Zhao Ziyang

[usagroom]

Afterall, she was there.

 

keep it tactful and within reason

 

Welcome to Candle, usagroom.

 

So was my SO. Hence what I said about not all Chinese agree on the account that Ziyang was a failure and responsible for the military crackdown in Beijing. Many, many think just the opposite, that Ziyang had a great career and did the most in the government to stop the crackdown. Joanne can have her opinion but can I just ask a couple questions? I did not call insult her, did not take anything out of context, etc. Just asked questions.

 

Thanks for the welcome.

[usagroom]

This book by Zhao Ziyang is fantastic!

Edited May 30, 2009 by usagroom (see edit history)

[samsong]

Afterall, she was there.

 

keep it tactful and within reason

 

Welcome to Candle, usagroom.

 

So was my SO. Hence what I said about not all Chinese agree on the account that Ziyang was a failure and responsible for the military crackdown in Beijing. Many, many think just the opposite, that Ziyang had a great career and did the most in the government to stop the crackdown. Joanne can have her opinion but can I just ask a couple questions? I did not call insult her, did not take anything out of context, etc. Just asked questions.

 

Thanks for the welcome.

Many believe the Chairman is the father of the country. Others have different titles for him.

Zhao Ziyang was the Premier which is equivalent to President but it was Deng Xiaping who was pulling all the strings. That little man had the power and knew how to use it. Mao Zedong saw it in him. I'm going to have to read up on him, he's caught my interest.

[Joanne]

Zhao may be a good person, but he failed as a politician. He is partially the cause of the June 4 incident, in my opinion.

 

I have no doubt the publication of this book about Zhao is funded by organizations supported by anti-China

Zhao Ziyang is responsible for the military massacre? Failed as a politician? You said you are from the north in Beijing. Ask some from the south where Zhao served in Guangdong and elsewhere. Then read his own words about it and the context. Maybe he is lying and this is all a plot by anti-China forces as you say. Many Chinese who participated at Tiananman and around the country disagree with you.

 

I would be interested in your knowledge that this book is funded by, like people in your family, who are in anti-Chinese organizations. Your post reads rather biased.

 

Joanne's post came off too strong, but ......

 

Well, I re-read what I wrote and I agree that my post "came off too strong". I am always very disturbed facing this topic.

 

If I have a chance to write my opinions again. It would still be the same. I think I made it very clear as they are only my opinions.

 

Everybody's action will lead to consequences. The consequence might not be desired. History is a closed black box. Who can say he knows the truth?

[usagroom]

Well, I re-read what I wrote and I agree that my post "came off too strong". I am always very disturbed facing this topic.

 

If I have a chance to write my opinions again. It would still be the same. I think I made it very clear as they are only my opinions.

 

Everybody's action will lead to consequences. The consequence might not be desired. History is a closed black box. Who can say he knows the truth?

Joanne, peace to you. Yes, truth is transient. History is in control of those who write it.

 

Do you know Renee Chiang? She is a co-editor of this book and was a teacher in Beijing in 1989. And do you really think the publishers of this book are anti-China and why? Is it about New Century Press in Hong Kong? If you prefer not to answer here or via PM that is fine.

[Joanne]

Well, I re-read what I wrote and I agree that my post "came off too strong". I am always very disturbed facing this topic.

 

If I have a chance to write my opinions again. It would still be the same. I think I made it very clear as they are only my opinions.

 

Everybody's action will lead to consequences. The consequence might not be desired. History is a closed black box. Who can say he knows the truth?

Joanne, peace to you. Yes, truth is transient. History is in control of those who write it.

 

Do you know Renee Chiang? She is a co-editor of this book and was a teacher in Beijing in 1989. And do you really think the publishers of this book are anti-China and why? Is it about New Century Press in Hong Kong? If you prefer not to answer here or via PM that is fine.

 

I am not able to answer your question, because I don't know the truth.

[usagroom]

Well, I re-read what I wrote and I agree that my post "came off too strong". I am always very disturbed facing this topic.

 

If I have a chance to write my opinions again. It would still be the same. I think I made it very clear as they are only my opinions.

 

Everybody's action will lead to consequences. The consequence might not be desired. History is a closed black box. Who can say he knows the truth?

Joanne, peace to you. Yes, truth is transient. History is in control of those who write it.

 

Do you know Renee Chiang? She is a co-editor of this book and was a teacher in Beijing in 1989. And do you really think the publishers of this book are anti-China and why? Is it about New Century Press in Hong Kong? If you prefer not to answer here or via PM that is fine.

