A Question of Citizenship

[SirLancelot]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

From what I understand of her perspective, it's just that she's Chinese, she never planned on not being Chinese. She fell in love with an American, not with America. The US is just one place to live. She'd follow me to Iraq or Afghanistan or Iceland if that's where I had to go.

 

The main negative is just that every time we'd go back to China, it would double our visa application costs, and it would feel strange to her to pay for permission to go back to her own country, where all her friends, family, history, and life are (except for her beloved Lao Gong).

 

I was actually wondering about things more along practical lines like health care and gov't. services etc. Would someone still have the same rights/access if they become an ex-Chinese citizen?

 

One of the most important aspect of maintaining the Chinese citizenship would be for the purpose of setting up a business in China. If you're already near retirement age, then it may not matter, but for a younger couple who may want to start a business in China, then it's critical they think about maintaining Chinese citizenship for the SO. It's imminently harder to start a business as a USC in China, then it is for a Chinese citizen. That may change in the future, but as of now, it still will cost you a huge chuck of money to start up any kind of business which can actually generate income (not just a REP office) in China. Not so for the Chinese citizen.

 

I still have not decide whether my SO should seek USC or not. The business possibilities in Shanghai are endless. In the next three years, we'll see how Chinese law is changing.

 

BTW, I do NOT believe a foreigner can purchase residential property in China anymore--at least not in Shanghai. They instituted that policy in 2006. If your spouse is a Chinese citizen, then she can and your name could probably be added, but as a single USC trying to purchase residential property in Shanghai, it's not possible via legitimate methods. I'm sure there is a black market where you can go through to secure residential property, but it's not legit.

[IllinoisDave]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

From what I understand of her perspective, it's just that she's Chinese, she never planned on not being Chinese. She fell in love with an American, not with America. The US is just one place to live. She'd follow me to Iraq or Afghanistan or Iceland if that's where I had to go.

 

The main negative is just that every time we'd go back to China, it would double our visa application costs, and it would feel strange to her to pay for permission to go back to her own country, where all her friends, family, history, and life are (except for her beloved Lao Gong).

 

I was actually wondering about things more along practical lines like health care and gov't. services etc. Would someone still have the same rights/access if they become an ex-Chinese citizen?

 

One of the most important aspect of maintaining the Chinese citizenship would be for the purpose of setting up a business in China. If you're already near retirement age, then it may not matter, but for a younger couple who may want to start a business in China, then it's critical they think about maintaining Chinese citizenship for the SO. It's imminently harder to start a business as a USC in China, then it is for a Chinese citizen. That may change in the future, but as of now, it still will cost you a huge chuck of money to start up any kind of business which can actually generate income (not just a REP office) in China. Not so for the Chinese citizen.

 

I still have not decide whether my SO should seek USC or not. The business possibilities in Shanghai are endless. In the next three years, we'll see how Chinese law is changing.

 

BTW, I do NOT believe a foreigner can purchase residential property in China anymore--at least not in Shanghai. They instituted that policy in 2006. If your spouse is a Chinese citizen, then she can and your name could probably be added, but as a single USC trying to purchase residential property in Shanghai, it's not possible via legitimate methods. I'm sure there is a black market where you can go through to secure residential property, but it's not legit.

 

Thanks Lance,

 

That's the kind of info I was looking for. We're pretty far off retirement age and I was just wondering about keeping our options open in case we decide to make the move. Not planned right now, but you never know what could happen. And since she's from Shanghai, you never know when an opportunity that we couldn't pass up may come along

 

This stuff is good to know.

[warpedbored]

Seems to me I vaguely remember something about China not recognizing foreign citizenship. That once Chinese always Chinese. I do know of naturalized citizens traveling to China on an American passport and visa. But once in China as long as the national ID card is still valid I doubt they would have any problems.

[tywy_99]

Also, China doesn't recognize dual citizenship.

Furthermore, citizenship and an U.S. passport offers protection under United States sovereignty laws whereas greencards are limited.

