China gymnastics gets too much bad rap!

[IllinoisDave]

I just don't see how they cheated. Age, big deal. They lost. Had USA won, would it have been any more controversial?

 

I for one don't support cheating and do not believe cheating was involved.

 

 

 

http://www.nbcolympics.com/mm/photo/olympiczone/general/23/24/58/232458_m03.jpg

 

Cheating or not. They simply outbested the US athletes. A great athlete will be able to come out on top.

That's quite an endorsement.

The question is did they gain an unfair advantage because of their size due to the fact that they may be 4 to 5 years younger than the competition. You or I don't know that for certain either way.

 

Regardless, the rules were put in place by people who are familiar with the sport and should be followed by all. You can choose to ignore the evidence that's been put forth in many places if you want. Some of us are able to make an objective judgement based on that evidence, some are not.

[Yuanyang]

If it ain't American it's Crap!

 

If Americans' lose it's cuz someone Cheated!

Cmon Bob. That's a HUGE over-simplification of the arguments being made here. Some of those making the argument that cheating went on can hardly be considered among the "Rah Rah USA!!" crowd.

 

Some of us have already conceded that the Chinese women out-performed the US gymnasts head-to-head, at least in some cases. The point is that the rules are there for EVERYONE. Pointing out that there's evidence that one side or the other didn't follow all those rules is not sour grapes or "Everyone else sucks but the USA", it's just dealing with the reality of the situation.

What? My humor is lost?

 

Ok, it's a sport that has subjective measurements. IMHO any competition whose outcome is by something other than a timer or a tape measure will have bias. (In my non-expert opinion I saw a Russian woman robbed in the trampoline last night.)

 

In the end Dave, we both know, as did the Russian lady, that we have to take it like Gentlemen or Ladies and that's that. If a real issue exists those are dealt with later and hopefully the next games will be better. I think that's been working.

Edited August 20, 2008 by Yuanyang (see edit history)

[hakkamike]

McGwire and Bonds are suffering a massive self-induced Hall of Fame snub that will last forever. It seems like the Chinese women's gymnastics team will suffer the same fate. They will be loved in China, but everywhere else looked at as cheaters.

 

You're not just a "little" wrong about this, but rather you're completely and utterly mistaken!

 

The China Womens gymnastics team did nothing to deserve with being compared with the likes of illegal drug users like Mark McGwire and Barry Bonds. The young ladies from China have NOT cheated, nor did they disobey any rules. They complied with every request and regulation issued by the International Olympic Committee. The ladies of China simply out performed their competitors and did it without the use of artificial enhancements like illegal drugs.

 

I think they are too young and used drugs too, can u prove me wrong?

[Randy W]

You're Mikey, aren't you ?

[Guest WenDylan]

McGwire and Bonds are suffering a massive self-induced Hall of Fame snub that will last forever. It seems like the Chinese women's gymnastics team will suffer the same fate. They will be loved in China, but everywhere else looked at as cheaters.

 

You're not just a "little" wrong about this, but rather you're completely and utterly mistaken!

 

The China Womens gymnastics team did nothing to deserve with being compared with the likes of illegal drug users like Mark McGwire and Barry Bonds. The young ladies from China have NOT cheated, nor did they disobey any rules. They complied with every request and regulation issued by the International Olympic Committee. The ladies of China simply out performed their competitors and did it without the use of artificial enhancements like illegal drugs.

 

I think they are too young and used drugs too, can u prove me wrong?

They could have been men.

 

Here's the next Chinese gymnast Olympians gearing up!

 

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1223/1025548821_15f76657a3.jpg

[spacebar]

gOOOOOOOOOO Children of the future! lol

 

 

McGwire and Bonds are suffering a massive self-induced Hall of Fame snub that will last forever. It seems like the Chinese women's gymnastics team will suffer the same fate. They will be loved in China, but everywhere else looked at as cheaters.

 

You're not just a "little" wrong about this, but rather you're completely and utterly mistaken!

