Allon
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Posts posted by Allon
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Installation of intense ultraviolet lights and nozzles spraying disinfectant at all casino entrances/exits ought to do the trick. Or maybe they can just issue space suits to all guests. They should be able to afford it.
Sigh, maybe I just need to stop reading the news.
You mean "fake news".
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On 4/18/2020 at 12:43 PM, Randy W said:
In case you're getting this (I am, whether I enter real or bogus data)
I know I show my age but I do know modern computer science. I am continually amazed at reports about "antiquated " technology, i.e. Cobol, but cannot seem to explain why modern technology cannot process the same amount of data faster and more reliably.
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Sorry I did not read ahead and catch that you posted this already. The TV (all of them but one) is reporting the administration is just plain unsure how to implement. It will take lawsuit after lawsuit to get it done.
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I just hope we can stay patient here in the US for a little while longer. I am troubled by the hesitancy of some of the researchers to conclude firmly that the recovered victims have impunity for a longer time than what I have been hearing. If things open up, that 2nd wave will take weeks to handle, with an already taxed health care system.
Also, today in the news (translate: Tweet) that immigration to the US will be suspended. The admin is looking (translate: going crazy) at how to implement. That means no H1-B or similar permits, and families will have to wait longer to get together with their family here.
(you may have first time rights to read WAPO.)
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That sounds familiar for some reason......
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So what if it's a rehash of the Nature Medicine article? The National Review now takes back its charge that the labs were to blame, and says it more likely came from natural origin due to the nature of the genome found in COVID not SARS (1) and it is unique in the "cleavage" process after attaching to the ACE2 and penetrating the cell.
National Review is not even a scientific periodical and it is taking back claiming bats and pangolins were not for sale near the lab. They in fact, were and they further say the virus carrier was either a bat or pangolin (they say bat) that passed it to humans. April 9.
Also, horseshoe bats, which are much smaller than the tastier fruit bats, are generally not among the species eaten. The significance of the Yunnan cave sample is that it shows the bat virus didn’t need to recombine with viruses in other species in a market to be infectious to people. The role of the wet markets may be that other animals get infected there and produce much higher loads of virus than the bats would, amplifying the infection.
I am pretty much done with this debate. Reminds me of religious mythology.
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Some on published data about the source of SARS-CoV-2 the virus that causes COVID-19:
QuoteThe coronavirus did not escape from a lab. Here's how we know.
By Jeanna Bryner - Live Science Editor-in-Chief 21 days ago
The persistent myth can be put to bed.
One persistent myth is that this virus, called SARS-CoV-2, was made by scientists and escaped from a lab in Wuhan, China, where the outbreak began.
A new analysis of SARS-CoV-2 {the virus that cause COVID-19} may finally put that latter idea to bed. A group of researchers compared the genome of this novel coronavirus with the seven other coronaviruses known to infect humans: SARS, MERS and SARS-CoV-2, which can cause severe disease; along with HKU1, NL63, OC43 and 229E, which typically cause just mild symptoms, the researchers wrote March 17 in the journal Nature Medicine."Our analyses clearly show that SARS-CoV-2 is not a laboratory construct or a purposefully manipulated virus," they write in the journal article.
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That analysis showed that the "hook" part of the spike had evolved to target a receptor on the outside of human cells called ACE2, which is involved in blood pressure regulation. It is so effective at attaching to human cells that the researchers said the spike proteins were the result of natural selection and not genetic engineering.
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But it turns out, nature is smarter than scientists, and the novel coronavirus found a way to mutate that was better — and completely different— from anything scientists could have created, the study found.
Another nail in the "escaped from evil lab" theory? The overall molecular structure of this virus is distinct from the known coronaviruses and instead most closely resembles viruses found in bats and pangolins that had been little studied and never known to cause humans any harm.
"If someone were seeking to engineer a new coronavirus as a pathogen, they would have constructed it from the backbone of a virus known to cause illness," according to a statement from Scripps.
Where did the virus come from? The research group came up with two possible scenarios for the origin of SARS-CoV-2 in humans. One scenario follows the origin stories for a few other recent coronaviruses that have wreaked havoc in human populations. In that scenario, we contracted the virus directly from an animal — civets in the case of SARS and camels in the case of Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS). In the case of SARS-CoV-2, the researchers suggest that animal was a bat, which transmitted the virus to another intermediate animal (possibly a pangolin, some scientists have said) that brought the virus to humans.
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In the other scenario, those pathogenic features would have evolved only after the virus jumped from its animal host to humans. Some coronaviruses that originated in pangolins have a "hook structure" (that receptor binding domain) similar to that of SARS-CoV-2. In that way, a pangolin either directly or indirectly passed its virus onto a human host.
https://www.livescience.com/coronavirus-not-human-made-in-lab.html
Edit 8Jun2021: The article title now reads:
The coronavirus was not engineered in a lab. Here's how we know.
