Pre First Steps

[Geeraffe]

Hi there,

 

I was referred this forum by another member and before I go any further I would like to say how great this resource is and how selfless its members are to help people through this daunting process. Thank you to everyone here.

 

The reason I am here making this post is like many of you I have someone special in my life who just so happens to be from mainland China. I have recently moved back home to America for work and very seriously believe this is the woman I want to spend the rest of my life with. But nothing is easy, especially when it comes to American immigration policies. I come to the good people of this website for advice: I (we) haven't even set off on this journey and if you would be so kind as to point me in the right direction for pre-first steps I would be extremely grateful. If you'll indulge me and read further, I'd like to introduce myself to you.

 

My name is Daniel and I am a 27 year old white guy from Chicago. I moved to China in 2009 without knowing anyone nor the language after graduating university. I taught English for a year or so, decided that I wanted to stay in China but not teach English and landed work in a small communications firm. From there, I moved on after a couple years to a bigger company where I met Fiona, a now 26 year old Beijinger (for clarity, her hukou is from Beijing). From the moment I saw her I knew she was the one for me, and getting to know her over the past 2 years has only made me more so. We became closer over that time working after midnight together, going out together and generally being more involved in each others lives. We were never more than good friends for nearly my entire time in that company and in China - I started in September 2012 only this past March did I kiss her for the first time, coincidentally on the night that I told her in earnest I was leaving the company and China. Since then it's all been a roller coaster ride: we've traveled the world, fallen in love and said teary goodbyes in airports. Oh, and of course Skyped pretty much daily while apart. For the record, we speak mostly English with each other as hers is near flawless. My Chinese is fluent, but on a much more basic level than her English.

 

I am fully aware of the pitfalls that we could encounter in our relationship, especially considering the speed at which we've progressed and in what atmospheres we have been exposed to each other. We have not lived together if you don't count the 3 weeks of travel from Taiwan to Japan this past September, and we are for sure still in the honeymoon period of the relationship. I have not met her parents and she has not met mine (both our parents are divorced and both of mine know of her, but only her mom knows of me - all parties are supportive of our relationship, for now). To that I would say we are doing the best we can considering the situation.

 

So that's a bit about our past. How about our future? We both want to build one with each other, this is something we both know. First off, I will be visiting her for a week in Beijing at the end of November. I am doing this now because I will start work in January in Houston and once I do I will most likely not have enough time for quite a while. So my first question to you all is what are some pre-first steps that I (we) could take now, specifically when I am in Beijing, for the eventual possibility that she would emigrate to America? I want to qualify that question by saying that we have not talked explicitly about her moving here, with timelines and everything, but when it's been brought up casually she is receptive to the idea. Granted, this probably wouldn't happen for another few years. So that's why I would like to know if there is anything we can do now to make the possibility easier down the road.

 

Also, and this is more of a general question, what are some questions we should begin thinking about in our relationship now that might prepare us when hardship or disappointment eventually occurs down the road when it comes to the visa process (or even not)? I think we are doing the best we can to get to know each other in different situations (again - tough when you don't live with each other, but we have both seen each other in stressful situations that are out of our control) and I know that nothing quite prepares you for an involved process such as this.

 

I think I'll leave this here for now. It has already gotten quite lengthy and I don't even know if it's posted in the right place (please move it if it is not)!

 

Thank you for your kindness and all the best,

 

Daniel

[Mick]

First of all, Daniel, welcome to Candle. We are glad to have you aboard and I am certain that, as your journey progresses, you will find much help, support, and good info here on this board. As for what you can do now, I would say keep the big picture in mind. The big picture is simply this: you need to convince a visa officer that you have a bonafide relationship. So from the get go, start accumulating anything that will help you do that. Keep photographs, letters, emails, etc. Also, records of phone calls, etc. Evidence of your travels together is a plus I would think, so any ticket stubs, hotel receipts, etc. One thing you have going for you is that you have lived in close contact with her for several years and that should count for something in the visa officer's mind, although it is no guarantee. Any photos you might be able to take with her family might also be of help. The fact that she is fluent in English and you speak good Chinese is also another plus.

 

I am sure other folks can give you more specific advice. We went through our visa journey way back in 2001-2003, so things have changed somewhat since then, but the thing they are looking for is still the same: a bonafide relationship. The only other advice I would have for you is to be patient with the process. It can be maddening at times and often it makes no sense. If for some reason they should refuse you, don't give up. If you persist, you will eventually succeed. I wish you the very best in your path and again, welcome aboard.

[warpedbored]

As Mick said, welcome to CFL. I know of no other place with more answers to questions about the visa process as it pertains to China. You have a distinct advantage to most of us here in that you got to live and work in China. You have had a lot more time to get to know your sweetheart. First up is decision time. Do you want to start the visa process now, wait until later or marry in China? Since you have already met you could start the K-1 fiance visa process now. The other options are to wait and file K-1 later or make another trip to China and marry her, come home and file an I-130 for a spousal visa. There are advantages and disadvantages to both. K-1 doesn't require another trip to China to file. It would also be the fastest. A spousal visa is less expensive. Those savings would probably be negated by an extra trip to China. A K-1 on the other hand would get her here quicker but the time to get her green card can be lengthy.

[dan1984]

Just stopping in to say best of luck, and welcome! My name is Dan and I'm from up in Milwaukee (Bears still suck! Sorry........). I first came to Beijing in 2005, and after about 2 years of living in China and time spent back in the US thereafter, I've been in Beijing continuously since 2010.

