A Communist Party catch-22!!

[Jaseball]

So it seems to make sense to come to the interview prepared for the question and to have the documentation ready to submit in case you get a blue slip.

 

Then an additional 4-6 month wait while they run a name check again?

 

Then another trip to GUZ after the overcome?

 

Insane.

[rogerwink]

If the person stopped paying party dues and hasn't attended any meetings in the past 2 years, but never formally withdrew from the party, then where do they stand?

Once a member always a member, unless they quit the party.

OR QUIT PAYING DUES! (MUCH, MUCH, HEALTHIER!)

 

Someone who quit paying dues to the CCP can honestly say "NO!" if/when asked the "Are you CCP member?" question by the V.O., especially if it's been 2-years!

In any case I would NOT answer "I'm not now, BUT I WAS BEFORE!" (which some people insist is "The HONEST" answer to that question and I stongly disagree! When the V.O's question can be answered with a simple "Yes" or "No", then THAT should be your "honset" response and nothing more!)

When I asked my good friend, who is STILL an active member and who tried to help us with our overcome papers, about not paying dues, he said (I quote!) "6-months after you stop paying your dues, the party drops you from their roster".

Different chapters may drop you sooner, (educational chapters of the CCP which have a big turnover for example, but I'm simply guessing).

From the trouble my MIL had I would NOT suggest asking a CCP officer about it! (They are NOT nice people!)

Also, I would NOT suggest trying to "Formally Resign" from the party either! as my good friend said: (again, I quote!) "Are you crazy!?"

Quit paying dues and if necessary, move somewhere where your local CCP chapter officers cannot find you to harass you.

The only other alternative is to NOT quit and then deal with falling into the CCP pit of despair IF you are asked the dreaded "are you a CCP member?" question. (It is NOT "simply a delay", it is an insane nightmare trying to get someone to translate your "anti-communist" responses for your overcome documents!)

Edited February 26, 2008 by rogerwink (see edit history)

[pkfops]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

Edited February 26, 2008 by pkfops (see edit history)

[rogerwink]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

 

Sorry, but in my previous post "#4 in this thread" I stated that they SPECIFICALLY ask for "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF ALL SUBMITTED DOCUMENTS..."

Someone in California can NOT Legally Notarize the translation of a document from someone who mails it to them from China! They MUST witness the original writer's signature on the original Chinese document.

I WISH it would have been that easy... It was NOT.

Edited February 26, 2008 by rogerwink (see edit history)

[pkfops]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

 

Sorry, but in my previous post "#4 in this thread" I stated that they SPECIFICALLY ask for "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF ALL SUBMITTED DOCUMENTS..."

Someone in California can NOT Legally Notarize the translation of a document from someone who mails it to them from China! They MUST witness the original writer's signature on the original Chinese document.

I WISH it would have been that easy... It was NOT.

 

Did you try HK?

[Randy W]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

 

Sorry, but in my previous post "#4 in this thread" I stated that they SPECIFICALLY ask for "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF ALL SUBMITTED DOCUMENTS..."

Someone in California can NOT Legally Notarize the translation of a document from someone who mails it to them from China! They MUST witness the original writer's signature on the original Chinese document.

I WISH it would have been that easy... It was NOT.

 

You need to make this a do-able task. GUZ does not ask the impossible - just that you do the best that you can.

 

I don't see that they're asking that the signature be notarized - just the translation of the document. Why don't you do what they ask, and let them accept it or not? If you reject it yourself, she'll never get the visa.

[pkfops]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

 

Sorry, but in my previous post "#4 in this thread" I stated that they SPECIFICALLY ask for "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF ALL SUBMITTED DOCUMENTS..."

Someone in California can NOT Legally Notarize the translation of a document from someone who mails it to them from China! They MUST witness the original writer's signature on the original Chinese document.

I WISH it would have been that easy... It was NOT.

 

You need to make this a do-able task. GUZ does not ask the impossible - just that you do the best that you can.

 

I don't see that they're asking that the signature be notarized - just the translation of the document. Why don't you do what they ask, and let them accept it or not? If you reject it yourself, she'll never get the visa.