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The info that we get here in America says that they were handling the virus on a level 2 containment and that there were many infractions in how it was handled. That was reported by a Chinese person that was working in the lab. Please don't make me find that article I am to old and to lazy. Just take my word for it.
Look up about 1 post above yours.
and here. Allon n 31 January 2020 - 11:18 AM in The Middle Kingdom - 中国
That would be here - http://candleforlove.com/forums/topic/50020-wuhan-pnuemonia-becomes-covid-19/?p=643895
11:18 is Mountain Time (I show 12:18, since I use Central Time for this forum). But the quote blocks show my OS' time (China time) - e.g., it shows 1:53AM for your post here.
To get the direct link to a specific post, you can click on the post # in the upper right of the post. For this post, click where it says #250.
I know that, Randy, but I was being lazy. And time zones don't make a heckuva difference to most here. Reference was made to to bat researchers being the cause lately and I just to post then that they had been working on this long before the outbreak, and there was mishandling of bats and pangolins by not only that wet market but others. More on this later.
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The info that we get here in America says that they were handling the virus on a level 2 containment and that there were many infractions in how it was handled. That was reported by a Chinese person that was working in the lab. Please don't make me find that article I am to old and to lazy. Just take my word for it.
Look up about 1 post above yours.
and here. Allon n 31 January 2020 - 11:18 AM in The Middle Kingdom - 中国
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Well, at least someone is having fun.
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There have been a lot of mistakes. I think when it broke, doctors reacted the same as doctors in Italy. They just thought it was pneumonia until so many cases started showing up, and by then it was too late. Not making excuses for lousy lab work. But China has always has some pretty nasty cuisine habits. I do admire their acumen in medicine and research although I wish they were better doctors.
I think all over the world, we will be turning over rocks and finding some nasty worms. Blame is not the word we need now.
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Randy, hang in there. It must be a difficult time for you and I know you love China and your life there. And you have had a tough time lately. We are keeping an eye out. I am glad you keep us posted.
It is tough here too. Can't go anywhere. Parks are empty and shopping is not the joy it was. But it will be over. Probably for you, before it ever is here. I have lost some friends. I feel I am back in surgery every time we go to get food. I keep checking my gloves for holes, just like the old days.
Glad you are keeping your perspective.
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Greg, not to disagree but hope to add, because I always respect your opinion...and certainly your education.
I studied logic with the number 6 rated (they did that in those days) Aristotelian logician in the world but that did not stop me from being pre-med microbio. But I dropped that when I came back from SEA and went back to my passion for "thoughty thoughts." I had already practiced enough having seen more than some doctors see in their lifetime. (I was told that by a surgeon.)
I saw news articles that clearly showed dead bats at that market. Now that may have been made up or (lol) doctored but there are a lot of "If my grandmother had wheels she would be a wagon" in that article.
The great American pragmatist and philosopher Charles Peirce said in a piece about Belief and Doubt:
A belief is that upon which you are willing to act when the occasion presents itself.
I believe there were bats at that market and believe antibodies for COVID-19 don't just magically appear in nearby villagers long before the outbreak in Wuhan, and the antibodies were found by the early research teams themselves. I posted earlier about the activities of those teams.
With all the "might haves" and "may`s" in that article in National Review, I am at the doubt stage, although we might have Colonel Mustard as a suspect. The manner in which the Chinese were handling the bats in those films I saw is proof alone of a breach of protocol. No gloves and none of the handlers looked like white coated professors to me.
I do agree in substance with your last sentence. It's tragic but we will never find the truth behind this story.
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The National Review article and the YouTube story are interesting but contain a lot of stretching words. What is missing is information from several articles that point to multiple cases of COVID-19 virus antibodies in people living around the caves in question as far back as 2005. That could have made them asymptomatic carriers or even worse, the real first COVID-19 victims. Is there a log of their activity from 2005 to late 2019?
Just because someone says bats or pangolins were not sold in the now famous market doesn't make it so. China is lovely for such juicy gossip.
But no doubt the laboratory was not located properly for what they did. And throwing around bat piss and blood....another lovely story made up by a grad student somewhere in a dorm.
What happened to researchers who worked the lab reminds me of the hysteria behind the death of certain Democratic principals in the Clinton campaigns, certainly published in the likes of the National Review. (William Buckley is laughing in his grave,)
And from a YouTube investigator no less. How credible....
I am waiting for more factual evidence even though I am sure the Chinese government is involved somewhere in the black keys.
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The Wuhan research team sampled 400 people around the caves in Yunnan and found coronavirus antibodies in their blood. The antibodies matched with 95% accuracy the genetic information of the current COVID-19. IN 2005.
