Pink Slip then Blue question

[warpedbored]

Warpedbored:

 

Okay, think about this: GUZ processes god only knows how many cases. All of us here at CFL work overtime to make sure all boxes are checked, t's are crossed and i's are dotted. Do you know how many other app's aren't? Do you know how many thousands of apps these guys look at? The people who do most of the processing simply look for paper titled "x", then check the appropriate box and pass the pile on to the next person. I can only guess at how many people touch each of our app's, then pass it on. Each person has no idea who we are and very, very, very seldom look at corroborating documentation.

The actual VO with authority to pass or fail very likely gets about 5 minutes of time with your case AFTER many, many others have simply checked boxes and passed it on. The likelihood of clerical error OR other is exponentially increased through all this.

As I have said a few times, unless someone has lied, or contadicted themselves, or someone else has sent in "hate mail" about you, your case--if properly filed, checked and marked--will eventually be passed. This can be referred to these matters as containing "transparency" in the process. If I were to tell you at great length of my experiences you would understand I have been victim to the error of others and after much consideration I firmly and strongly believe the few actually containing authority in GUZ will come to your defense. I will quote someone of authority in GUZ whom I thanked after he helped me resolve an issue I had. He could have easily not returned my phone call, but he did and he helped me. He said: "Don't thank me, I am simply doing my job. A U.S. Citizen asked me for my help. I would not be here if it was not for this reason."

When I was frantic and running around the consulate emailing people and calling Maura Harty's office and having meetings with various people in GUZ, the GUZ GSO Staff all had one common thread--they took time to listen to me and do what they had authority to do. Every single person at GUZ treated me with compassion. The chinese national who did the actual interview with my wife was not cordial and could have cared less about us, but the GSO people all were very kind and compassionate.

I firmly believe that if Phil is true and his SO is true, then this is a small deal and he will soon get his visa--probably quicker than if GUZ had waited for the security clearance to clear THEN scheduled the interview.

235871[/snapback]

I'm still not buying it. I agree that the VO may not know whether or not all the security checks are done by the time the petition gets to him but he is supposed to be the final stop. All final go overs for security checks should have done before the VO sees it. If nothing else for national security reasons. It would be too easy for it to slip through the cracks other wise. It is cruel and unreasonable no matter what excuse you make for a screwed up system that is way more complicated than it should be. I am not VO bashing but someone in this case made a grievous error by allowing the case to get to interview before it was finished. It isn't like they didn't have enough time for gods sake. It took 18 months to get to interview in the first place.

[gman2531]

To all at CFL:

 

Thanks for the comments and insights.  It'll be OK.  Yun took it better than I did...she was actually smiling and saying it is only a short wait.  Angela & Mr. Xie took us out to their favorite restaurant for dinner and tried to cheer us up - like BLUTO after the Betas had been expelled after double secret probation by Dean Werner  ( that's from Animal House for all you youngsters).

 

Our case has had some strange twists...some self inflicted; however with the time frames extending, maybe something was out of sync or just overlooked.

 

I'm not going to start beating down doors or blasting eMails out to everyone.  I have returned to the states and hope and pray that this all works out in a timely fashion.  Yun is not a member of the CCP; she knows what side I part my graying hair on...etc.  We are two bone fide people, in love, and lacking so much as a parking ticket....there are no skeletons in the closet. ..well I did run an unattended toll booth because I did't have any quarters and paid the $42 fine...LOL

 

It ain't right, but maybe the whole process is a little out of whack.  Maybe the poor folks that labor under all the paperwork and long lines of people screaming at them, that they did not create, are trying to do the best that they can with a system that is almost impossible.  If things were clicking on all cylinders, there wouldn't be 12 million folks here now without all the right paperwork.

 

I'll keep you all posted.  There is no TPC; no boogeymen....maybe a quick "check the box" on Yun or her son ( which is what I suspect) and we are back on track.

 

That which you overcome only makes you stronger...our love for each other is unquestionable...

 

Phil

235896[/snapback]

Phil, Even though it may be frustrating, I think that you are taking a very mature approach to your situation. I agree with you and some of the others that the system has flaws and that we as humans certainly have flaws which will lead to unfortunate situations such as yours. I don't think GUZ and the FEDS are out to "get" us. I can't imagine all the paperwork that gets passed through this system. Good Luck!

[rogerinca]

To all at CFL:

 

Thanks for the comments and insights.  It'll be OK.  Yun took it better than I did...she was actually smiling and saying it is only a short wait.  Angela & Mr. Xie took us out to their favorite restaurant for dinner and tried to cheer us up - like BLUTO after the Betas had been expelled after double secret probation by Dean Werner  ( that's from Animal House for all you youngsters).

 

Our case has had some strange twists...some self inflicted; however with the time frames extending, maybe something was out of sync or just overlooked.

