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Tax Return and filing a joint return


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Also they added this:

 

Have the copies notarized by a U.S. notary public legally

authorized within his or her local jurisdiction to certify that the

document is a true copy of the original. To do this, the notary must

see the valid, unaltered original document and verify that the copy

conforms to the original. Consular offices at U.S. Embassies and

Consulates overseas may not certify true copies of foreign public

documents and will refer applicants to the foreign authority that

issued the document.

 

 

 

This requirement, if your interpretation is correct, would mean that the copies must be notarized in the US, since China is not a Hague Convention country.

 

However, Hong Kong and Macau are, depending on how difficult it is to get there and whether you can find a willing notary.

 

Not my interpretation ... this is from the revised W-7 form. It means you can no longer get a US consulate office to notarize a true copy of a foreign passport regardless of the country. This is a change in the insturctuon and this March 2009 revision did not appear until May 2009.

Notarization is not the same as Certification. Notarization consist of simply signing a document in presence of a notary public, an official who serves the people. Certification implies the confirmation of the document, by a notarial office, in being authentic in which an apostille is asforementioned attached.

 

China, although not a Hague member "in force", like Hong Kong and Macau- they soon will be and have already been following certain articles of the convention for years, such as using apostilles to verify legitmacy of documents.

 

Yes - the original is the "notarial document" from China A copy to send to the IRS must be notarized/certified (the copy) as being a "true copy" of the original. The Guangzhou consulate is no longer performing this function.

 

What I an calling "confirmation" of the new policy would come when either Beijing and Shanghai stopped performing this function, or the IRS refused to accept a document from the Beijing Embassy.

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Sorry.. I was not clear enough in my other posts. I have tried this.

 

GUZ told me in MAR 09 they do not notary true copies anymore even for the IRS.

 

Beijing said they can do it. I got a notarized copy of my wife's passport in May 09 and sent in the W-7 form with revision date Feb. 2008 along with my taxes. The Beijing counsulate officer said nothing about this.

 

Tonight when looking at the W-7 form online in regards to this topic I found the form was dated Mar 09 and has the new wording.

 

I will find out if the IRS accepts or not. My real question is how can you get so different information from two embassy on a fundamental tax issue/policy ?

 

I'm curious about this (whether IRS will accept it), too. Last year I had a copy of my wife's passport notarized at a shipping place near where I work. No offense to the young man who stamped it - for all I know he seemed a nice and intelligent person - but it was very possible that he had never come across a Chinese passport before, unlike consular officers who see them every day. All he did was to confirm the copy was an identical copy of the original, he had no standing to comment on the original document anyhow. It is ironic that the IRS would trust his judgement but not the consular officers'.

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Sorry.. I was not clear enough in my other posts. I have tried this.

 

GUZ told me in MAR 09 they do not notary true copies anymore even for the IRS.

 

Beijing said they can do it. I got a notarized copy of my wife's passport in May 09 and sent in the W-7 form with revision date Feb. 2008 along with my taxes. The Beijing counsulate officer said nothing about this.

 

Tonight when looking at the W-7 form online in regards to this topic I found the form was dated Mar 09 and has the new wording.

 

I will find out if the IRS accepts or not. My real question is how can you get so different information from two embassy on a fundamental tax issue/policy ?

 

I'm curious about this (whether IRS will accept it), too. Last year I had a copy of my wife's passport notarized at a shipping place near where I work. No offense to the young man who stamped it - for all I know he seemed a nice and intelligent person - but it was very possible that he had never come across a Chinese passport before, unlike consular officers who see them every day. All he did was to confirm the copy was an identical copy of the original, he had no standing to comment on the original document anyhow. It is ironic that the IRS would trust his judgement but not the consular officers'.

 

Exactly my point as to this new information in the W-7 instructions. I will keep members informed of my case. I mailed my taxes from China to USA last week with the notarized "true copy".

 

Thanks to the mods/whoever for moving these posts to the correct topic location. I was too lazy to look it up. :D

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  • 6 months later...

I've read all this and I am still a little confused and was wondering if someone could straighten me out.

 

Maybe it's early, but I am starting to think about what to do for income tax filing. My then fiancee came to the US in mid July 2009. We were married in October. She returned to China mid November. She has been and will truly be dependent on me in 2009 and will not likely have any income for 2009. I don't know when or even if she will return the the US at this point. I may be the one joining her in China next year.

