SirLancelot Posted November 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 We don't have that excuse. As you said, we can do better and we should. I'm with you on that 100% Dave. I'm a tree hugger and damn proud of it. Link to comment
Guest ShaQuaNew Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 I'm caught between Dave's points and SQN's points. I certainly don't like to bash on China needlessly, but I certainly will criticize China when I think it deserves criticism--and there are plenty of times and situations where I feel China needs a lot of criticism: free speech and free press are two big criticisms I have. I'm also very concerned with the environment both in the US and China--hell, all around the world. The reason I'm caught between what Dave and Jesse says is because I have the same lofty goals and ideals that Dave has, but given my economics background, I also understand why practical reality doesn't work out as well as Dave's (or my) ideals. I am an outed liberal Republican. So at the root, I want less government taxation, but I am nevertheless very concerned about the environment. In that arena, I would like to see more, rather than less, regulations to force unwilling and laggard businesses--especially big business--to cooperate with helping to restore the environment to a more pristine state. Yes, it's important to see that there is a difference between bashing China, and debating its current direction. With China having what is probably the fastest growing and changing culture and economy in the world, it's no wonder that there is so much focus toward them in the news and world today. The people of China are relishing in their growth today. There is prosperity and hope. On the flip side there are enormous challenges to maintain control of what is a seemingly out-of-control use of resources and damage to the environment. Lance, as you state, imposing controls, restrictions, and regulations all come at a cost. Right now, most of those in government see growth as a priority. That would disturb anyone with a mind to protect the environment, which is just about everyone, right or left. There is a cost however to protect and provide for the billions that comprise China's population. It will never be pleasing to some to see China clean up after the fact, but that is precisely what almost every country in the world has done when it grows. China is just doing it on a scale never before seen. Link to comment
rogerluli Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 I'm caught between Dave's points and SQN's points. I certainly don't like to bash on China needlessly, but I certainly will criticize China when I think it deserves criticism--and there are plenty of times and situations where I feel China needs a lot of criticism: free speech and free press are two big criticisms I have. I'm also very concerned with the environment both in the US and China--hell, all around the world. The reason I'm caught between what Dave and Jesse says is because I have the same lofty goals and ideals that Dave has, but given my economics background, I also understand why practical reality doesn't work out as well as Dave's (or my) ideals. I am an outed liberal Republican. So at the root, I want less government taxation, but I am nevertheless very concerned about the environment. In that arena, I would like to see more, rather than less, regulations to force unwilling and laggard businesses--especially big business--to cooperate with helping to restore the environment to a more pristine state. Yes, it's important to see that there is a difference between bashing China, and debating its current direction. With China having what is probably the fastest growing and changing culture and economy in the world, it's no wonder that there is so much focus toward them in the news and world today. The people of China are relishing in their growth today. There is prosperity and hope. On the flip side there are enormous challenges to maintain control of what is a seemingly out-of-control use of resources and damage to the environment. Lance, as you state, imposing controls, restrictions, and regulations all come at a cost. Right now, most of those in government see growth as a priority. That would disturb anyone with a mind to protect the environment, which is just about everyone, right or left. There is a cost however to protect and provide for the billions that comprise China's population. It will never be pleasing to some to see China clean up after the fact, but that is precisely what almost every country in the world has done when it grows. China is just doing it on a scale never before seen. Jesse I am not one to mince words so I will come right out and declare that I find your post deeply disturbing because... I CAN FIND NOTHING TO DISAGREE WITH... Link to comment
Guest ShaQuaNew Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 Jesse I am not one to mince words so I will come right out and declare that I find your post deeply disturbing because... I CAN FIND NOTHING TO DISAGREE WITH... Link to comment
rogerluli Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 Jesse I am not one to mince words so I will come right out and declare that I find your post deeply disturbing because... I CAN FIND NOTHING TO DISAGREE WITH... I HOPE YOU DON'T MEAN... Link to comment
Guest ShaQuaNew Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 I HOPE YOU DON'T MEAN... No, nothing quite that formal; more like.... Hey, I guess we don't always disagree. Link to comment
Don Posted November 9, 2007 Report Share Posted November 9, 2007 I HOPE YOU DON'T MEAN... No, nothing quite that formal; more like.... Hey, I guess we don't always disagree. Are these the animated silhouettes Toplaw was telling us about? Link to comment
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