"Without money you are nothing..."

[Guest Mike and Lily]

And while I'm at it, let me bust the weak-minded argument of there being no property taxes in China.

 

While the property tax system in China is not like the in the US where you have annual tax payments based on the appraised value of your property, make no mistake about it -- that doesn't in any way mean there is a free ride in China.

 

Property developers are heavily taxed on the land they are allocated to build on and one would have to be quite, shall we say, idiotic to believe that these costs are not passed directly on to the home-buying public.

 

Or do you believe that $173,000 dollars for a 100 m2 apartment in a middle-class neighborhood in Guangzhou is the result of people clamoring to enjoy the clean air and 4 kuai crap-in-a-styrofoam-box-lunch sold on the street corners?

 

Try Beijing: $470,000 for the same apartment.

 

For $470k you can get a really nice seashore condo in Miami -- even before property prices tanked there -- and buy a nice BMW with the change.

 

No, the answer does not depend on your income and which state you live in.

 

Bill, being a businessman I well understand all costs are passed on to the consumer, so I'm not asleep in thinking the Chinese businessmen aren't passing on their costs to the home buyers at the time of the sale. One time, right? Yes, we will be paying a condo fee (whatever they choose to call it) for upkeep of the community fountains, security guards, grounds upkeep, etc., but there is no city or provincial payments due after the sale. Correct?

 

Now let me ask you, in hot, muggy, sweltering Guangzhou a mid sized home is the equivalent of $173,000 US dollars, and in Beijing it's $470,000 US equivalent dollars for the same apartment? I was thinking those prices were in RMB, not that I would want to live in Guangahou, even if it were 73rmb for a 100 m2 apartment.

 

Your use of the dollar sign ($) with regards to Chinese and american apartments made me wonder if I was missing something...

 

tsap seui

 

No your not Tsap. He is comparing heavily depressed Miami to Beijing. Maybe he would rather compare Detroit to Beijing instead. If he wanted to use an accurate comparison, he would compare NY City to Beijing where the costs are far higher. And he wants to compare property taxes of 1-3% annually with the taxes that developers pay one time? Of course developers likely pay much more taxes here.

Edited October 31, 2008 by rogerluli (see edit history)

[Guest Mike and Lily]

Also the so-called sales tax in China paid by the merchants is often no more than a bargaining chip used by buyers to obtain a lower price. Unless you're shopping at big department store, 9 times out of 10, merchants won't give out a tax receipt unless you ask them and sometimes not even then.

Edited October 31, 2008 by rogerluli (see edit history)

[rogerluli]

And while I'm at it, let me bust the weak-minded argument of there being no property taxes in China.

 

While the property tax system in China is not like the in the US where you have annual tax payments based on the appraised value of your property, make no mistake about it -- that doesn't in any way mean there is a free ride in China.

 

Property developers are heavily taxed on the land they are allocated to build on and one would have to be quite, shall we say, idiotic to believe that these costs are not passed directly on to the home-buying public.

 

Or do you believe that $173,000 dollars for a 100 m2 apartment in a middle-class neighborhood in Guangzhou is the result of people clamoring to enjoy the clean air and 4 kuai crap-in-a-styrofoam-box-lunch sold on the street corners?

 

Try Beijing: $470,000 for the same apartment.

 

For $470k you can get a really nice seashore condo in Miami -- even before property prices tanked there -- and buy a nice BMW with the change.

 

No, the answer does not depend on your income and which state you live in. The answer depends on whether or not the lobotomy actually helped you in your thinking process or failed.

 

It's simply amazing how stupid some people can be. Amazing.

 

Bill, being a businessman I well understand all costs are passed on to the consumer, so I'm not asleep in thinking the Chinese businessmen aren't passing on their costs to the home buyers at the time of the sale. One time, right? Yes, we will be paying a condo fee (whatever they choose to call it) for upkeep of the community fountains, security guards, grounds upkeep, etc., but there is no city or provincial payments due after the sale. Correct?

 

Now let me ask you, in hot, muggy, sweltering Guangzhou a mid sized home is the equivalent of $173,000 US dollars, and in Beijing it's $470,000 US equivalent dollars for the same apartment? I was thinking those prices were in RMB, not that I would want to live in Guangahou, even if it were 73rmb for a 100 m2 apartment.

 

Your use of the dollar sign ($) with regards to Chinese and american apartments made me wonder if I was missing something...

 

tsap seui

 

No mistake Tsap...The use of the '$' means UNITED STATES DOLLAR to any and all...

 

Thanks cuzin' rOggiE. Why, I'd be dumber than a trout chewin' on a rubber worm to pay that kind of money to live in Guangzhou. Even if the crap in a plastic box was dadgum FREE.

 

Sometimes, I look at life and with a hillbilly grin, I smile...other times...I laugh out loud.