But it doesn't disprove other data that coronavirus has not been around long before in other variants.
The Chinese love their conspiracies and superstitions but there are some serious researchers in that country. I hope they don't end up in some prison. Or worse.
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Not in the US. Our fearless leader has said we we will be "doing good" to keep the peak at 100,000 in the next month. We have not hit the curve yet.
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Well our fearless leader extended the social distance and go out rule to the end of April. And he said if we end up with even 100,000 deaths we will have done a good job.
Any volunteers for the 100,000?
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Vaping and COVID (note - third stage) have in common one aspect, lung damage with or without additives. Hard to say at this stage which is worse, except for the higher cases in morbidity in COVID-19.
So let's continue the conversation about the correlation between smoking and cancer going back to early 1900`s. I think the genetic relation among the coronavirus might just break the tie.
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JUst another obvious thing but maybe some don't know: hand sanitizers are usually 61% ethanol. Not effective enough. Get some isopropyl alcohol in a small sprayer and use that. It will kill the bugs. Hard on the hands but mix with aloe or glycerin with rose water. Don't dilute too much.
Another killer is chlorine or bleach. Mix 4-5 teaspoons with 32 fl ounces of water in a good sprayer. Good to go. Spray the handles, door knobs,any unpainted surface. Cheap and it works.
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The CDC.gov site has an excellent list of things to do during this time. I follow sterile technique a little more strictly than they do. Fortunately, when I saw what was going on China, I got sterile gloves, and masks, (although they are hardly effective), and plenty of TP, milk and eggs. Costco where I am, is completely out of flour.
As Greg says, panic buying is the worst thing to do. Buy what you need for 2 weeks, not 2 months or 1 month. Give the supply chain a chance to catch up. And thanks to some racist remarks by a national figure calling it The Chinese Flu, take your wife with you everywhere. Never let her go alone. Arizona is so full of reddis neckus americanus and they say some of the awfulest things. So be ready. We are an open carry state and I open carry with a Px4 9mm compact. (Obviously, know your carry rules.) Things get quiet when I walk ahead of her.
She does not like it but now understands when she read about Chinese people being sprayed with Lysol. One Chinese woman was beaten to death by a bunch of thugs who thought she had COVID. Of course, incidents like this get exaggerated by the Chinese press here so the Chinese people here start buying guns.
Old feelings of Vietnam are hard to keep tucked away.
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CDC has some really helpful information here.....
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I will do that. Thanks, Greg.
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Been wondering this, too, since I take lisinopril and also wondered if it could help or hurt (since it inhibits - through binding - the ACE) . Hope it doesn't become an issueI wonder to what extent BP medications such as ACE inhibitors like Lisinopril (Zestoretic) might have on the virus. I knew it has a diuretic mix and is the first line of defense on hypertension. Might it help or inhibit the virus? What other hypertension drugs out there that could affect the virus positively or negatively.
Inquiring minds want to know:
https://www.researchgate.net/post/Why_cant_ACE_inhibitors_work_as_coronavirus_blockers
Good link. And nice to know others are thinking about ACE inhibitors as well. Lisinopril is an ACE1 and COVID is ACE2, mentioned by one commenter. So he seemed to think no effect. But 2 others bother me, probably because of acronyms and language.
3rd Mar, 2020Heartt 2000this subject is of important clinical relevance as if more suspicion towards aggravation under ACEI or ARBs, then recommendation could be made to switch temporarily from those classes of HBP Rx to another class as CCB / ... during evolution of COVID or even for prevention
It is reported that other co-factors such as cathepsin L and TMPRSS2 have an important role in that process. If the aim is to supress (sic) viral infection blocking entry driven by coronavirus S protein it seems more reasonable to target the virus, not its receptor, and think about decoy receptor or neutralizing antibodies as vaccine candidates.Have a look to discussion in
https://www.researchgate.net/post/Why_cant_ACE_inhibitors_work_as_coronavirus_blockersThe link referred to by Verbisck requires membership. Philip Seur's comment is interesting. He seems to want to suggest that anyone using ACE1 (presumably Lisinopril) convert to a calcium channel blocker (CCB). CCB's did little to get my BP down. Of course, I was taking it at a time when I going through some bad bouts of PTSD. Now my BP is almost too low and the doc has suggested me slowly going off Lisinopril and I have managed to get to a lower dose. The next step is off completely, which for me is a major accomplishment.
With this controversy, not knowing if Lisinopril is a good or bad thing with COVID, I am hesitant to go all the way.
Very interesting....I am going to try and get that article.
Coronavirus/COVID in the U. S. & Elsewhere
in Stateside
Posted
Wait for the Second Wave and see what happens in China. Good luck in any case.