The Fall of Bo Xilai

[knloregon]

An ongoing topic - click here for Most Recent Post

 

 

Many of us have been fascinated as this has played out --- not only in the western press, but in the incendiary postings on China's internet---so much for the 'Great Firewall' But for the west, when so much of China's once a decade 'regime change' is usually conducted in private, this has offered a wealth of Chinese political insights.

Wen last Wednesday: "The current party committee and government of Chongqing must seriously reflect... and learn lessons."

WSJ: (today) : "In an essay published Friday, Vice President Xi urged fellow leaders not to "play to the crowd" or "seed fame and fortune" and too abide by a consensus-making system that has evolved since the death of Chairman Mao Zedong in 1976." ---- a clear reference to the 'new left' in the party.

Even though my wife is from a family of party members, she dreads a return of the 'hard line' of Mao, which Bo at least embraced, to some extent during his rule in Chongqing. One thing seems clear, the party doesn't like this kind of strife and world-wide publicity during the delicate and (supposed to be) back room dealings to establish the new leadership.

Edited April 28, 2020 by Randy W (see edit history)

[Randy W]

 

. . .

 

Wen last Wednesday: "The current party committee and government of Chongqing must seriously reflect... and learn lessons."

 

WSJ: (today) : "In an essay published Friday, Vice President Xi urged fellow leaders not to "play to the crowd" or "seed fame and fortune" and too abide by a consensus-making system that has evolved since the death of Chairman Mao Zedong in 1976." ---- a clear reference to the 'new left' in the party.

 

. . .

 

 

One of the primary differences between politics in China and politics in the U.S. - and also an indication of how easy it is for the Communist Party to pull strings to effect changes where they see fit.

[Mick]

I think it will be interesting to see how this all plays out as the next couple of years unfold. (provided, of course, we make it past 2012). I should think any kind of deep return to the Maoist hard line might meet with strong disapproval from the newly-minted upper class and upper middle class. Of course, as we have seen before (eg. 1989), strong disapproval does not necessarily mean any kind of successful policy change. I think perhaps a key player in all this, if any kind of open conflict arises, would be the military. Would they, once again, turn on their own brothers and sisters like they did in '89?

 

Chances are it will never get that far, but it is interesting to speculate. Will be wise to keep an eye on which way the wind blows over the next month or so.

[knloregon]

"... I should think any kind of deep return to the Maoist hard line might meet with strong disapproval from the newly-minted upper class and upper middle class..."

 

Interesting point, Mick, since that is exactly the class in Russia that is protesting Putin's return to power. And even thought my family are party members---GF dating to the hardest of times, they have all had a taste capitalist success. (even GF---issued stock in some obscure local state run company, when China opened in 1978----and several years ago, came to find out it was worth nearly $3,000 USD! None of my family want to return to those times, and echo Wen's sentiments.

[dnoblett]

On 3/18/2012 at 11:08 PM, Mick said:

I think it will be interesting to see how this all plays out as the next couple of years unfold. (provided, of course, we make it past 2012). I should think any kind of deep return to the Maoist hard line might meet with strong disapproval from the newly-minted upper class and upper middle class. Of course, as we have seen before (eg. 1989), strong disapproval does not necessarily mean any kind of successful policy change. I think perhaps a key player in all this, if any kind of open conflict arises, would be the military. Would they, once again, turn on their own brothers and sisters like they did in '89?

 

Chances are it will never get that far, but it is interesting to speculate. Will be wise to keep an eye on which way the wind blows over the next month or so.

Reference the Mayan Calendar?

 

 

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?/topic/44264-oops-i-fergot/page__fromsearch__1

Edited July 13, 2021 by Randy W (see edit history)

[Mick]

On 3/21/2012 at 6:17 AM, dnoblett said:

On 3/18/2012 at 11:08 PM, Mick said:

I think it will be interesting to see how this all plays out as the next couple of years unfold. (provided, of course, we make it past 2012). I should think any kind of deep return to the Maoist hard line might meet with strong disapproval from the newly-minted upper class and upper middle class. Of course, as we have seen before (eg. 1989), strong disapproval does not necessarily mean any kind of successful policy change. I think perhaps a key player in all this, if any kind of open conflict arises, would be the military. Would they, once again, turn on their own brothers and sisters like they did in '89?