 

tsap seui

 

I'll be quite content in our little burg of Qionghai, Hainan but my wife still hankers after Guangzhou... It's like my grandpappy always said..."Everbody's different..."

[griz326]

Allow me to settle this taxation dispute. No matter where you live on the planet the tax man cometh and is going to get you. No matter where the tax man grabs you...it's going to feel like the world's worst!

 

 

[chilton747]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

[rogerluli]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

[chilton747]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

[rogerluli]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

 

Well we are payin' a ton o' Chaiman Maos to get these stoopid "books"... Is that a tax???

[chilton747]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

 

Well we are payin' a ton o' Chaiman Maos to get these stoopid "books"... Is that a tax???

 

Actually I was expecting this tax but I wasn't sure when it was supposed to be given. Well I just got the news that it is to be paid when the house is finished and you want to get the keys. My tax came in at 2.7%. Now the way I understand this (don't beat me up if I am wrong ), this is a one time lifetime tax fee for this property. This is the way it was for my wife when she purchased her last house in 1995.

 

So yes, the good news is that we have the keys!!! Time to get busy!

[rogerluli]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

 

Well we are payin' a ton o' Chaiman Maos to get these stoopid "books"... Is that a tax???

 

Actually I was expecting this tax but I wasn't sure when it was supposed to be given. Well I just got the news that it is to be paid when the house is finished and you want to get the keys. My tax came in at 2.7%. Now the way I understand this (don't beat me up if I am wrong ), this is a one time lifetime tax fee for this property. This is the way it was for my wife when she purchased her last house in 1995.

 

So yes, the good news is that we have the keys!!! Time to get busy!

 

Shoot we got the keys for the Yunnan house two years ago when we paid...But we still have NO BOOKS... Now we have to pay 14k RMB for one book for the building and then sometime later... when the FLIPPIN'BOOK for the land is done we get too pay again for that one...NO TAX MY ARSE...

[chilton747]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

 

Well we are payin' a ton o' Chaiman Maos to get these stoopid "books"... Is that a tax???

 

Actually I was expecting this tax but I wasn't sure when it was supposed to be given. Well I just got the news that it is to be paid when the house is finished and you want to get the keys. My tax came in at 2.7%. Now the way I understand this (don't beat me up if I am wrong ), this is a one time lifetime tax fee for this property. This is the way it was for my wife when she purchased her last house in 1995.

 

So yes, the good news is that we have the keys!!! Time to get busy!

 

Shoot we got the keys for the Yunnan house two years ago when we paid...But we still have NO BOOKS... Now we have to pay 14k RMB for one book for the building and then sometime later... when the FLIPPIN'BOOK for the land is done we get too pay again for that one...NO TAX MY ARSE...

 

Roggie, ya needs ta edumacate me. What are these BOOKS you are referring to?

[rogerluli]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

 

Well we are payin' a ton o' Chaiman Maos to get these stoopid "books"... Is that a tax???

 

Actually I was expecting this tax but I wasn't sure when it was supposed to be given. Well I just got the news that it is to be paid when the house is finished and you want to get the keys. My tax came in at 2.7%. Now the way I understand this (don't beat me up if I am wrong ), this is a one time lifetime tax fee for this property. This is the way it was for my wife when she purchased her last house in 1995.

 

So yes, the good news is that we have the keys!!! Time to get busy!

 

Shoot we got the keys for the Yunnan house two years ago when we paid...But we still have NO BOOKS... Now we have to pay 14k RMB for one book for the building and then sometime later... when the FLIPPIN'BOOK for the land is done we get too pay again for that one...NO TAX MY ARSE...

 

Roggie, ya needs ta edumacate me. What are these BOOKS you are referring to?

 

Whadya think I can read Chinese???

 

I guess they're the ownership books...They're red... ...and fold open...just a few pages...with you know Chinese charcaters

[chilton747]

Just got the tax bill for my house in Zhongshan. Y'all see what all this tawkin caused?

 

TAX BILL??? Whatcha talkin' about cuzin??? You know we've got houses all over and I've never paid 1 jiao for tax...Have I???

 

 

Yes you have cuzin Roggie. You jes didn't know it.

 

Well we are payin' a ton o' Chaiman Maos to get these stoopid "books"... Is that a tax???

 

Actually I was expecting this tax but I wasn't sure when it was supposed to be given. Well I just got the news that it is to be paid when the house is finished and you want to get the keys. My tax came in at 2.7%. Now the way I understand this (don't beat me up if I am wrong ), this is a one time lifetime tax fee for this property. This is the way it was for my wife when she purchased her last house in 1995.

 

So yes, the good news is that we have the keys!!! Time to get busy!

 

Shoot we got the keys for the Yunnan house two years ago when we paid...But we still have NO BOOKS... Now we have to pay 14k RMB for one book for the building and then sometime later... when the FLIPPIN'BOOK for the land is done we get too pay again for that one...NO TAX MY ARSE...