I am not able to answer your question, because I don't know the truth.

Okay. The book says she was a teacher in 1989 in Beijing. She is the English editor of the book and Bao Pu is the publisher and editor, both of New Century Press in Hong Kong. That is why I asked about them. Bao Pu, it says is an activist.

 

After reading this I am looking forward to the Chinese version and hoping that the actual audio will be released.

[griz326]

My wife's unedited comment is: "savamoney, I do not want to read lies."

 

This, of course, corresponds to the widespread belief (in the places in China I asked the question from Shengyang-Beijing to Guangzhou-Nanning to Chengdu area over a number of years) that the protests were instigated by the USA.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

My wife's unedited comment is: "savamoney, I do not want to read lies."

 

This, of course, corresponds to the widespread belief (in the places in China I asked the question from Shengyang-Beijing to Guangzhou-Nanning to Chengdu area over a number of years) that the protests were instigated by the USA.

 

 

Likely some truth in that; whether it was directly or indirectly. I place a lot more value in the words directly from the people of China, and certainly in Joanne, who actually lived here and experienced that time.

 

It's pretty freaky when you've got a group of Americans that seem to know more about the events of China than the Chinese people themselves.

[david_dawei]

My wife's unedited comment is: "savamoney, I do not want to read lies."

 

This, of course, corresponds to the widespread belief (in the places in China I asked the question from Shengyang-Beijing to Guangzhou-Nanning to Chengdu area over a number of years) that the protests were instigated by the USA.

 

 

Likely some truth in that; whether it was directly or indirectly. I place a lot more value in the words directly from the people of China, and certainly in Joanne, who actually lived here and experienced that time.

 

It's pretty freaky when you've got a group of Americans that seem to know more about the events of China than the Chinese people themselves.

Calling out the american side is no better than calling out the chinese side.

 

As I think joanne suggests, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle or maybe just elusive... there's no point in acting like we expect people to answer to our position. Let's stop calling out people directly in a confrontational manner.

[usagroom]

It's pretty freaky when you've got a group of Americans that seem to know more about the events of China than the Chinese people themselves.

Actually that is pretty normal at times, not freaky. The Chinese people in general do not have access to the kind of media like here. Some speculate that is why Tank Man and other things are not widely known in China. In the Zhao book it mentions that. He kind of knew his memoir would be read more in the West than in his own country.

[samsong]

It's pretty freaky when you've got a group of Americans that seem to know more about the events of China than the Chinese people themselves.

Actually that is pretty normal at times, not freaky. The Chinese people in general do not have access to the kind of media like here. Some speculate that is why Tank Man and other things are not widely known in China. In the Zhao book it mentions that. He kind of knew his memoir would be read more in the West than in his own country.

I'm sure Zhao did know that since Mao Zedong isolated the people of China behind the "iron curtain". Mao Zedong has had a strong grip on China 30 years after his death.

[usagroom]

I'm sure Zhao did know that since Mao Zedong isolated the people of China behind the "iron curtain". Mao Zedong has had a strong grip on China 30 years after his death.

In the preface to PRISONER OF THE STATE it says

Zhao later learned that Chairman Mao himself had been responsible for his return from political exile. Mao one day had suddenly asked an attendant, whatever happened to Zhao Ziyang? When he was told that Zhao had been purged and sent to the countryside as a laborer, Mao expressed his displeasure with the excesses of the purification effort he had launched with the Cultural Revolution. "Purging every single person? That's not what I want..." With that, Zhao Ziyang was rehabilitated.

[samsong]

I'm sure Zhao did know that since Mao Zedong isolated the people of China behind the "iron curtain". Mao Zedong has had a strong grip on China 30 years after his death.

In the preface to PRISONER OF THE STATE it says

Zhao later learned that Chairman Mao himself had been responsible for his return from political exile. Mao one day had suddenly asked an attendant, whatever happened to Zhao Ziyang? When he was told that Zhao had been purged and sent to the countryside as a laborer, Mao expressed his displeasure with the excesses of the purification effort he had launched with the Cultural Revolution. "Purging every single person? That's not what I want..." With that, Zhao Ziyang was rehabilitated.

Yep, I remember reading that before and my wife had also told me about that. She said Mao Zedong sent Zhao Ziyang to prison a couple of times but always let him out because he liked him.

[usagroom]

Yep, I remember reading that before and my wife had also told me about that. She said Mao Zedong sent Zhao Ziyang to prison a couple of times but always let him out because he liked him.

Zhao was exiled only once until he was purged in 1989 for life, according to the books.