A Communist Party catch-22!!

rogerwink · November 6, 2007

Hi guys,

I have been away from CFL for a long time, since my wife came here successfully in 2001 on a K1, is now a US Citizen, we had a baby 3 months ago, her sister came here also on a K1 successfully and we applied for her mother to immigrate as an IR5.

Everything I know about the process is that it is slow, methodical, plodding, etc. But if one has patience it all seems do-able.

HOWEVER.......

My Mother-In-Law is in a nightmare. She failed her interview because she was and still is a member of the CCP. They blue slipped her and asked for a detailed resume and to fill out answers to the dreaded "8-communist membership questions".

So...Be honest at the interview and move to Blue Slip Lane. OK, they tell you what they want.. So give them what they want again, and be honest, right?

So.. The resume is a no-brainer.. Written, translated, certified, done!

But the CCP questions?? Written, BUT they CANNOT and WILL NOT be translated by a certified translator!!!!!

She tried to get it translated in her hometown and NO-ONE will touch it! They will NOT translate ANY document that says anything NEGATIVE or BAD about the CCP. We then thought to locate and telephone several translation companies in GuangZhou. First they say "no problem" but when we e-mail the actual document to them they say "NO WAY! Everything about that paper is against the CCP!" (yes..we told you the first time!)
Such as the following (truthful) items she wrote that they said were too negative to translate:
I joined the CCP just to get a better job.
I remained a member because in the past it was dangerous to even think about resigning, so after retirement, I remained a member.
My participation in the CCP was absolutely minimal and non-meaningful.
I can NOT terminate from the CCP. I tried to when I returned home and they threatened me not to.

So..I thought I'd put this in front of the collective brain and see if anybody has an idea??

Oh… and we already though of trying to "soften" the tone of the replies by "Lying" but then if she says she “loves the CCP and will never quit”, she's toast!

Going to GuangZhou next week to see if we can bribe someone to translate it. Grrrrr!

Randy W · November 6, 2007

I would think you could find a certified translator here in the US. I don't remember anyone needing one before, though, so I'm not sure where you would find one. Maybe start at a university, or the Chinese consulate?

Maybe someone here will know.

warpedbored · November 6, 2007

My thoughts exactly, I don't think there is any rule the certified translation has to be done in China. You also might email the consulate and ask them if they have someone who can do it there.

rogerwink · November 7, 2007

We MAYBE have found an indepedent translator in GuangZhou who will do the "against CCP" translation.

We spent all night calling hotels to get phone numbers of translation services and asking them for other contacts when they all said "NOT GONNA DO IT". We had softened the response down as far as we dared and still, no-one would touch it. But finally, someone has agreed to do it. In fact she allowed us to "harden" it back up a bit. :sosad:

If all goes well in GuangZhou, I will post her name and number for others to use when they get into this nasty pickle also.

In reply to "get someone to do it in the USA"... I considered this, but the reply to the commie questions is requested to be written, and thus, I think the consulate is looking for a handwritten statement from the beneficiary that is attached to the "Notarized English Translation" exactly as they ask for. If the M.I.L. is not IN the USA, then nobody can legally "notarize" her signature on the original document. This GuangZhou gal promised to staple the original to the translation as well as the "Certified Translator" statement as a cover page and then Crimp all the documents together with her business seal. That is what *I* would expect if *I* was asking someone for a written, notarized, translated statement.

Now we must hope it all goes as planned and then mail the docs into the consulate and wait the million or so years for the waiver process to complete.

TTYAL

warpedbored · November 7, 2007

You might want to think twice before posting her information here. At least get her permission first. Baidu spider does mine this site.

MikeandRong · November 9, 2007

Send mamabear a PM, she will know what to do.

Silveril · November 9, 2007

We MAYBE have found an indepedent translator in GuangZhou who will do the "against CCP" translation.

Remember, China is not the USA, rules are very different. I would NOT post the person's information in a public forum, or you may ruin her buisness or livelyhood. the best way to get it translated is the US consul, or try a university professor in the USA. as a professor, he would be qualified and certified. The consul in GhongZhou down the street from McDonalds, should be able to translate it and certified it.

Silver

lostinblue · December 6, 2007

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=10946

Here is some things that came up before.

Dear CFL Members,

Here is a link that you should be able to access, which takes you directly to the section of the FAM, which deals with this issue. It is:

http://foia.state.gov/masterdocs/09fam/0940034N.pdf

If an applicant is a current or former member of the Chinese Communist Party, we request that they fill out a questionnaire, which we provide. This questionnaire has detailed questions about the nature of the applicant’s membership in the Communist Party. Based on the answers to these questions, we then consult with D.C. in making a decision on whether or not an applicant’s membership in the party makes them ineligible for a visa.

Edited December 6, 2007 by lostinblue (see edit history)

rogerwink · December 12, 2007

Cammie,

I am convinced the best way to handle the CCP, witch-hunt problem is to be ABLE to truthfully answer "NO" to the V.O.'s Communist Party question IF it comes up...and hope that it does NOT come up.

Even if he could resign, he must have quit for 2-years BEFORE the date of VISA application before the Visa Officer can consider giving a waiver to him at the interview.

My advice/opinion about this CCP B.S.:

Stop paying dues as soon as possible before the interview! Why? Because then he CAN answer (relatively) truthfully to the question the VO will/may ask "Ni Shi Gong Chan Dang Yuan Ma?" (You are communist party member?). He CAN answer "NO" and hopefully/likely the V.O. will move on.