 

Keyword "Certified Translator".

 

Maybe if they see you made the effort to get this done, it will pass muster.

[rogerwink]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

 

Sorry, but in my previous post "#4 in this thread" I stated that they SPECIFICALLY ask for "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF ALL SUBMITTED DOCUMENTS..."

Someone in California can NOT Legally Notarize the translation of a document from someone who mails it to them from China! They MUST witness the original writer's signature on the original Chinese document.

I WISH it would have been that easy... It was NOT.

 

Did you try HK?

M.I.L. is mainland Chinese person NOT living in ShenZhen.. NOT permitted to go to HK! (she tried to get permission and police said.. No Way!)

[rogerwink]

You might start here.

 

http://chinese-school.netfirms.com/certifi...-Francisco.html

 

Sorry, but in my previous post "#4 in this thread" I stated that they SPECIFICALLY ask for "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF ALL SUBMITTED DOCUMENTS..."

Someone in California can NOT Legally Notarize the translation of a document from someone who mails it to them from China! They MUST witness the original writer's signature on the original Chinese document.

I WISH it would have been that easy... It was NOT.

 

You need to make this a do-able task. GUZ does not ask the impossible - just that you do the best that you can.

 

I don't see that they're asking that the signature be notarized - just the translation of the document. Why don't you do what they ask, and let them accept it or not? If you reject it yourself, she'll never get the visa.

 

As indicated in my previous posts... This is all in the PAST... We mailed the "NOTARIZED ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS" stapled to the hand-written originals that they asked for last year. It is a done deal. Yes I asked them what they meant. Yes they repeated (in their lovely, impersonal, boilerplated e-mail reply, "All Chinese documents must have Notarized English Translation". That is what we sent them after finally flying over to China to find a certified translator who would put her neck on the chopping block by translating the anti-commie documents GUZ requested!

 

The Blue-Slip states exactly this: (I QUOTE!) "All Chinese documents must have Notarized English Translation"

 

My whole purpose in starting this thread was to ask how someone complies with GUZ's Blue-slip CCP demand when EVERY translation company in my MIL's hometown and more than 15-companies in GuangZhou that we contacted, REFUSED TO TRANSLATE THE DOCUMENTS, let alone put any kind of seal on them, CERTIFIED or OTHERWISE!

 

I finally DID find one, independent translator who did the deed EXACTLY AS GUZ ASKED FOR.

 

I have been personally involved in FOUR complete immigrations from China so far, so I am certainly not a neophite. I have done all the "easy" RFE's and Video-Tape-evidence's and updated Support documents, etc.! But.... This Communist Party Question BS is the worst thing I've ever come across because of people's continuing FEAR of messing with the CCP! which makes the seemingly simple task of getting your overcome documents translated...NOT Impossible, but darn near impossible!

 

I sincerely hope that no-one is ever asked the ridiculous, CCP question in an interview ever again...but that is NOT going to be the case!

So I can only hope that people ARRANGE things as early in their immigration process as possible to ALLOW them to HONESTLY answer "NO!" to the COMMUNIST QUESTION that the V.O. may or may not ask you!

[Randy W]

We MAYBE have found an indepedent translator in GuangZhou who will do the "against CCP" translation.

 

We spent all night calling hotels to get phone numbers of translation services and asking them for other contacts when they all said "NOT GONNA DO IT". We had softened the response down as far as we dared and still, no-one would touch it. But finally, someone has agreed to do it. In fact she allowed us to "harden" it back up a bit.

 

If all goes well in GuangZhou, I will post her name and number for others to use when they get into this nasty pickle also.

 

In reply to "get someone to do it in the USA"... I considered this, but the reply to the commie questions is requested to be written, and thus, I think the consulate is looking for a handwritten statement from the beneficiary that is attached to the "Notarized English Translation" exactly as they ask for. If the M.I.L. is not IN the USA, then nobody can legally "notarize" her signature on the original document. This GuangZhou gal promised to staple the original to the translation as well as the "Certified Translator" statement as a cover page and then Crimp all the documents together with her business seal. That is what *I* would expect if *I* was asking someone for a written, notarized, translated statement.