[A Mafan]

Also, China doesn't recognize dual citizenship.

Furthermore, citizenship and an U.S. passport offers protection under United States sovereignty laws whereas greencards are limited.

Yep, that was covered in the 1st post, #3.

Still, the US often does go to bat for Green Card holders. Check out (Google) the story of Gao Zhan. She sure played the US govt for a fool!

[hlin]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

From what I understand of her perspective, it's just that she's Chinese, she never planned on not being Chinese. She fell in love with an American, not with America. The US is just one place to live. She'd follow me to Iraq or Afghanistan or Iceland if that's where I had to go.

 

The main negative is just that every time we'd go back to China, it would double our visa application costs, and it would feel strange to her to pay for permission to go back to her own country, where all her friends, family, history, and life are (except for her beloved Lao Gong).

 

I was actually wondering about things more along practical lines like health care and gov't. services etc. Would someone still have the same rights/access if they become an ex-Chinese citizen?

 

One of the most important aspect of maintaining the Chinese citizenship would be for the purpose of setting up a business in China. If you're already near retirement age, then it may not matter, but for a younger couple who may want to start a business in China, then it's critical they think about maintaining Chinese citizenship for the SO. It's imminently harder to start a business as a USC in China, then it is for a Chinese citizen. That may change in the future, but as of now, it still will cost you a huge chuck of money to start up any kind of business which can actually generate income (not just a REP office) in China. Not so for the Chinese citizen.

 

I still have not decide whether my SO should seek USC or not. The business possibilities in Shanghai are endless. In the next three years, we'll see how Chinese law is changing.

 

BTW, I do NOT believe a foreigner can purchase residential property in China anymore--at least not in Shanghai. They instituted that policy in 2006. If your spouse is a Chinese citizen, then she can and your name could probably be added, but as a single USC trying to purchase residential property in Shanghai, it's not possible via legitimate methods. I'm sure there is a black market where you can go through to secure residential property, but it's not legit.

 

My wife tells me that you can purchase a residential property in Shanghai if you have resided there for at least 1 year (probably need to provide some sort of proof). I don't know the details, but that's what I'm told. Maybe someone with more official details can comment.

[david_dawei]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

From what I understand of her perspective, it's just that she's Chinese, she never planned on not being Chinese. She fell in love with an American, not with America. The US is just one place to live. She'd follow me to Iraq or Afghanistan or Iceland if that's where I had to go.

 

The main negative is just that every time we'd go back to China, it would double our visa application costs, and it would feel strange to her to pay for permission to go back to her own country, where all her friends, family, history, and life are (except for her beloved Lao Gong).

This is the exact sentiment of my wife... she asked me recently, almost rhetorically, why she should be a USC...

 

For her situation and sentiment, I can only come up with one reason so far: ease of international travel (other than china).

[mercator]

So you have mama or baba buy the property in China.

 

if we wanted property in China, we'd probably just have mom or her older sibling buy the property for us. Her family is old school, so there is close to zero risk of family dispute causing a problem with that. Not like our litigious country.

 

We're nowhere near that point though, with 30 years (and counting, if you believe in the SSA (I don't)) until retirement. In 30 years I won't be able to afford to live in China, unless its someplace like wulumuqi/urumqi...

[Stone]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

 

A USC travelling to China needs a China visa. If the USC needs to extend his/her stay in China, there is going to be A LOT OF HEADACHE extending Chinese visa, from my pesonal experience.

[Joanne]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

From what I understand of her perspective, it's just that she's Chinese, she never planned on not being Chinese. She fell in love with an American, not with America. The US is just one place to live. She'd follow me to Iraq or Afghanistan or Iceland if that's where I had to go.

 

The main negative is just that every time we'd go back to China, it would double our visa application costs, and it would feel strange to her to pay for permission to go back to her own country, where all her friends, family, history, and life are (except for her beloved Lao Gong).

 

This is how I feel.

[rogerluli]

Just curious.