 

First question: If she remains in China, can I claim her as a dependent in 2009?

 

Second question: If so, I know I will have to get an ITIN for her. It will be next to impossible explain to my wife what to do to meet the requirement of having a copy of her passport notarized/certified in China, not to mention the difficulty of travel. I do have a copy of her passport; however, the notary "... must see the valid, unaltered original document and verify that the copy conforms to the original." Would a webcam suffice with screen captures as proof that this took place?

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I've read all this and I am still a little confused and was wondering if someone could straighten me out.

 

Maybe it's early, but I am starting to think about what to do for income tax filing. My then fiancee came to the US in mid July 2009. We were married in October. She returned to China mid November. She has been and will truly be dependent on me in 2009 and will not likely have any income for 2009. I don't know when or even if she will return the the US at this point. I may be the one joining her in China next year.

 

First question: If she remains in China, can I claim her as a dependent in 2009?

 

Second question: If so, I know I will have to get an ITIN for her. It will be next to impossible explain to my wife what to do to meet the requirement of having a copy of her passport notarized/certified in China, not to mention the difficulty of travel. I do have a copy of her passport; however, the notary "... must see the valid, unaltered original document and verify that the copy conforms to the original." Would a webcam suffice with screen captures as proof that this took place?

 

You didn't get her a SSN ? If so that's all you need. If not, then you need the ITIN.

 

Yes, since you are married, you can file together as long as you are legally married. It doesn't matter where you both live - since US Citizens are taxed on "world-wide" income. Don't forget if she "earns $/RMB" in China you will have to claim them on your "joint" income tax return.

Edited by 2mike&jin (see edit history)
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I've read all this and I am still a little confused and was wondering if someone could straighten me out.

 

Maybe it's early, but I am starting to think about what to do for income tax filing. My then fiancee came to the US in mid July 2009. We were married in October. She returned to China mid November. She has been and will truly be dependent on me in 2009 and will not likely have any income for 2009. I don't know when or even if she will return the the US at this point. I may be the one joining her in China next year.

 

First question: If she remains in China, can I claim her as a dependent in 2009?

 

Second question: If so, I know I will have to get an ITIN for her. It will be next to impossible explain to my wife what to do to meet the requirement of having a copy of her passport notarized/certified in China, not to mention the difficulty of travel. I do have a copy of her passport; however, the notary "... must see the valid, unaltered original document and verify that the copy conforms to the original." Would a webcam suffice with screen captures as proof that this took place?

 

You didn't get her a SSN ? If so that's all you need. If not, then you need the ITIN.

 

Yes, since you are married, you can file together as long as you are legally married. It doesn't matter where you both live - since US Citizens are taxed on "world-wide" income. Don't forget if she "earns $/RMB" in China you will have to claim them on your "joint" income tax return.

 

Thanks. I should have gotten a SSN, but we didn't need it to get married. In hindsight, it was a mistake.

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  • 1 year later...

I'm getting more and more confused.

 

For K-1, do I declare I'm single(when I'm not??. I forgot to get the SSN within 70 days(I'm going to attempt it tommorrow, but it'll be the 72nd day so I dunno). Even if he has the SSN, do I file married jointly and include his past year's income on that? He arrived in October, we got married in December.

 

If he does not, I have to get him a ITN, and get his passport notarized? Again with the file jointly/separate question. How do I prove how much he made was really what he made since as someone has said, China doesn't issue W2?

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I'm getting more and more confused.

 

For K-1, do I declare I'm single(when I'm not??. I forgot to get the SSN within 70 days(I'm going to attempt it tommorrow, but it'll be the 72nd day so I dunno). Even if he has the SSN, do I file married jointly and include his past year's income on that? He arrived in October, we got married in December.

 

If he does not, I have to get him a ITN, and get his passport notarized? Again with the file jointly/separate question. How do I prove how much he made was really what he made since as someone has said, China doesn't issue W2?

You wil not be declaring a foreign person's foreign income.

 

You will file a joint return.

 

Have you filed I-485 and I-765? If so then you should at least have EAD by April so you can get SSN for tax filing. If not can always file an extension.

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I'm getting more and more confused.

 

For K-1, do I declare I'm single(when I'm not??. I forgot to get the SSN within 70 days(I'm going to attempt it tommorrow, but it'll be the 72nd day so I dunno). Even if he has the SSN, do I file married jointly and include his past year's income on that? He arrived in October, we got married in December.