 

I'm not going to start beating down doors or blasting eMails out to everyone.  I have returned to the states and hope and pray that this all works out in a timely fashion.  Yun is not a member of the CCP; she knows what side I part my graying hair on...etc.  We are two bone fide people, in love, and lacking so much as a parking ticket....there are no skeletons in the closet. ..well I did run an unattended toll booth because I did't have any quarters and paid the $42 fine...LOL

 

It ain't right, but maybe the whole process is a little out of whack.  Maybe the poor folks that labor under all the paperwork and long lines of people screaming at them, that they did not create, are trying to do the best that they can with a system that is almost impossible.  If things were clicking on all cylinders, there wouldn't be 12 million folks here now without all the right paperwork.

 

I'll keep you all posted.  There is no TPC; no boogeymen....maybe a quick "check the box" on Yun or her son ( which is what I suspect) and we are back on track.

 

That which you overcome only makes you stronger...our love for each other is unquestionable...

 

Phil

235896[/snapback]

Phil, Even though it may be frustrating, I think that you are taking a very mature approach to your situation. I agree with you and some of the others that the system has flaws and that we as humans certainly have flaws which will lead to unfortunate situations such as yours. I don't think GUZ and the FEDS are out to "get" us. I can't imagine all the paperwork that gets passed through this system. Good Luck!

235949[/snapback]

To Phil, having read all of your situation the past three days, and like so many others here, my heart goes out to you and your Yun !! I understand and also share the strong emotional need/urge to express shock and anger, based on severe frustration with a very bureaucratic process, coupled with a massive dose of disappointment !!! You are surely entitled to your human feelings, given what has happened !! While I know that the return to LAX yesterday on flight CS-327 was not under the desired circumstances; I am hopeful that your feelings of frustration will soon turn to those of JOY, in a very short time !!!

 

And to you Rob, thank you for your personal insight and information !! One must always be able to step back, take a breath, reassess, and then be able to move forward.

 

Next, having heard of and read so many mixed reviews, it is indeed refreshing to learn, from at least one member, that the staff at GUZ can be responsive and capable of compassion. Having just recently retired after over 33 years in government (law enforcement manager) here in California, I can truly understand this equation from all sides; however, ‘public servants’ must subscribe to the tenant that they exist to deliver high quality service to the public, and not fall into the trap of becoming just another bureaucrat....no matter what the workload. Moreover, it is the duty and responsibility of the individual government agency to continually assess local unit workload and staffing, as well as train its managers, supervisors, and subordinate employees in the concepts of ‘high-performance’ service delivery to its client base, namely the public they serve !! These concepts apply at all levels of government, local, state and federal !!! The management concept/strategy of employees being able to think ‘outside the box‘, must be continually trained, reviewed and reinforced, coupled with appropriate staffing level support from their upper management team.

 

Further, as part of my education derived from this forum, I was surprised to learn from Rob’s comments, that there are “Chinese nationals“, working in such an essential capacity/function at the Consulate !!?? I had always assumed that only American citizens were authorized to conduct these critical interviews; e.g., Chinese Americans or other American citizens who are conversant in Chinese ???

 

Accordingly, I think that maybe the GUZ should create a position (or positions) that are filled by US citizens, which functions specifically in a [liaison] capacity to be available to assist American citizens and/or their SO’s in any situation like, or similar to this, so as to avoid leaving any citizen with that feeling of twisting-in the-wind and helplessness !!?? An individual who would have access to the key decision makers/staff in GZ, and who could be available on-site and/or by phone to attempt to answer questions, provide simple directions for those who are confused and or intimidated, cut through local red-tape, help resolve both the large and small issues that seem to slip through the preverbal crack, and provide insight and a human face/ dimension to any situation encountered there??

 

Great forum and great work/support/thoughts here from all members !!!!

 

Roger and Hongxia, California/Guangzhou

[Guest pushbrk]

Warpedbored:

 

Okay, think about this: GUZ processes god only knows how many cases. All of us here at CFL work overtime to make sure all boxes are checked, t's are crossed and i's are dotted. Do you know how many other app's aren't? Do you know how many thousands of apps these guys look at? The people who do most of the processing simply look for paper titled "x", then check the appropriate box and pass the pile on to the next person. I can only guess at how many people touch each of our app's, then pass it on. Each person has no idea who we are and very, very, very seldom look at corroborating documentation.

The actual VO with authority to pass or fail very likely gets about 5 minutes of time with your case AFTER many, many others have simply checked boxes and passed it on. The likelihood of clerical error OR other is exponentially increased through all this.

As I have said a few times, unless someone has lied, or contadicted themselves, or someone else has sent in "hate mail" about you, your case--if properly filed, checked and marked--will eventually be passed. This can be referred to these matters as containing "transparency" in the process. If I were to tell you at great length of my experiences you would understand I have been victim to the error of others and after much consideration I firmly and strongly believe the few actually containing authority in GUZ will come to your defense. I will quote someone of authority in GUZ whom I thanked after he helped me resolve an issue I had. He could have easily not returned my phone call, but he did and he helped me. He said: "Don't thank me, I am simply doing my job. A U.S. Citizen asked me for my help. I would not be here if it was not for this reason."

