Doctors, Hospitals & Medical Costs

[yuehan123]

Beginning Tuesday and ending the following Wednesday afternoon we saw 16 different doctors in three hospitals. This included 5 hours of emg/ncv testing.

 

One emg/ncv doctor came in at 8:00 pm on Friday on her day off and again at 8:00 am the next morning. At one point there were 6 doctors and two residents, including the Directors of Orthopedics and Neurophysiology and the head of the Orthopedics Medical Teaching School in a conference meeting lasting from 4:00 pm until 6:00 pm. All for less than 1,000 rmb.

 

I was impressed. Oh, the care, treatment and bed-side manner were all good also. Well, one doctor was less than stellar. But, heck, 15 of 16 isn't bad.

[tonado]

Only if the condition is unique (a new disease).

[obxtrainman]

Only if the condition is unique (a new disease).

221412[/snapback]

What??? How did you come to that conclusion??? That's a mighty big conclusion to come from with the information the original post had in it

[sylinchinastill]

The medical care in the states is horrible. I have heard so much about what a great country America is with our great health-care system and etc. but I'm learning that this is just hooey. When we were in China we could go see a doctor at any time- even at night. Here you have to plan to be sick one month in advance. Plus- my husband had two doctor's visits last year and the insurance wouldn't the first one. Even after an appeal. I'm still waiting on the second one. Then- my husband had to go to the emergency room and they didn't take any information on us except for his social and his name- four months later, after I didn't receive any bills- I found out that instead of sending it to our insurance they sent the bill to a collections agency (I only found that out by checking his credit). Now my husband's credit is messed up- and we are trying to get the insurance to cover it- but even if they do it will be forever before his credit is pretty like it used to be. The longer I am in the US the more I want to go back to China.

[tonado]

Only if the condition is unique (a new disease).

221412[/snapback]

What??? How did you come to that conclusion??? That's a mighty big conclusion to come from with the information the original post had in it

223498[/snapback]

In the US, one has to wait a long time for the doctor (even with appointment). If one needs emergency care in the weekend or after hours at hospitals, then one may get a doctor who is an intern.

 

Only when a person has a new disease, then this person may get attention from many doctors.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

One emg/ncv doctor came in at 8:00 pm on Friday on her day off and again at 8:00 am the next morning.  At one point there were 6 doctors and two residents, including the Directors of Orthopedics and Neurophysiology and the head of the Orthopedics Medical Teaching School in a conference meeting lasting from 4:00 pm until 6:00 pm.  All for less than 1,000 rmb.

 

I was impressed.  Oh, the care, treatment and bed-side manner were all good also.  Well, one doctor was less than stellar. But, heck, 15 of 16 isn't bad.

221402[/snapback]

There is a work ethic and compassion amongst those practicing medicine in China and many other Asian countries that was lost long ago in the US. There are many that are travelling to China for advanced medical care and procedures rather than having them performed in the US. The advantage is better care, reliability, low cost, and medical staff that is equal or better than what is found here.....

[Dennis143]

Having recently encountered first-hand the medical treatment that Leiqin received here in the US, I must give these few observations.

 

First, from what Leiqin tells me, many of her classmates have had the same blood disorder as her, Immune (Idiopathic) Thrombocytopenia Purpura, or most commonly referred to as ITP. She tells me that many of her classmates have died from this. Hearsay or fact? I will never know. Could it have been a result of environmental factors that attacked her spleen and resulted in it producing auto-antibodies that attacked her platelets? I do not know. Yet, could it be possible? The fact still remains that she says that many of her classmates have had similar symtoms and have died.

 

Makes me wonder what the medical treatment is in China that would not diagnose nor treat those with similar illness as Leiqin.

 

Enter the American medical system. It was like a dream team....diagnosis, treatment, cure and release. It was truly remarkable to witness. So, maybe, it just depends on the amount and type of ones insurance coverage? From what the ER nurses say, EVERYONE must be treated. They cannot refuse treatment to anyone.

 

My good friend Mary (pastor Mary) tells me this story. She had adominal pains. Pains that would double her over. She did not have insurance, but she went to emergency at a local American hospital. After several test, she was diagnosed with kidney stones. They wanted to operate to remove the stones. She decided to see a local Chinese herbalist doctor. He perscribed an herbal concoction that she bought for $10 and drank. It dissolved her stones. Meanwhile, she received a $20,000 bill from the American hospital. She says that each month as she writes a check to pay off this bill, she is reminded to always consult Chinese medicine first.