 

Chances are it will never get that far, but it is interesting to speculate. Will be wise to keep an eye on which way the wind blows over the next month or so.

Reference the Mayan Calendar?

 

http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt/d/4;3;459/st/20121221/e/Dooms+Day/k/5f48/event.png

 

http://candleforlove...__fromsearch__1

Yep, that's the 2012 reference Dan. Tongue in cheek of course. Let's hope we make it past the 21st of December (the 23rd by some counts). I would hate to miss Christmas.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Randy W (see edit history)

[knloregon]

Story has legs, thats for sure, and it definitely has out-paced any of the so-called 'fire-wall' censors (you want internet censorship---go to democratic India, or Italy for that matter).... So was Bo really trying to unify the armies of the west---classically referred to as the 'Third Line' ---to actually make a military run at Beijing? Not worth the ether it was printed on when wife referred to it from Chinese internet sources last week.

 

But now, WSJ runs a page one article: "U.K. Seeks Probe Into China Death" WSJ is a very careful source, and it seems a British businessman, named Neil Heywood supposedly with strong ties to the BO family, comes up dead in a Chongqing hotel last year.... drank himself to death, according to Chongqing authorities (who then quickly cremated the body---without autopsy). Problem being, Heywood was a well known teetotaler.

 

Remember the scene (Always on my top ten movie list) in: " North, by Northwest" when the wicked VanDam realizes that Cary Grant may not be their man, and has his thugs pour a fifth of whiskey down his throat, and puts him in a car on---what looks like Route 1 in Big Sur? He just barely survives? Perhaps Haywood wasn't so lucky.

 

For a page one story, this sure is vague, (details to follow! --- I suppose) but it builds links to Bo's wife, (a lawyer, who has, in her past, practiced successfully before American bars---not the drinking kind) ---- and implied links back to Wang Lijun---remember him? the police chief that ended up spending a night in the US Consulate---and as implied here---may have spilled the real beans about Haywood's death?

 

"...A U.S. Embassy spokesman declined to comment on whether Mr. Wang had raised Mr. Haywood's case during his stay in the consulate or whether the U.S. officials had passed any information about it to British authorities."

 

You read the WSJ on a regular basis, you understand this statement isn't there by accident.

[Randy W]

A British guy who obviously got involved with the wrong people - the question would be which Chongqing faction did him in?

 

In any event, that (Bo's) part of the Communist Party is lopped off - end of story (at least the big picture). There may or may not be sidewinders from it, which may or may not have had anything to do with Bo's demise, and all depending on how much (if any) investigation is possible.

[Randy W]

“Even if there was this matter of the Englishman, it is far from the whole story,” said one political analyst with ties to high-level Chinese officials, who requested anonymity for fear of repercussions. “The core of the matter is not just what happened between Wang and Bo. It’s the underlying political struggle.”

[knloregon]

'...You read the WSJ on a regular basis, you understand this statement isn't there by accident. ..."

 

And here comes the rest of the story in blockbusters ------- Page one on today's WSJ ---- as follow up: ( Remember, Wang Lijun, now ex-Chief of Police ---in Chongqing ---seeking refuge in the US Consulate? "Mr. Wang claimed to have told his boss he believed Mr. Haywood had been poisoned--a discussion that led to a falling out with Mr. Bo---."

 

"Mr. Wang also claimed that Mr. Haywood had been involved in a business dispute w Mr. Bo's wife..." This is huge, of course, if its splashed on page one of the WSJ ----the implication (as I read it) is that Bo's wife had Haywood killed. At this sensitive time of power transition in China, The Party can't afford to have even the implication of these kinds of these clandestine actions... The termination!------of a Western businessman!~

 

Kudos to WSJ ---- for digging deeper--- even though this could go MUCH deeper still, (IMHO) ....