 

I guess our situations are quite similar in many aspects. Like you I met my lady while over here and we've been together for *gasp* 4 years now already. We aren't married yet, but we're moving in that direction. I've also been thinking about some of the same questions as you, and to be honest, I guess I haven't been doing anything out of the norm - besides saving train/plane tickets, hotel receipts, tickets to parks or sights from when traveling, etc. in case they come in handy in the future. Other than that, I think it's just living life as normal and trying to build a strong relationship - which in an ideal and fair world will be easy for the visa office to see and act as the best evidence of all! However, life's not always fair.............and to that end, I'm not sure if I have any good advice, which is why I say live life as you would normally, continue to build a strong relationship, and, get ready for the ride.

 

Anyways, just wanted to say welcome and good luck with everything!

 

dan~

[Randy W]

PICTURES! Take a variety of pictures over time. This will best show your relationship at a glance.

[Geeraffe]

Hello everyone,

 

Thank you for the responses. I feel a lot better now after seeing them and knowing that I am on the right track at the moment. Everything is documented electronically via Skype, WeChat, Email, and letters we have written to each other that we will both never throw away. I understand now more about what a visa agent in the future will be looking for, and feel confident that we will be able to prove we have a bonafide relationship. We have pictures and videos going as far back as when we first met until today.

 

I do have a specific question directed at you, woodworker. I would say that at this moment the topic of her emigrating to America is still in its embryonic stages, and she wouldn't be able to move over here for another couple years at the earliest. If and when we make the decision that this is necessary, I think we would want her to be as independent as possible in America. This means getting her a Green Card as soon as possible from the time of starting the application process. Which method would allow that to happen easiest (meaning the least amount of time involved - let's leave monetary cost out of that equation for now)? Would this be, for example, her coming over here on her own (securing a tourist visa on her own, that is) and then us marrying here and then applying for a spousal visa here? Or would it be us marrying in China first and then me coming back to the States and applying for a spousal visa? In other words, what is the way to go about this that would allow her to work and live over here in America with as little hassle as possible? From your response, my guess would not be a K-1 visa, as you say getting a Green Card would take extra time this way.

 

And @dan1984 - you're right. The Bears do suck. They shouldn't have even bothered to show up last weekend. Best of luck to you and yours as well!

 

Thanks again for everyone's input and the warm welcome.

 

Daniel

[tsap seui]

Welome Geeraffe...you got some great advice from the others fellers. I would add

 

 

Photos....As well as taking the usual (we saw this stuff type photos...that anybody can do) take many of them of you and her together with her family. Those are the best and strongest photos of showing a "bona fide relationship" which is what her interview will be all about.

 

Keep your ticket stubs of your travels to see her over the next couple of years. As well, SKYPE logs and phone call records, etc.

 

Put everything together in what we call an Evolution of Relationship Letter. This letter is very important and can only really be seen by the visa officers in your original application. In your EOR letter you can explain the relationship in specific terms, and with dates to include your time working in China, you met the girl, you fell in love, you moved back to AMerica to work, continuing the relationship and even growing it more from America...etc etc etc.

 

You have to make your original application dead on with all of the evidence you want to show them. The visa officers generally will not accept or even look at any evidence you try and give them AFTER that original application.

 

Time Length of time in the relationship is on your side. Taking your time to start the application is good.

 

Which visa to undertake? Carl gave you a good understanding of the different types...K-1 for fiancee, Cr-1 for spousal married less than 2 years. To me the strongest AND best application is IR-1 which is a spousal married more than 2 years. You state at this point that you are going to take 2 or more years at this point. THen take a look at getting married in CHIna, waiting one year or even 6 to 8 months after the marriage to send in your CR-1 application and in general the application time for most any application is one year start to interview...by your interview date you will be close to two years married. Let's say at her interview you were married 1 year and 10 months...she simply waits 2 more months to exercise her visa (she will have 6 months from visa award date to exercise her visa) and she crosses into her POE (point of entry) into America just after the 2nd year anniversary date. At her POE it will be noted that when she crossed into America she had been married for 2 years or longer and she then gets a 10 year green card with no restrictions and no more dealing with the USCIS officials until 9 years and 6 months or so. A CR-1 (spousal less than 2 years married) only gives her a 2 year green card which has restrictions that in 1 year and 6 or 8 months you will have to send USCIS an application to lift those restrictions and apply for the 10 year green card.

 

I understand you want to take your time (maybe 2 years) then boom, what is the quickest visa to get. Buddy, all of them are gonna take around 12 months...start to interview date. Oh, the K-1 may be 10 months but it comes with those restrictions on a fiancee (travel and work) AND the AOS (adjustment of Status application) to lift those restrictions AND apply for the 2 year green card....later for the 10 year green card.

 

Good luck. Take your time, build up lots of evidence. IN my book the IR-1 is far and away the best...plus, when Dan posts he can show you that it saves well over a $1,000 in the long run AND no more dealing with the USCIS and the stress involved in that as you try and get the restrictions from the other visa applications lifted. Trust me, you don't want to have to fool around with the USCIS and be filing AOS paperwork.

 

tsap seui

[warpedbored]

Since you're in no hurry you could marry on a future trip to China. She would be legal to work upon entry in the US on a CR-1 or IR-1 visa. Figure in about 10-12 months for the visa process. If you marry sooner and file later she would be eligible for an IR-1 visa and would be granted a 10 year green card after entry to the US if married for 2 years. If married less than 2 years at entry she would be granted a 2 year green card requiring removal of conditions 2 years down the road. She can't work on a tourist visa and marrying here then filing for a green card without returning to China has risk. of the IO believing she came on a tourist visa with the intent of staying. She could be banned for 10 years or more.