aging or maybe not finding meaningfullness in the search. The past few years I find myself content with having less and less which seems to be more.

 

Do I make any sense?

 

No Dan...

 

But seriously has there been even one post here that has not been... and it has been the Cali contingent that has dragged it off course the most... I think I'll go down and HIJACK youse guys meet-up thingie...

 

Love you too Rog.

 

[david_dawei]

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

at it's most basic level, yin yang is the interconnectedness of life; it is practially speaking, two sides of one coin. In metaphor, it certainly can be as Dan says about trees and forest; no matter what you see, there is something more out there that makes it more complete on another level. We tend to see and experience in discrete ways and not complete ways; that is what 'enlightenment' is ultimately offering, the chance to see beyond what you see; to see the infinity of it all till you see nothing.

 

So this could be applied in some ways as you are mentioning, but it's a very loose application of yin yang since it is really about balance based on a larger perspective... so if you see the balancing aspect then it is good.

 

What should be kept in mind is, in the application, at it's core, yin yang beckons one to return back to simplicity, back to undivided wholes... So desire to learn more and more and more on it's own, may not be complete balance... to accept that, the more I learn the less I know is a bit of balance since "knowing" and "not knowing" are part of the whole. To attempt to exhaust "knowing" may create imbalance.

[Dan R]

You know Dan, you posted something the other day, in another thread about the ying and yang when it comes to the differences we all express in our perceptions of East and West. Others have posted thoughts about, and I paraphrase, "that many posting here are over-complicating the issues."

 

With China's more than 5000 year history, and the US with about 250 years, it really seems an equation that will not balance. I remember several years ago, saying, "I will never be satisfied, and want to always seek more, learn more, and find deeper meaning." It began a great debate between some of my fellow classmates, who were troubled that I would always be seeking and never finding. I tried to correct their perception, in by explaining that I was enjoying what I saw, but always believed that there would be more behind what I saw and perceived.

 

I guess this thinking still lives deep in my psyche somewhere, as I enjoy finding explanations for the things that are. But, when I look back those many years ago to that conversation, I can see that I've missed out on so many of the simple things in life, that defy explanation. Perhaps they are best explained in the ying, and the yang....

at it's most basic level, yin yang is the interconnectedness of life; it is practially speaking, two sides of one coin. In metaphor, it certainly can be as Dan says about trees and forest; no matter what you see, there is something more out there that makes it more complete on another level. We tend to see and experience in discrete ways and not complete ways; that is what 'enlightenment' is ultimately offering, the chance to see beyond what you see; to see the infinity of it all till you see nothing.

 

So this could be applied in some ways as you are mentioning, but it's a very loose application of yin yang since it is really about balance based on a larger perspective... so if you see the balancing aspect then it is good.

 

What should be kept in mind is, in the application, at it's core, yin yang beckons one to return back to simplicity, back to undivided wholes... So desire to learn more and more and more on it's own, may not be complete balance... to accept that, the more I learn the less I know is a bit of balance since "knowing" and "not knowing" are part of the whole. To attempt to exhaust "knowing" may create imbalance.

 

If you spin the symbol it blurs into one. division is the minds attempt to define its environment.

[rogerluli]

Attempting to get back to something resembling the topic...

 

Here is one for David from the Han Dynasty about a famous general who endured humiliation in his youth which became a virtue later...

 

http://en.epochtimes.com/news/6-8-16/45022.html

[david_dawei]

Han Xin's life is quite interesting and worth reading about. In the end, He was setup, wrongly accused of treason and killed.

 

Interesting to note from the article that this comes from a writing intended as "Comprehensive Lessons for the Government"...

 

His life has an ancient lesson applied today in the US by the current president... which Lincoln was given credit for and known to apply, of "giving government positions to your competition"...

 

The bully who humiliated Han Xin in early life, was later given a government position by Han Xin ! (Maybe the credit should go back almost 2000 years earlier... )

[Dan R]

Han Xin's life is quite interesting and worth reading about. In the end, He was setup, wrongly accused of treason and killed.

 

Interesting to note from the article that this comes from a writing intended as "Comprehensive Lessons for the Government"...

 

His life has an ancient lesson applied today in the US by the current president... which Lincoln was given credit for and known to apply, of "giving government positions to your competition"...

 

The bully who humiliated Han Xin in early life, was later given a government position by Han Xin ! (Maybe the credit should go back almost 2000 years earlier... )

 

even earlier

 

Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer.

Sun-tzu

Chinese general & military strategist (~400 BC)

 

But would Lincoln have heard of either of them in 1860? He was an avid reader but when were they translated to English?