 

edit: Someone mentioned, in a previous post, that when they retire, they will look for Chinese medicine for nutrition and health and look to American medicine for treatment and cure, if necessary. I agree. A balance of both would be prudent.

Edited June 13, 2006 by Dennis143 (see edit history)

[obxtrainman]

Only if the condition is unique (a new disease).

221412[/snapback]

What??? How did you come to that conclusion??? That's a mighty big conclusion to come from with the information the original post had in it

223498[/snapback]

In the US, one has to wait a long time for the doctor (even with appointment). If one needs emergency care in the weekend or after hours at hospitals, then one may get a doctor who is an intern.

 

Only when a person has a new disease, then this person may get attention from many doctors.

223517[/snapback]

Since he payed less than 1000 RMB, I am concluding he/she was in China, not USA. Even if they were in the USA, that was still not enough information to conclude it was a "NEW DECEASE" Think about it B)

[Jeikun]

Only if the condition is unique (a new disease).

221412[/snapback]

What??? How did you come to that conclusion??? That's a mighty big conclusion to come from with the information the original post had in it

223498[/snapback]

In the US, one has to wait a long time for the doctor (even with appointment). If one needs emergency care in the weekend or after hours at hospitals, then one may get a doctor who is an intern.

 

Only when a person has a new disease, then this person may get attention from many doctors.

223517[/snapback]

Since he payed less than 1000 RMB, I am concluding he/she was in China, not USA. Even if they were in the USA, that was still not enough information to conclude it was a "NEW DECEASE" Think about it B)

223951[/snapback]

He was answering the question in the title:

 

Q: Can I expect this kind of attention in the USA

 

Tony's Answer: Only if it is a new disease

 

His observation was not that the Original Poster must have a new disease to have recieved that kind of attention in China... It was that the only way he would get 16 doctors all over a case in the US is if it is some new disease or unique situation.

 

There, is the sun shining through the fog yet?

[Rakkasan]

I suspect Dennis has hit the nail on the head. The care you receive depends on the amount and type of insurance coverage you have. I have recently been diagnosed with an illness and I am thrilled with the degree of care I am receiving. Granted I have been poked, prodded, and subjected to tests that sometimes seem more torture that medical in nature, I met my deductables and when I thought I still had more co-payments dues I was informed that I have maxed out and there will be no more out-of-pocket expenses for the year other than prescriptions at $15.00 each.

 

In the past I have always had HMO or PPO plans. This time I selected a plan which allows me to chose any doctor I want any where in the country. The local physicians have been very thorough in evaluating me and expediting treatment. I could not be more pleased with US health care.

 

Of course if I die I will have to edit this post.

[obxtrainman]

So at this point in time, have we came up with this new decease yet

[Jeikun]

So at this point in time, have we came up with this new decease yet

224518[/snapback]

Again, he was not saying it was a new disease.

 

The OP described the level of care he received in China.

The OP then asked "Would you expect that level of care in the US?"

Tony said "Only if it was a new disease."

 

In other words... Tony was saying that he believed having a new disease would be the only way 16 doctors would be so busily helping a patient in the US. Since the OP was describing his experience in China, and not the US, Tony was not saying the OP must have a new disease. Granted, that does not make Tony's observation correct, but it doesn't make it as wild a conjecture as you have interpreted it to be.

 

In my own opinion, medical care in China blows goat. My guess is westerners get better care because China always makes efforts to improve its image in the eyes of the rest of the world. Chinese people rarely get that level of care.

 

My wife's grandfather was a famous liver specialist (now retired), she lived near a "very good" hospital, and knew some doctors personally. Yet, her experiences both personal and observed have chilled me. Here's a few:

 

1. To be a doctor in China requires about the US equivalent of premed + residency. Much less education required - and half of that education is focused on traditional Chinese methods meaning they have even less formal school in modern medicine than their time in college would suggest.

 

2. It is common to tip your doctor - that is give them extra money BEFORE the surgery so they do their best... The flip side of that thought being if you do not tip them, they may not do their best... I call that blackmail.

 

3. Many Chinese are born with Hepatitis B. It's epidemic there. Many Chinese also catch Hep B FROM DOCTORS OR DENTISTS! Poor sanitation and a nice black market for clean needles and medical supplies help keep this danger alive.

 

4. Doctors will recommend abortions for a freaking headcold. Population control is more important than good medicine.

 

5. Many doctors there believe you can get a myriad of diseases from your housepet. Things that any moron with an internet connection can quickly refute... yet these are the experts?