 

Now we must hope it all goes as planned and then mail the docs into the consulate and wait the million or so years for the waiver process to complete.

 

TTYAL

 

 

This was the closest I could find, but it still reads in the future tense, and "Maybe".

 

I'm glad you were able to get it taken care of - I also hope that anyone else who finds themselves in the same position realizes that certified translations can also be done in the US.

[pkfops]

Maybe you should talk to a Mod.

 

Have the thread cut down to the Meat and Potatos and help someone else by getting it pinned.

[Jaseball]

Another thing that angers me is in situations such as this one, couldn't they send out something with P3 that says if you are or were a member of X party or a 'totalitarian,' group then you need to provide Y for an overcome BEFORE the interview?

 

I mean, there is a chance that the question never comes up at all, even if the applicant is still a member and you get the visa and run.

 

The larger chance is your fiancee will get the question, answer honestly and be stuck in a 6 month long+ limbo yet again.

 

I know us waiting 3 months or 2+ years makes no difference to their own lives or jobs, but the entire system and process pisses me off.

[rogerwink]

We MAYBE have found an indepedent translator in GuangZhou who will do the "against CCP" translation.

 

We spent all night calling hotels to get phone numbers of translation services and asking them for other contacts when they all said "NOT GONNA DO IT". We had softened the response down as far as we dared and still, no-one would touch it. But finally, someone has agreed to do it. In fact she allowed us to "harden" it back up a bit.

 

If all goes well in GuangZhou, I will post her name and number for others to use when they get into this nasty pickle also.

 

In reply to "get someone to do it in the USA"... I considered this, but the reply to the commie questions is requested to be written, and thus, I think the consulate is looking for a handwritten statement from the beneficiary that is attached to the "Notarized English Translation" exactly as they ask for. If the M.I.L. is not IN the USA, then nobody can legally "notarize" her signature on the original document. This GuangZhou gal promised to staple the original to the translation as well as the "Certified Translator" statement as a cover page and then Crimp all the documents together with her business seal. That is what *I* would expect if *I* was asking someone for a written, notarized, translated statement.

 

Now we must hope it all goes as planned and then mail the docs into the consulate and wait the million or so years for the waiver process to complete.

 

TTYAL

 

 

This was the closest I could find, but it still reads in the future tense, and "Maybe".

 

I'm glad you were able to get it taken care of - I also hope that anyone else who finds themselves in the same position realizes that certified translations can also be done in the US.

 

You got me.

.

.

...I hope people in this same position understand that Certified and Notarized DO NOT mean the same thing!

 

Certified is dead easy! It can be obtained by someone OTHER than the person the document refers to (hence, Certified Translations CAN be done in the USA without the person being there).

 

There are several places where GUZ asks for "Certified documents and/or translations". From Packet#3 instructions: Certified Copy of Birth Certificate, Certified Copy of Court Records, Certified Copy of Military Record, Certified Copy of Marriage Certificate and Finally, Certified English Translations of all documents not in English.

 

Notarized is special, and quite different. Its purpose is to specifically have a third party (a Notary) witness that a person physically standing in front of them, has applied their signature onto a document. The Notary checks the ID of that person, and after witnessing the signature, they apply their Notary Stamp to the document which states that "this person came before me on this date and signed this document" and they then put their signature to it as well. You cannot get your signature Notarized if you are not physically standing in front of the Notary.

 

The Communist Overcome Instructions specify "All Chinese documents must have Notarized English Translation"... I TOO thought that GUZ made a mistake and MEANT "Certified English Translations"!!! As I stated earlier, I contacted GUZ... they repeated the exact, same, fricking sentence again in their e-mail reply.... "..All Chinese documents must have Notarized English Translation". (as if somehow by exactly repeating a sentence one can gain cosmic understanding of the innner workings of GUZ and decifer the meaning of it all!)

 

When GUZ asks for APPLES and you decide to give them DURIAN, then all I can say is... Good luck with that!

