The T'ang Dynasty...

[Urkidding]

Hey....

 

Where's Roger to defend his Middle Kindom and keep this post on track....

 

 

oh well...

 

 

I'll jsut go ahead and add my

 

http://i24.tinypic.com/2e21ms7.jpg

[david_dawei]

 

I will say that the chinese 'fat' is more akin to just barely plump...

 

For the east, it is more from India that we see some examples of 'fat' as we do in the west...one good example is the "Sleeping Fat Lady" (also known as the Sleeping Female Buddha)... she was considered a goddess of fertility

http://www.gozo.us/images/sleeping-lady.jpg

 

Your thinking about being just barely plump may have some merit. It makes you wonder how a culture that is predominated by thin people, would view plump as sexy? That seemed to be the thing in Ancient Rome and Greece, and you often see it depicted in the statues and paintings of the time. Do you think perhaps the rich, who had access to more food, would be a little plumper?

Not sure that 'plump as sexy' is an ancient chinese sentiment, as it might be in the west.

 

Plumb would be a sign of fertility in a woman and a sign of a good wife who takes care of a man [via cooking], when the man is plump. I would tend to agree that being rich gives one easier access to food and often it's not just riches but girth that grows.. but again, chinese tend towards moderation over thousands of years in a way the west still cannot accomplish.

 

Chinese Beauty through the changes of time

 

Ceramic figures of elegant female courtiers that were used as tomb furnishings in the period are known today as 'Fat Ladies' for their fleshy faces.

This makes sense in relation to the thousands of years old chinese art of face reading... plump in the face has meaning.... just as fat (or large) ears is a sign of wisdom (Lao Zi is often depicted with hugh ears).

[Dennis143]

 

I will say that the chinese 'fat' is more akin to just barely plump...

 

For the east, it is more from India that we see some examples of 'fat' as we do in the west...one good example is the "Sleeping Fat Lady" (also known as the Sleeping Female Buddha)... she was considered a goddess of fertility

http://www.gozo.us/images/sleeping-lady.jpg

 

Your thinking about being just barely plump may have some merit. It makes you wonder how a culture that is predominated by thin people, would view plump as sexy? That seemed to be the thing in Ancient Rome and Greece, and you often see it depicted in the statues and paintings of the time. Do you think perhaps the rich, who had access to more food, would be a little plumper?

Not sure that 'plump as sexy' is an ancient chinese sentiment, as it might be in the west.

 

Plumb would be a sign of fertility in a woman and a sign of a good wife who takes care of a man [via cooking], when the man is plump. I would tend to agree that being rich gives one easier access to food and often it's not just riches but girth that grows.. but again, chinese tend towards moderation over thousands of years in a way the west still cannot accomplish.

 

Chinese Beauty through the changes of time

 

Ceramic figures of elegant female courtiers that were used as tomb furnishings in the period are known today as 'Fat Ladies' for their fleshy faces.

This makes sense in relation to the thousands of years old chinese art of face reading... plump in the face has meaning.... just as fat (or large) ears is a sign of wisdom (Lao Zi is often depicted with hugh ears).

I found it a bit peculiar... while I was in Nanning last July, I would often see the working girls come to work at night fall. One girl was particularlly plump. The boss man who told Leiqin to wait in the hall while he directed me to the girls one evening, told me that chubby girls are very busy with many Chinese male customers.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

Plumb would be a sign of fertility in a woman and a sign of a good wife who takes care of a man [via cooking], when the man is plump. I would tend to agree that being rich gives one easier access to food and often it's not just riches but girth that grows.. but again, chinese tend towards moderation over thousands of years in a way the west still cannot accomplish.

 

Chinese Beauty through the changes of time

 

Ceramic figures of elegant female courtiers that were used as tomb furnishings in the period are known today as 'Fat Ladies' for their fleshy faces.

 

This makes sense in relation to the thousands of years old chinese art of face reading... plump in the face has meaning.... just as fat (or large) ears is a sign of wisdom (Lao Zi is often depicted with hugh ears).

 

I thought "Plumb" was a measure of vertical as it relates to the perpendicular plane? LOL

 

That was an interesting link you posted. Here are some snippets from it:

 

*The Emperor Ch'en-ti was attracted by her slim and graceful figure. She displayed her agile body as a vivacious and energetic dancer.

 

*Terracotta sculptures that survive from the Han dynasty reflect the tall, slender ideal of feminine beauty so admired by the Emperor. Tomb figures from this period strive to capture the life and vitality of the subject and are noted for their graceful, slender style.

 

*The T'ang dynasty is renowned for the artistic and personal freedom it afforded women. Artwork from the period shows energetic, full-bodied women engaged in outdoor athletic sporting pursuits such as polo on horseback (2). Delicate features and plump faces in sculptures of aristocratic ladies of the T'ang dynasty convey the ideal image of feminine beauty.

 

*In contrast to the T'ang dynasty, women were now encouraged to remain indoors and to be seen by none but their husbands. It was socially expected that women should display their virtue physically.

 

*As such, footbinding formed part of a larger valorisation of passion, or qing, that is characteristic of the Ming dynasty. A high point of Chinese erotic culture, the cult of qing helped to bring explicit sensual and passionate significance to ideals of beauty in women.

 

*The difference between ideals of beauty in the Ming and Ch'ing dynasties is revealed in the exclusion of all poems dealing with love, sex or romance from a collection of women's poetry by Wanyan Yun Zhu, published in 1831 (7). She wrote that, "in compiling this anthology, I have attached the greatest importance to purity of emotional expression and the harmony and elegance of rhymes poems about sexual love and romance by courtesans, whom earlier compilers anthologised profusely and rhapsodised over, are not included here."

 

*(1911-1976) The practice of footbinding declined and many women wore the cheungsam or qipao . In response to the shorter skirts seen in Western fashion, the cheungsam was tight fitting with high side-slits. It revealed more of a woman's body than any previous style of Chinese clothing.

 

*(1976-2003)As a result, the processes of globalization are implicated also in the establishment of beauty industries in China. Practices promoted by these industries typically include breast enlargements, skin whitening procedures, limb lengthening and the creation of 'double' eyelids. Cosmetic surgery is becoming increasingly popular as a means of altering the shape of noses and eyes to accord with Western appearances.

 

The only references I see to plump women here, is in the Tang Dynasty. Just like today, no-one seems to like the plump, thick, and chunky ones.

Edited October 22, 2008 by ShaQuaNew (see edit history)

[rogerluli]

I've been reliably informed that no one wants "chopstick" women either... "not comfortable"...