[Randy W]

'...You read the WSJ on a regular basis, you understand this statement isn't there by accident. ..."

 

And here comes the rest of the story in blockbusters ------- Page one on today's WSJ ---- as follow up: ( Remember, Wang Lijun, now ex-Chief of Police ---in Chongqing ---seeking refuge in the US Consulate? "Mr. Wang claimed to have told his boss he believed Mr. Haywood had been poisoned--a discussion that led to a falling out with Mr. Bo---."

 

"Mr. Wang also claimed that Mr. Haywood had been involved in a business dispute w Mr. Bo's wife..." This is huge, of course, if its splashed on page one of the WSJ ----the implication (as I read it) is that Bo's wife had Haywood killed. At this sensitive time of power transition in China, The Party can't afford to have even the implication of these kinds of these clandestine actions... The termination!------of a Western businessman!~

 

Kudos to WSJ ---- for digging deeper--- even though this could go MUCH deeper still, (IMHO) ....

 

yes - now that I've subscribed to their email updates for a while, I AM getting access to a LOT of good articles.

 

. . . and there's this, which in the West, might be just a beginning, but in China, most likely an end

 

 

DO NOT BE CONFUSED

 

Only by being fearless of risks, undisturbed by external noise and unconfused by gossip and rumors can China solidly "seek progress while ensuring stability,"

 

Websites closed, six detained for spreading rumors

 

 

Chinese authorities closed 16 websites and detained six people responsible for "fabricating or disseminating online rumors," the State Internet Information Office (SIIO) and Beijing police said Friday.

The websites, including meizhou.net, xn528.com and cndy.com.cn, were closed for spreading rumors of "military vehicles entering Beijing and something wrong going on in Beijing," which were fabricated by some lawless people recently, said a spokesman with SIIO.

[knloregon]

All good points Randy ~ ! And, as I suggested earlier--- there is much speculation on the Chinese web that seems, at least, clearly over the top-- (no, Bo wasn't trying to overthrow BJ...) But two point emerge--- its conceivable, at least, that someone in the Bo camp knocked of Haywood, and all Western Expats are probably safer, going forward, since the WSJ reporting has got to be an incredible embarrassment of the PRC at a sensitive time of transition.

[knloregon]

And Randy,

 

--------as a follow up of your last post -----let me give you an example of how sensitive this issue has become, from our perspective.

 

The Chinese side of my family are party members, which is to say, generally with uncensored access to information. When I tried to discuss the Bo issue (in Feb.) with Father (old Communist---some rank) ---he had no idea what I was talking about. We now forward emails to sister-in-law in Guangdong, who forwards them to Father in Hunan. The Great Fire Wall has been circumvented, but if you don't know what your are looking for to begin with, you are unlikely to find it..

[david_dawei]

It is a rather fascinating unfolding... Bo Xilai is well known in the north; he created Dalian as a cultured city and was in Liaoning for a while, which is where Wang enforced his reputation.

 

Bo Xilai was predicted to rise to the top along with his "Strike Black, Sing Red" slogon which many felt was a righteous reform idea but wrongly couched in cultural revolution ideas. Wang was his henchman who sought asylum at the consulate, days after blasting Xilai... that backfired... now the fall out is felt.

[Randy W]

And Randy,

 

--------as a follow up of your last post -----let me give you an example of how sensitive this issue has become, from our perspective.

 

The Chinese side of my family are party members, which is to say, generally with uncensored access to information. When I tried to discuss the Bo issue (in Feb.) with Father (old Communist---some rank) ---he had no idea what I was talking about. We now forward emails to sister-in-law in Guangdong, who forwards them to Father in Hunan. The Great Fire Wall has been circumvented, but if you don't know what your are looking for to begin with, you are unlikely to find it..

 

Sorry, not really seeing any point here.