 

Roggie, ya needs ta edumacate me. What are these BOOKS you are referring to?

 

Whadya think I can read Chinese???

 

I guess they're the ownership books...They're red... ...and fold open...just a few pages...with you know Chinese charcaters

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh....THAT BOOK. I'm hoping that our bank's lawyer will take care of that.......or.....at least that's what I was told

[GZBILL]

And while I'm at it, let me bust the weak-minded argument of there being no property taxes in China.

 

While the property tax system in China is not like the in the US where you have annual tax payments based on the appraised value of your property, make no mistake about it -- that doesn't in any way mean there is a free ride in China.

 

Property developers are heavily taxed on the land they are allocated to build on and one would have to be quite, shall we say, idiotic to believe that these costs are not passed directly on to the home-buying public.

 

Or do you believe that $173,000 dollars for a 100 m2 apartment in a middle-class neighborhood in Guangzhou is the result of people clamoring to enjoy the clean air and 4 kuai crap-in-a-styrofoam-box-lunch sold on the street corners?

 

Try Beijing: $470,000 for the same apartment.

 

For $470k you can get a really nice seashore condo in Miami -- even before property prices tanked there -- and buy a nice BMW with the change.

 

No, the answer does not depend on your income and which state you live in.

 

Bill, being a businessman I well understand all costs are passed on to the consumer, so I'm not asleep in thinking the Chinese businessmen aren't passing on their costs to the home buyers at the time of the sale. One time, right? Yes, we will be paying a condo fee (whatever they choose to call it) for upkeep of the community fountains, security guards, grounds upkeep, etc., but there is no city or provincial payments due after the sale. Correct?

 

At a minimum 35% tax rate just for the land (i.e. excluding other taxes a normal business pays) passed on to the home buyer, it would matter little if -- for the moment -- there are no continual city or provincial assessments. Even if my property tax rate back home were 5%, I'm still paying at least 7 years worth of property taxes up front here.

 

Now let me ask you, in hot, muggy, sweltering Guangzhou a mid sized home is the equivalent of $173,000 US dollars, and in Beijing it's $470,000 US equivalent dollars for the same apartment? I was thinking those prices were in RMB, not that I would want to live in Guangahou, even if it were 73rmb for a 100 m2 apartment.

 

Your use of the dollar sign ($) with regards to Chinese and american apartments made me wonder if I was missing something...

 

tsap seui

 

By $ I mean US$. If RMB, than I'd use either the symbol for RMB (¥) or RMB itself.

[GZBILL]

And while I'm at it, let me bust the weak-minded argument of there being no property taxes in China.

 

While the property tax system in China is not like the in the US where you have annual tax payments based on the appraised value of your property, make no mistake about it -- that doesn't in any way mean there is a free ride in China.

 

Property developers are heavily taxed on the land they are allocated to build on and one would have to be quite, shall we say, idiotic to believe that these costs are not passed directly on to the home-buying public.

 

Or do you believe that $173,000 dollars for a 100 m2 apartment in a middle-class neighborhood in Guangzhou is the result of people clamoring to enjoy the clean air and 4 kuai crap-in-a-styrofoam-box-lunch sold on the street corners?

 

Try Beijing: $470,000 for the same apartment.

 

For $470k you can get a really nice seashore condo in Miami -- even before property prices tanked there -- and buy a nice BMW with the change.

 

No, the answer does not depend on your income and which state you live in.

 

Bill, being a businessman I well understand all costs are passed on to the consumer, so I'm not asleep in thinking the Chinese businessmen aren't passing on their costs to the home buyers at the time of the sale. One time, right? Yes, we will be paying a condo fee (whatever they choose to call it) for upkeep of the community fountains, security guards, grounds upkeep, etc., but there is no city or provincial payments due after the sale. Correct?

 

Now let me ask you, in hot, muggy, sweltering Guangzhou a mid sized home is the equivalent of $173,000 US dollars, and in Beijing it's $470,000 US equivalent dollars for the same apartment? I was thinking those prices were in RMB, not that I would want to live in Guangahou, even if it were 73rmb for a 100 m2 apartment.

 

Your use of the dollar sign ($) with regards to Chinese and american apartments made me wonder if I was missing something...

 

tsap seui

 

No your not Tsap. He is comparing heavily depressed Miami to Beijing. Maybe he would rather compare Detroit to Beijing instead. If he wanted to use an accurate comparison, he would compare NY City to Beijing where the costs are far higher. And he wants to compare property taxes of 1-3% annually with the taxes that developers pay one time? Of course developers likely pay much more taxes here.

 

Reading comprehension not your forte?

 

... Miami ... before property prices tanked there ...

 

And show now logic escapes you, too?

 

How would the population / area ratio of NYC compare to Beijing?

 

A minimum of 35% up front here vs. 1 - 3% annually in the US.

 

Do you ever know WTF you are talking about?

Edited November 1, 2008 by GZBILL (see edit history)