 

The China Womens gymnastics team did nothing to deserve with being compared with the likes of illegal drug users like Mark McGwire and Barry Bonds. The young ladies from China have NOT cheated, nor did they disobey any rules. They complied with every request and regulation issued by the International Olympic Committee. The ladies of China simply out performed their competitors and did it without the use of artificial enhancements like illegal drugs.

 

I think they are too young and used drugs too, can u prove me wrong?

They could have been men.

 

Here's the next Chinese gymnast Olympians gearing up!

 

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1223/1025548821_15f76657a3.jpg

[Yuanyang]

... besides our Chinese coaches are better than theirs.

[Guest Rob & Jin]

... besides our Chinese coaches are better than theirs.

 

 

 

 

our coaches inject drugs,theres lie about age, cheating is cheating B)

[jim_julian]

Spacebar ... spacebar ... ahh what the heck, no sense arguing with him ... sigh

 

Anyway, I thought the US ladies were gracious in the face of the obvious age issue and the admittedly subjective scoring issues.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

What they did is obvious - they looked at the passports and saw the birthdates that were printed. There is plenty of evidence, both here and other places, that they competed at the ages of 12 and 13 less than 2 years ago.

 

If the IOC doesn't want to look, they won't.

 

What may be obvious to you Randy, doesn't even make it to the radar screen for many others. It appears that Western television has nothing better to do than complain about something that is a complete non-issue. So, would it make the supporters feel better if the Chinese Gymnastics team were stripped of its gold medals and had them given to the US in a humbling ceremony? It's such an arrogant display of poor sportsmanship. US media should be ashamed and so should those who buy into the sour-grapes.

 

The young Chinese woman that took the bronze in the all-around competition was so humble and gracious after she completed her competition. Rather than whining about what should have happened she said that she was proud to receive the bronze because the US women were much better than her. I doubt those words got any air-time on NBC or any other US network.

[IllinoisDave]

If it ain't American it's Crap!

 

B) If Americans' lose it's cuz someone Cheated!

Cmon Bob. That's a HUGE over-simplification of the arguments being made here. Some of those making the argument that cheating went on can hardly be considered among the "Rah Rah USA!!" crowd.

 

Some of us have already conceded that the Chinese women out-performed the US gymnasts head-to-head, at least in some cases. The point is that the rules are there for EVERYONE. Pointing out that there's evidence that one side or the other didn't follow all those rules is not sour grapes or "Everyone else sucks but the USA", it's just dealing with the reality of the situation.

What? My humor is lost?

 

Ok, it's a sport that has subjective measurements. IMHO any competition whose outcome is by something other than a timer or a tape measure will have bias. (In my non-expert opinion I saw a Russian woman robbed in the trampoline last night.)

 

In the end Dave, we both know, as did the Russian lady, that we have to take it like Gentlemen or Ladies and that's that. If a real issue exists those are dealt with later and hopefully the next games will be better. I think that's been working.

I agree Bob, the scoring is very subjective and open to each person and judge's own interpretation. That's why IMHO it's so important in a sport like gymnastics for everyone to at least start out on the same playing field so to speak. If there is an advantage,and again I don't know if there is, to being younger and physically smaller in the sport then that didn't happen here.

 

That's all we're saying.

[izus]

I read somewhere that most every country in the world counts the gold medal tally as the actual count...but the US counts total medals...kind of like the metric vs english system...The US is right and the rest of the world is wrong...

why not 2nd and 3rd means you didnt win

Edited August 20, 2008 by izus (see edit history)

[izus]

Truly Jesse, Bigguy's post was over the top and not even worth comment, IMO.

 

Perhaps there are times when ignoring such assinine commentary might be appropriate. IMO this wasn't one of those times.....