When I was frantic and running around the consulate emailing people and calling Maura Harty's office and having meetings with various people in GUZ, the GUZ GSO Staff all had one common thread--they took time to listen to me and do what they had authority to do. Every single person at GUZ treated me with compassion. The chinese national who did the actual interview with my wife was not cordial and could have cared less about us, but the GSO people all were very kind and compassionate.

I firmly believe that if Phil is true and his SO is true, then this is a small deal and he will soon get his visa--probably quicker than if GUZ had waited for the security clearance to clear THEN scheduled the interview.

235871[/snapback]

I'm still not buying it. I agree that the VO may not know whether or not all the security checks are done by the time the petition gets to him but he is supposed to be the final stop. All final go overs for security checks should have done before the VO sees it. If nothing else for national security reasons. It would be too easy for it to slip through the cracks other wise. It is cruel and unreasonable no matter what excuse you make for a screwed up system that is way more complicated than it should be. I am not VO bashing but someone in this case made a grievous error by allowing the case to get to interview before it was finished. It isn't like they didn't have enough time for gods sake. It took 18 months to get to interview in the first place.

235944[/snapback]

There are at least two separate general scenarios possible in this kind of circumstance.

 

1. A needed security check was overlooked but discovered at the late moment before actually issuing the visa.

 

2. Something came up at the interview that prompted the need for an "additional" security check.

 

I would expect number 2. to result in a blue slip at interview but perhaps rarely the issue will be caught after the interview.

 

Number 1. is simply an error. Mistakes do happen, many with cruel consequences.

[david_dawei]

There are at least two separate general scenarios possible in this kind of circumstance. 

 

1.  A needed security check was overlooked but discovered at the late moment before actually issuing the visa. 

 

2.  Something came up at the interview that prompted the need for an "additional" security check.

 

I would expect number 2. to result in a blue slip at interview but perhaps rarely the issue will be caught after the interview.

 

Number 1. is simply an error.  Mistakes do happen, many with cruel consequences.

235964[/snapback]

3. Something comes up after the interview.

[Randy W]

There are at least two separate general scenarios possible in this kind of circumstance. 

 

1.  A needed security check was overlooked but discovered at the late moment before actually issuing the visa. 

 

2.  Something came up at the interview that prompted the need for an "additional" security check.

 

I would expect number 2. to result in a blue slip at interview but perhaps rarely the issue will be caught after the interview.

 

Number 1. is simply an error.  Mistakes do happen, many with cruel consequences.

235964[/snapback]

 

 

It would seem to me that these "errors" are almost inevitable under the scenario given us by USCONGUZ - that the file is not seen by the VO until immediately before the interview.

 

How can we call them "errors" when the whole process can come together at (or even after) the last minute like that?

[Guest pushbrk]

There are at least two separate general scenarios possible in this kind of circumstance. 

 

1.  A needed security check was overlooked but discovered at the late moment before actually issuing the visa. 

 

2.  Something came up at the interview that prompted the need for an "additional" security check.

 

I would expect number 2. to result in a blue slip at interview but perhaps rarely the issue will be caught after the interview.

 

Number 1. is simply an error.  Mistakes do happen, many with cruel consequences.

235964[/snapback]

 

 

It would seem to me that these "errors" are almost inevitable under the scenario given us by USCONGUZ - that the file is not seen by the VO until immediately before the interview.

 

How can we call them "errors" when the whole process can come together at (or even after) the last minute like that?

235994[/snapback]

I think it is important to remember that the VO that conducts the interview is only one person in a long line of people responsible for evaluating the case and related documents. As such it is not the VO who overlooked any part of the preceding process. The VO assumes as the petitioner and applicant do, that others before them have done their job properly. Sometimes those necessary assumptions turn out to be wrong.

[david_dawei]

I agree with randy that calling a last minute change in the visa issuance as an 'errors' is just a convenience accusation from our point of view. This process unfolds in a very methodical path, however much we disagree with so called "twists and turns".

 

And mike is right as well to state that the VO is the final "hand off"; the baton has been passed along over and over. SO I agree: The VO is not the one to overlook any snafu or to be responsible for any 'normal' (from GUZ point of view) processing.

 

I don't think the VO operates on assumptions; I suspect they operate on expected procedures by those before themselves. Therefore, the ENTIRE PROCESS, from petition to visa issuance (or final denial) is one continuous process to them. I would encourage everyone to take a point of view that is the same; that the entire process is one process, with some twists and turns (if you want to think of it that way)...

 

I'm sure that some mistakes happen... on both sides; by us and by them. I would suspect that more are made by our side than theirs.