 

6. They will tout the virtues of the "chinese style" IUD (the ring with no string). Claiming the western kind causes infection and problems, while the truth is theirs is designed to be purposely difficult to remove and causes by easily a factor of 20 more problems than the western style which is designed to be sterile and easily removed. Again, theirs is designed for population control, not user friendliness.

 

7. They will give antibiotics for ANYTHING. "I suggest you try the placebo, it's excellent today!" Hell, it's available OTC. Not only is it irresponsible to the patient, it is rushing us twoards the inevitable future of super-bacteria. When your kid is dying of a staff infection that used to be knocked out with penicillan, but is now immune to every antibiotic known to man, you will know who to thank.

 

And of course who will a frightened, ill, woman believe? her western SO without even a bachelor's degree? Or the trusted educated Chinese physician?

 

Chinese Medicine... feh. I'll load up webMD, chug back a bottle of Bourbon and take a scalpel to myself first, thanks.

[Dennis143]

So at this point in time, have we came up with this new decease yet

224518[/snapback]

Chinese Medicine... feh. I'll load up webMD, chug back a bottle of Bourbon and take a scalpel to myself first, thanks.

224704[/snapback]

That has got to be the best post of the day. I AM rolling.

 

And, don't forget the block of wood to bite down on!

[tonado]

So at this point in time, have we came up with this new decease yet

224518[/snapback]

Again, he was not saying it was a new disease.

 

The OP described the level of care he received in China.

The OP then asked "Would you expect that level of care in the US?"

Tony said "Only if it was a new disease."

 

In other words... Tony was saying that he believed having a new disease would be the only way 16 doctors would be so busily helping a patient in the US. Since the OP was describing his experience in China, and not the US, Tony was not saying the OP must have a new disease. Granted, that does not make Tony's observation correct, but it doesn't make it as wild a conjecture as you have interpreted it to be.

 

In my own opinion, medical care in China blows goat. My guess is westerners get better care because China always makes efforts to improve its image in the eyes of the rest of the world. Chinese people rarely get that level of care.

 

My wife's grandfather was a famous liver specialist (now retired), she lived near a "very good" hospital, and knew some doctors personally. Yet, her experiences both personal and observed have chilled me. Here's a few:

 

1. To be a doctor in China requires about the US equivalent of premed + residency. Much less education required - and half of that education is focused on traditional Chinese methods meaning they have even less formal school in modern medicine than their time in college would suggest.

 

2. It is common to tip your doctor - that is give them extra money BEFORE the surgery so they do their best... The flip side of that thought being if you do not tip them, they may not do their best... I call that blackmail.

 

3. Many Chinese are born with Hepatitis B. It's epidemic there. Many Chinese also catch Hep B FROM DOCTORS OR DENTISTS! Poor sanitation and a nice black market for clean needles and medical supplies help keep this danger alive.

 

4. Doctors will recommend abortions for a freaking headcold. Population control is more important than good medicine.

 

5. Many doctors there believe you can get a myriad of diseases from your housepet. Things that any moron with an internet connection can quickly refute... yet these are the experts?

 

6. They will tout the virtues of the "chinese style" IUD (the ring with no string). Claiming the western kind causes infection and problems, while the truth is theirs is designed to be purposely difficult to remove and causes by easily a factor of 20 more problems than the western style which is designed to be sterile and easily removed. Again, theirs is designed for population control, not user friendliness.

 

7. They will give antibiotics for ANYTHING. "I suggest you try the placebo, it's excellent today!" Hell, it's available OTC. Not only is it irresponsible to the patient, it is rushing us twoards the inevitable future of super-bacteria. When your kid is dying of a staff infection that used to be knocked out with penicillan, but is now immune to every antibiotic known to man, you will know who to thank.

 

And of course who will a frightened, ill, woman believe? her western SO without even a bachelor's degree? Or the trusted educated Chinese physician?

 

Chinese Medicine... feh. I'll load up webMD, chug back a bottle of Bourbon and take a scalpel to myself first, thanks.

224704[/snapback]

Jason, Thanks for clarifying my post. Yes, there is no way 16 doctors would be helping a patient at the same time in USA unless there is a new disease or unique case (like separating conjoined twins).

[change2marrow]

Jeikun's list can go on and on.... and on....

 

It is the "KEY" factor for me leaving China soon. From what I've experience and witnessed, there's no way I'm going to risk another attempt at fate. Nor will I have my wife do the same. I've experience the 15 so called doctors lined up to examine "The Foreigner". After 10 mins of them staring at me, I wanted to smack them all like "Larry, Moe and Curly."

 

Don't have to take my word for it, just live here and experience it for yourself. As a warning, do so at your own risk.