 

 

Until several people say that they ACTUALLY submitted ONLY Certified English Translations in response to the Commie Overcome Questions AND eventually got their Visas.... I think it would be a disservice to suggest to people who get into this predicament to go ahead and submit "Certified" translations and take their chances.

 

I personally think you get better Odds in LasVegas than you get when dealing with GUZ!

 

I WISH they would stop asking the Commie question.

I WISH they would stop asking it randomly.

I WISH they would stop randomly being SADISTS! (like in MamaBear's case).

I WISH they would change the Commie Overcome instructions to say only "Certified".

.

.

I WISH my MIL had just said "NO"!

[Randy W]

We MAYBE have found an indepedent translator in GuangZhou who will do the "against CCP" translation.

 

We spent all night calling hotels to get phone numbers of translation services and asking them for other contacts when they all said "NOT GONNA DO IT". We had softened the response down as far as we dared and still, no-one would touch it. But finally, someone has agreed to do it. In fact she allowed us to "harden" it back up a bit.

 

If all goes well in GuangZhou, I will post her name and number for others to use when they get into this nasty pickle also.

 

In reply to "get someone to do it in the USA"... I considered this, but the reply to the commie questions is requested to be written, and thus, I think the consulate is looking for a handwritten statement from the beneficiary that is attached to the "Notarized English Translation" exactly as they ask for. If the M.I.L. is not IN the USA, then nobody can legally "notarize" her signature on the original document. This GuangZhou gal promised to staple the original to the translation as well as the "Certified Translator" statement as a cover page and then Crimp all the documents together with her business seal. That is what *I* would expect if *I* was asking someone for a written, notarized, translated statement.

 

Now we must hope it all goes as planned and then mail the docs into the consulate and wait the million or so years for the waiver process to complete.

 

TTYAL

 

 

This was the closest I could find, but it still reads in the future tense, and "Maybe".

 

I'm glad you were able to get it taken care of - I also hope that anyone else who finds themselves in the same position realizes that certified translations can also be done in the US.

 

You got me.

.

.

...I hope people in this same position understand that Certified and Notarized DO NOT mean the same thing!

 

Certified is dead easy! It can be obtained by someone OTHER than the person the document refers to (hence, Certified Translations CAN be done in the USA without the person being there).

 

There are several places where GUZ asks for "Certified documents and/or translations". From Packet#3 instructions: Certified Copy of Birth Certificate, Certified Copy of Court Records, Certified Copy of Military Record, Certified Copy of Marriage Certificate and Finally, Certified English Translations of all documents not in English.

 

Notarized is special, and quite different. Its purpose is to specifically have a third party (a Notary) witness that a person physically standing in front of them, has applied their signature onto a document. The Notary checks the ID of that person, and after witnessing the signature, they apply their Notary Stamp to the document which states that "this person came before me on this date and signed this document" and they then put their signature to it as well. You cannot get your signature Notarized if you are not physically standing in front of the Notary.

 

The Communist Overcome Instructions specify "All Chinese documents must have Notarized English Translation"... I TOO thought that GUZ made a mistake and MEANT "Certified English Translations"!!! As I stated earlier, I contacted GUZ... they repeated the exact, same, fricking sentence again in their e-mail reply.... "..All Chinese documents must have Notarized English Translation". (as if somehow by exactly repeating a sentence one can gain cosmic understanding of the innner workings of GUZ and decifer the meaning of it all!)

 

When GUZ asks for APPLES and you decide to give them DURIAN, then all I can say is... Good luck with that!

 

 

Until several people say that they ACTUALLY submitted ONLY Certified English Translations in response to the Commie Overcome Questions AND eventually got their Visas.... I think it would be a disservice to suggest to people who get into this predicament to go ahead and submit "Certified" translations and take their chances.

 

I personally think you get better Odds in LasVegas than you get when dealing with GUZ!

 

I WISH they would stop asking the Commie question.

I WISH they would stop asking it randomly.

I WISH they would stop randomly being SADISTS! (like in MamaBear's case).

I WISH they would change the Commie Overcome instructions to say only "Certified".

.

.

I WISH my MIL had just said "NO"!

 

There are plenty of both notaries and translators in the US.