THEN...IF by some chance the V.O. continues to query, "HAVE YOU EVER BEEN a CCP member", then of course he says, "Yes". and "When did you quit?", says "I stopped paying my dues 1 month ago". If the latter scenario happened, the V.O. could not catch him in telling a LIE! :headbang: It is still a truthful approach! and WHY would anyone deliberately jump into the bottomless CCP hole that my MIL fell into by VOLUNTEERING "the COMPLETE story" to the simple question the V.O. first asks, if they can truthfully answer "NO"?

As for the DS-230 Part II.30.c question that relates to Communist party affiliation.. The question is a terrible, FIVE statement, compound sentence that ANYONE could interpret multiple different ways! It has NOT been presented in even a reasonably clear manner that anyone could argue that there is no possible alternate interpretations of its meaning! YES, many of us KNOW what they are REALLY asking for... but not all of us are English Grammer experts and it is a FACT that my Chinese wife DID NOT understand that question at all, when she filled out the I-130 application for her mother! AGAIN, if you answer "NO", you can reasonably claim that the question is not understandable should someone later attack your truthfulness.

and Lastly, Here are the important parts of the dreaded Visa Denial Form that my MIL received:

The Consulate cannot issue your visa until you submit these requested documents. If one is unavailable, submit a credible

explanation. Applicants must translate all documents into English.

RESUME

1. Provide a detailed resume (in both Chinese and English) for the applicant(s) listed below, including all professional and

educational history. Include a complete list of all of your employers, all specific job responsibilities and projects, and

any publications you have written. Note titles, descriptions and dates of all publications. Be as comprehensive as possible.

OVERSTAY

2. blah blah blah not related to CCP.

RELATIONSHIP

3. blah blah blah not related to CCP.

CCP

4. Provide a written statement from current/past employers verifying the person listed below does not belong to the

Chinese Communist Party.

_______________________

5. Submit a statement, written by the person listed below, in both Chinese and English that includes the information

requested below (A through H):

___________________

A. Name of the Communist or other totalitarian party to which he/she belong or belonged;

B. Reason for joining;

C. Dates of membership;

D. Any offices held;

E. Why he/she remained a member;

F. Any education or standard of living benefits by membership;

G. Degree to which he/she accepts(ed) the structure, goals, methods, and practices of the party;

H. If he/she terminated the association, the date of termination and reasons for terminating.

dnoblett · December 13, 2007

Honesty is best when dealing with this, if it does not get asked then no problem, however if it is asked then answer honestly, it may cause a delay, but is not a show-stopper.

See Paula's overcome.

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?...c=18469&hl= (Honesty)

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?...c=18884&hl=

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?...c=21054&hl= (DOS OKed)

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?...c=21492&hl= (Visa in hand)

warpedbored · December 14, 2007

Even if he could resign, he must have quit for 2-years BEFORE the date of VISA application before the Visa Officer can consider giving a waiver to him at the interview.

Whoa here! I know for a fact that at least one member here was still a CCP member when she got her visa. She had to wait about 4 months for the waiver to be approved. She couldn't quit the party without losing her job. She couldn't quit her job until she knew for sure she would get the visa.

dnoblett · December 14, 2007

Even if he could resign, he must have quit for 2-years BEFORE the date of VISA application before the Visa Officer can consider giving a waiver to him at the interview.
Whoa here! I know for a fact that at least one member here was still a CCP member when she got her visa. She had to wait about 4 months for the waiver to be approved. She couldn't quit the party without losing her job. She couldn't quit her job until she knew for sure she would get the visa.

Correct! A waiver is all that is needed to overcome the CCP issue if it comes up.

rogerwink · February 8, 2008

Even if he could resign, he must have quit for 2-years BEFORE the date of VISA application before the Visa Officer can consider giving a waiver to him at the interview.
Whoa here! I know for a fact that at least one member here was still a CCP member when she got her visa. She had to wait about 4 months for the waiver to be approved. She couldn't quit the party without losing her job. She couldn't quit her job until she knew for sure she would get the visa.

I stand by my statement as correct, according to the VO's interview guidelines (can't find the ref to those right now but you know the ones).

Please note the last three words in my statement "at the interview.".

IF the 2-year period has been met (to the belief of the VO) THEN the VO can proceed on with the interview to give the VISA if everything else goes OK. No "waiver" is needed.

IF the 2-year period is NOT met, OR the VO doesn't believe it has been met THEN the blue-slip is given and CCP Pit-of-despair is entered. A "waiver" is now REQUIRED.

Edited February 8, 2008 by rogerwink (see edit history)

Jaseball · February 20, 2008

If the person stopped paying party dues and hasn't attended any meetings in the past 2 years, but never formally withdrew from the party, then where do they stand?

dnoblett · February 20, 2008

If the person stopped paying party dues and hasn't attended any meetings in the past 2 years, but never formally withdrew from the party, then where do they stand?

Once a member always a member, unless they quit the party.

Again this is not a show stopper, it is fairly easy to overcome. With immigrations honesty is the best policy.

Sign In

A Communist Party catch-22!!

Recommended Posts

rogerwink

Link to comment

Randy W

Link to comment

warpedbored

Link to comment

rogerwink

Link to comment

warpedbored

Link to comment

MikeandRong

Link to comment

Silveril

Link to comment

lostinblue

Link to comment

rogerwink

Link to comment

dnoblett

Link to comment

warpedbored

Link to comment

dnoblett

Link to comment

rogerwink

Link to comment

Jaseball

Link to comment

dnoblett

Link to comment

Please sign in to comment

Browse

Activity