I-864 and Joint Sponsorship

[hamlett22]

I filed a CR1 immigration for my wife at Guz. I need to fill out an Affidavit of Support (AOS). My current income in Hong KOng is above stated poverty levels. My prior three years of income was below poverty levels (I was a teacher on the China mainland, go figure). Anyway, because my last three tax years were below poverty level which I have to indicate on the I-864, my parents are submitting a joint AOS.

Question: Do my parents submit I-864? Or do they have to submit an altogether different AOS form for supporting my AOS?

Your input is appreciated.

Thanks

hamlett22

[frank1538]

Question: Do my parents submit I-864? Or do they have to submit an altogether different AOS form for supporting my AOS?

166571[/snapback]

As joint sponsors, your parents would submit their own I-864s. I would suggest that only one of your parents execute the I-864, not both.

 

Are you comfortable with your "domicile" being in the US?

[hamlett22]

Question: Do my parents submit I-864? Or do they have to submit an altogether different AOS form for supporting my AOS?

166571[/snapback]

As joint sponsors, your parents would submit their own I-864s. I would suggest that only one of your parents execute the I-864, not both.

 

Are you comfortable with your "domicile" being in the US?

166573[/snapback]

By domicile you mean place of residence or home? I live in Shenzhen with my wife. I've been in China with her for almost 2 years straight. So my home (where I hang my hat) is here with my So and my child. But my permanent place of residence is in the U.S. whihc is where we will go once my wife gets her immigrant visa.

 

Hamlett22

[frank1538]

"Domicile" is a complex concept, but is often defined as that place to which you will return after temporary stays elsewhere. Take a look at http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/in...nfo_1328.html#4 for some additional information.

[Joanne]

Why did you raise the "domicile" issue here, Frank? Do you think Hamlett will have a problem with that (with the VO)?

[awch]

I also lived in China for 2 straight years and my husband almost didn't get the visa because of that. Luckily, when told he must prove my ties to the US, he remembered to pull out a letter from a University accepting me to the Master's program. That was enough for us, but the VO's do take domicile as a serious issue.

[david_dawei]

I assume the VOs stance on the domicile is preemptive.. meaning, they want to ensure now (rather than enforce later) that you'll be staying in the US.. but there's so much to lose if one is not staying in the US.. namely, a green card. SO, seems a 'duh' point to think that the couple wants to risk the GC. Or maybe I'm misunderstanding the issue...

[warpedbored]

It seems to me that the idea is to prove that you really do have a legit place to live and or work and that you're not just marrying someone in China to get them a greencard so they can go to the US while you remain there.

 

How is domicile determined?

 

Domicile is a complex issue and must be determined on a case by case basis. To qualify as a sponsor, a petitioner who is residing abroad must have a principal residence in the U.S. and intend to maintain that residence for the foreseeable future.

 

 

He/she left the United States for a limited and not indefinite period of time,

He/she intended to maintain a domicile in the United States, and

He/she has evidence of continued ties to the United States.

[frank1538]

I'm not suggesting that Hamlett22 has a domicile problem, but it is something that a USC residing abroad should be mindful of. Here's the problem with domicile. If your domicile is not in the US, you cannot execute the I-864. If you, the petitioner, cannot execute the I-864 because of this, you cannot use a joint sponsor. No sponsor = no I-864. No I-864 = no visa.

[Joanne]

Sorry, Frank, again I don't understand how one "execute the I-864". I just assume that if USC would not be in US, then they would not apply to welfare, then there would be no public burden.

[frank1538]

Sorry, Frank,  again I don't understand how one "execute the I-864".  I just assume that if USC would not be in US, then they would not apply to welfare, then there would be no public burden.

167180[/snapback]

When I say "execute the I-184" I mean "to sign the form". Under the law, a USC cannot sign the I-184 unless he or she is domiciled in the US.

 

It might seem logical that the US government might not be worried if someone was residing outside the US since, as you say, the applicant probably wouldn't be applying for welfare and become a public burden. But, I think it is safe to assume that the applicant will be coming to the US (that's why he or she is applying for a visa), and that's why the I-864 is needed. Whether it makes sense or not, the law requires that the sponsor be domiciled in the US.

[Joanne]

Sorry, Frank,  again I don't understand how one "execute the I-864".  I just assume that if USC would not be in US, then they would not apply to welfare, then there would be no public burden.

167180[/snapback]

When I say "execute the I-184" I mean "to sign the form". Under the law, a USC cannot sign the I-184 unless he or she is domiciled in the US.

 

It might seem logical that the US government might not be worried if someone was residing outside the US since, as you say, the applicant probably wouldn't be applying for welfare and become a public burden. But, I think it is safe to assume that the applicant will be coming to the US (that's why he or she is applying for a visa), and that's why the I-864 is needed. Whether it makes sense or not, the law requires that the sponsor be domiciled in the US.

167195[/snapback]

Thanks, Frank!

[david_dawei]

Just saw on VJ, a K3 was denied because of lack of domicile... Now, the USC has to provide proof of this for 'overcome'...

[hamlett22]

Just saw on VJ, a K3 was denied because of lack of domicile...  Now, the USC has to provide proof of this for 'overcome'...

167477[/snapback]

An interesting conversation, this domicile issue.

 

My case.... I left the U.S. to come to China to be with my then fiance (now my wife) and teach with the intent of eventually returning with my now wife (then fiance).

 

In the meantime, I have sent all my IRS records to my permanent address in the states, my graduate school continues to bill me through my permanent address in the states, my personal bank continues to send me my monthly statements to my permanent address in the states and I renewed my driver's license before I left the states, voted for the Presidential election absentee while in China, continue to pay some of my bills through my permanent address in the states and have a U.S. telephone routed VIOP to my internet connection in China which is billed to my U.S. based credit card company, a bill I in turn pay via my U.S. bank account. Furthermore, I can get proof from my bank in HK and the U.S. of the transfers of money I have made from my HK job and bank account to the U.S. In otherwords, I am making money in HK and spending it in the states.

 

Why do I make my life so complicated, one might ask? So I can return to the U.S. someday without starting over because I never planned on leaving permanently in the first place.

 

So, with that said, and based on some of what was advised in this thread, perhaps I had better put together some PROOF showing my continued ties to the U.S (continuous enrollment in grad. school [ dissertations take a long time when abroad ], bank records, voter registration card, driver's licence issue date ( a mere 4 days before I left), Chicago telephone number, credit card statements, etc....

 

Any other advice? Is a VO in Guz going to ask my wife to present informational proof such as this when she goes in for her interview? How can they possibly wade through all of this in the standard Guz 5 minute in and out thang? Do they look at this before the interview? In my paperwork (p#3 or p#4) I see no place to add this information to prove my domicile.

 

Wait a tick... Another thought. American Citizen Services is asking me to present 5 years of tax returns, my college transcripts, the original fed ex envelope that included my M.A. diploma, and my diploma's, as proof of "recent ties" to the U.S. as a means of me being able to vouch for my daughter's U.S. naturalization proceedings. Therefore, the three years of tax receipts that the I-864 requires should cover the U.S. ties (my permanent address in the U.S. is listed on each W-2) through the present, so that should set their minds at ease. ???

 

Hamlett22

Edited November 10, 2005 by hamlett22 (see edit history)

[awch]

I would prepare all the information with your ties to the US for the interview. You don't need it before then. It is a possible interview question.