What would the negatives be about losing her Chinese citizenship? Especially since you plan to spend alot of time there. I ask because you never know what the future holds and I may be in the same boat one day.

 

A USC travelling to China needs a China visa. If the USC needs to extend his/her stay in China, there is going to be A LOT OF HEADACHE extending Chinese visa, from my pesonal experience.

 

I have talked to 2 foreigners who live permanently in China. Both conveniently in Zhuhai. Once a year they walk across the border to Macau, have lunch, pick up a new 1 year, multi-entry visa for China, and walk back... You can do the same thing in Hong Kong or any other bordering country you may live near. Does this sound like a big deal???

[Stone]

 

I have talked to 2 foreigners who live permanently in China. Both conveniently in Zhuhai. Once a year they walk across the border to Macau, have lunch, pick up a new 1 year, multi-entry visa for China, and walk back... You can do the same thing in Hong Kong or any other bordering country you may live near. Does this sound like a big deal???

 

That is true if you live near HK or Macau. Remember (1) multi-entry visa costs a lot more than a single entry visa; (2) If you want to get your China visa the same day, you have to pay additional fees for expedited service. If you live very close to the border, the total costs for the multiple entry one-year visa within the same day plus the cost of transportion ("walking") could be around $500/year. If you live further inland, you will have to fly to HK or Macau and fly back the same day or the next day, and will probably cost you a $1000/year just for the visa. That is not a problem if you are actively working and making money. But if you are retired with limited income, then it is a different story.

 

The headache that I encounted in China was when I was trying to renew my work visa ("Z" visa) and changed from one job to another. Renewing a Z visa should be a lot cheaper than getting another multi-entry one-year L visa through the above route. But I encounted red tape and real headache.

[rogerluli]

 

I have talked to 2 foreigners who live permanently in China. Both conveniently in Zhuhai. Once a year they walk across the border to Macau, have lunch, pick up a new 1 year, multi-entry visa for China, and walk back... You can do the same thing in Hong Kong or any other bordering country you may live near. Does this sound like a big deal???

 

That is true if you live near HK or Macau. Remember (1) multi-entry visa costs a lot more than a single entry visa; (2) If you want to get your China visa the same day, you have to pay additional fees for expedited service. If you live very close to the border, the total costs for the multiple entry one-year visa within the same day plus the cost of transportion ("walking") could be around $500/year. If you live further inland, you will have to fly to HK or Macau and fly back the same day or the next day, and will probably cost you a $1000/year just for the visa. That is not a problem if you are actively working and making money. But if you are retired with limited income, then it is a different story.

 

The headache that I encounted in China was when I was trying to renew my work visa ("Z" visa) and changed from one job to another. Renewing a Z visa should be a lot cheaper than getting another multi-entry one-year L visa through the above route. But I encounted red tape and real headache.

 

$1000/year... I don't think so but even if that is close it's still much cheaper than flying to the US once round trip and it's less than 1/4th of what I currently pay in property taxes here... As one of our members who is planning to spend 4 months every 2 years to keep his wife's green card active said...the cost of living in the US for 4 months will be the same as living in China for the other 20 months in that 2 year period... AND in China they will be living "higher on the hog" as it were...

[tywy_99]

Here's a good reason why one should obtain citizenship;

With citizenship, my wife will only need to go 3 miles to the county clerk's office to apply for a 10 year US passport instead of going 300 miles to the nation's capital to apply for a 5 year Chinese passport!!!

 

Is that good enough reason!?

[dnoblett]

Here's a good reason why one should obtain citizenship;

With citizenship, my wife will only need to go 3 miles to the county clerk's office to apply for a 10 year US passport instead of going 300 miles to the nation's capital to apply for a 5 year Chinese passport!!!

 

Is that good enough reason!?

That is exactly the same reason that a co-worker's husband naturalized they are from Greece, She is US Citizen, and every year or so they had to go to NYC to get his Greek Passport renewed in order to travel to Greece to visit family. Big Pain in the Ash..