 

If he does not, I have to get him a ITN, and get his passport notarized? Again with the file jointly/separate question. How do I prove how much he made was really what he made since as someone has said, China doesn't issue W2?

You wil not be declaring a foreign person's foreign income.

 

You will file a joint return.

 

Have you filed I-485 and I-765? If so then you should at least have EAD by April so you can get SSN for tax filing. If not can always file an extension.

 

This is true for most of us - Check Publication 519 to be sure

 

http://candleforlove.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22151&view=findpost&p=276140

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My wife and I filed jointly, however, interestingly enough our electronially filed return was rejected due to the IRS not updating their database with the SSA, thus, even though Jingjing was issued a Social Security number (weeks before our filing), the IRS didn't have it in their records. As a result, they tried to issue us a 100.00 late fee - I do mean tried, as I got on the phone and gently pointed out that it was their fault and not ours. They aknowleged the error and all was forgiven. Apparently, according to the IRS rep I spoke with, they update their database with SSA quarterly.

 

EDIT:

 

Jingjing and I returned to the US in March 2010.

Edited by Kyle
Added more information (see edit history)
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No, I haven't filed for the I-485 yet. I've been waiting on the certified marriage certificate(urgh!). Should be able to submit it by next week, but I stumbled across the topic so I was wondering.

 

Wait, don't I have to have him elect to be considered a resident for the year of 2010(when he arrived in October), so I have to consider his income in China before that.

 

I guess I'll still file the extension but I have to pay first, but I don't want to pay a penalty if the AOS process gets dragged out and doesn't get done by October(wait, doesn't sound like it would... 6 months from now... ). Okay, I guess I won't worry about the SSN/extension part. Just don't know if I should go to an accountant because I've always filed my own taxes(I don't have anything special). The things people are mentioning are confusing but good to know.

Edited by luckystar (see edit history)
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  • 1 year later...

Hi All,

 

My wife is still in China and I am filing my taxes for 2011. I know that I can file a joint tax return and I have downloaded the W-7 form with the instructions. My problem is that I did not get a certified and or notarized copy of her Chinese passport when I was in China for our wedding last May. Is it possible to use other documents? I know W-7 instructions indicates that I can either have her passport or any 2 of the other listed items. Just wondering which of the other items might by thy best to send to the IRS. Also my stepson is 15 yrs old, do I also need a W-7 for him? I am a little confused with the process. Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions that you can provide me with.

 

Regards,

Chris

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Hi All,

 

My wife is still in China and I am filing my taxes for 2011. I know that I can file a joint tax return and I have downloaded the W-7 form with the instructions. My problem is that I did not get a certified and or notarized copy of her Chinese passport when I was in China for our wedding last May. Is it possible to use other documents? I know W-7 instructions indicates that I can either have her passport or any 2 of the other listed items. Just wondering which of the other items might by thy best to send to the IRS. Also my stepson is 15 yrs old, do I also need a W-7 for him? I am a little confused with the process. Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions that you can provide me with.

 

Regards,

Chris

 

Check Publication 501 to see if you can claim your step-son as a dependent, but, in general,

You cannot claim a person as a dependent unless that person is a U.S. citizen, U.S. resident alien, U.S. national, or a resident of Canada or Mexico.
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Hi All,

 

My wife is still in China and I am filing my taxes for 2011. I know that I can file a joint tax return and I have downloaded the W-7 form with the instructions. My problem is that I did not get a certified and or notarized copy of her Chinese passport when I was in China for our wedding last May. Is it possible to use other documents? I know W-7 instructions indicates that I can either have her passport or any 2 of the other listed items. Just wondering which of the other items might by thy best to send to the IRS. Also my stepson is 15 yrs old, do I also need a W-7 for him? I am a little confused with the process. Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions that you can provide me with.

 

Regards,

Chris

 

No W-7 for the step son. He will not go, and by law CAN not go, onto your taxes until he arrives in America.

 

I forget what the other docs the IRS says is acceptable, but I couldn't use them when I looked into getting the ITIN #. I just had her mail me her passport and took care of business. No, I didn't want to have to do that, but it was important enough to get the ITIN number that we decided we'd try sending her passport. It was almost too dang easy, as it turned out. You get one shot to prove your bona fide relationship with evidence at the interview....you can easily get another passport, if need be.

 

Good luck

 

 

tsap seui

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