 

B)

I am tired of the arguments about the Chinese girls. They did a great job, and won rightfully so... the better Olympic performers in my modest opinion. I am sad that we did not get gold, but no use crying over spilt milk.

we've been watching the games on brighthouse network which is allowing us to see 5 nbc channels including one broadcasted in mandarin.

we were watching one of them a week or so back when this topic first came up and Bela Karolyi was giving some interview with Costas about it. he was saying how he could not understand how china would give these young girls the opportunity to be in this position due to the fact the age experience and how the younger girls will not be able to cope with the pressure of a team mate messing up and keeping focus and that he didnt care if they were younger or not.

 

that attitude changed quickly

[Guest Mike and Lily]

McGwire and Bonds are suffering a massive self-induced Hall of Fame snub that will last forever. It seems like the Chinese women's gymnastics team will suffer the same fate. They will be loved in China, but everywhere else looked at as cheaters.

 

You're not just a "little" wrong about this, but rather you're completely and utterly mistaken!

 

The China Womens gymnastics team did nothing to deserve with being compared with the likes of illegal drug users like Mark McGwire and Barry Bonds. The young ladies from China have NOT cheated, nor did they disobey any rules. They complied with every request and regulation issued by the International Olympic Committee. The ladies of China simply out performed their competitors and did it without the use of artificial enhancements like illegal drugs.

 

 

The girls themselves didn't cheat and are great athletes. The Chinese officials who train/control them apparently did cheat however. There's quite a bit of evidence to show they flouted the rules and falsified passports so some of the girls could compete.

 

If they were under the allowable age limit as if appears some were, did that give them a competetive advantage over the others who were within the limits? I think that's a question best answered by those more expert on gymnastics than us. But the rules are obviously in place for some reason. And as long as they ARE there, EVERYONE should be expected to comply with them.

 

To compare the Chinese gymnasts themselves to Bonds and McGwire and their ilk is illogical. But to dismiss the issue by saying that they complied with every request and regulation issued by the IOC is a bit misleading. Someone apparently didn't comply with every regulation. And while that someone may have been the adults in charge, I doubt the athletes themselves are unaware of the age limits or their own ages.

 

Did the Chinese girls out-perform the other gymnasts head-to-head on a purely athletic and/or artistic level? Absolutely, at least in some cases. So why not just throw out the age limits and let them all compete against each other woman to woman? From a mere observer's perspective that would be my suggestion. But that brings us back to why the rules are in place to begin with.

 

I don't think the Chinese women's gymnasts themselves will suffer the harsh judgement of history as McGgwire, Bonds etal have. But I do believe the Chinese gymnastics program and those who control it will suffer that fate. And if the allegations are true, they should.

 

It certainly is unfair to compare Bonds and McGuire to the Chinese gymnasts. They just did their best and wanted to win. And if they were asked to give a fake age, it was not within their power to refuse the request of the Chinese government.

 

However, the Chinese government probably took a lesson from major league baseball. In a way, Bonds and McGuire are getting a bad rap here. It's the system controlled by major league baseball and the all powerful players union that gave us a corrupt system that prohibited drug testing in major league baseball for so long. For each Bonds and Mcguire that is being scruitinized, there must be 100 or more juicers on the major league rosters. The players were forced to do it to stay competetive. Everyone else did it and didn't get caught, so most of the rest did it just so they could stay on the team. The Chinese probably learned a lesson from our own professional sports organizations and adjusted their ethics accordingly.

[spacebar]

Ok, you are right Jim_julian. No sense in arguing. Absolutely, I agree with you. CFL is a place to share and give back.

I am just happy these little gals did so well and if everyone compares the golds in ladies gymnastisc, USA still Bested China - 8 golds to 6.

 

It's a pity so much controversy has arisen. I can see age may be a issue but I just feel there is a lot of poor sportsmanship and a lot of sore losers who can't admit the loss. Just grinds my biscuits. That being said, I will shut my mouth and restrain myself from arguing LOL.

 

Spacebar ... spacebar ... ahh what the heck, no sense arguing with him ... sigh

 

Anyway, I thought the US ladies were gracious in the face of the obvious age issue and the admittedly subjective scoring issues.