Im screwed

[GaryandSherry]

Here is an interesting link defining a common law marriage.

 

http://www.ncsl.org/programs/cyf/commonlaw.htm

 

There is no such thing as common-law divorce. Quoted from the

above link.

233415[/snapback]

The footnote also says the divorce can only occur by court order...

233434[/snapback]

Ok. So now a common law divorce is recognized as a divorce, but the common law marriage wasn't? This doesn't make sense to me. Is it the court proceeding that made this divorce valid?

Edited July 25, 2006 by GaryandSherry (see edit history)

[MRMC]

Here is the issue.  Yes I know I am a moron so help not critism would be nice.

 

My ex girlfriend of 3 years ago.  Put me on some benifit papers at work.   In order to get me off the papers she filed for a divorce.  She used the common law marriage of Colorado as the basis.  Now foolishly I called NSCIS and they said they do not recognize Common Law marriage.  Quite franly I forgot about the damm paperwork.   When I was in China I got married.  Come to find out the "divorce paperwork"  was not complete.  There is a waiting period.  So my family lawer said that my marriage is not VOID.  However it is voidable.  So it's up to USCIS as to weather I am married.  So Ihave to wait for a "rejection"  I am sure.  Should I file for the I-129 Fiance' Visa after the rejection?  I am going back in 62 days to spend my honeymoon in Beijing with my wife.  Should I just get remarried then?  Will the Chinese Government allow me to get married again?  I have just added 3-6 months to the Visa I am sure.  Help

233389[/snapback]

I don't want to make any assumptions here. Were the "divorce papers" you mention presented in China? Did you indicate that relationship was a marriage?

 

Specifically how do you see this biting you?

 

Anyway if you ARE married to two people, the resolution on the last case like this was to complete the US divorce, take new papers to China and get the effective date of the marriage in China adjusted. China considers the current marriage valid.

 

Again, be specific about just how you see this biting you.

233396[/snapback]

Ok I am losing it. I am sorry.

 

I went to us Consoluate and stated I was single. Common law there is no official statement saying "I am married" It's only after you get your final Decree that it's a marriage (this is from what I have gathered so far). I was told on the phone two different things. The final Decree from my Common law marriage was after my real marriage. I do not have any paperwork saying it will be reject but the cas eoffice said I was not free to marry. Ergo the marriage was not valid.

233406[/snapback]

Please relax and provide a detailed chronology of what you did and what you were told. There are several possible scenarios but you haven't provided enough information.

 

Specifically, when did you officially inform USCIS of the divorce decree in question? Why did you do so?

 

What have you been told by USCIS and when?

233410[/snapback]

Married on the 30th of May

final Decree is posted at the courts on 17 July.

 

Forgot this common law thing. It was just to remove me from her paperwork. I signed them and forgot. no court or anything.

 

NCIS first told me the do not recognize Common law last week. True but if you file divorce papers than they do?

233411[/snapback]

Get a family practice lawyer!

[david_dawei]

I've been looking for a USCIS link I once read talking about processing of the K3 in light of the 'pending' I-130 (where's Ty when one needs him)... I cannot find the exact one...

 

Maybe someone like don, frank, lee, knows this regulation issue...

 

I'm not sure that you can pursue the I-129F/K3 if the I-130/CR1 is denied... If it went forward to interview (maybe because they approve it prior to the I-130 getting rejected), the VO would surely know the I-130 is denied and on what grounds.. and there's a lot of time wasted to see the I-129F/k3 denied at post.

 

(If it miraculously produced a K3 visa, then you could submit another I-130 as part of AOS--but this is getting into really naive speculation on my part... all sorts of examples to ask a lawyer about)

 

If the I-130 petition got approved somehow (oversight), I'm not sure it's worth the risk to find out if the visa gets approved (for either case)...

 

Although technically, consular officers don't have authority to approve petitions, only extend them... but I would think they can submit it back to USCIS for revocation if they notice a problem, and ask questions to produce an inconsistency in the petition and your statements. (So one cannot fully count on 'what DHS giveth the consulate cannot taketh'...).

 

In the end, there feels like lots of risk trying to move forward with the cases... It could be better to back track, pull petitions (before denials occur), clean up the chinese based marriage.. and then decide what to do (marry again or file fiancee -- after proper waiting).

 

I'm not trying to give advice, only talking through a few possible paths of pro/cons (maybe some of it is even wrongly thought out)... All of this should be discussed with a competent divorce and immigration lawyer...

[david_dawei]

Here is an interesting link defining a common law marriage.

 

http://www.ncsl.org/programs/cyf/commonlaw.htm

 

There is no such thing as common-law divorce. Quoted from the

above link.

233415[/snapback]

The footnote also says the divorce can only occur by court order...

233434[/snapback]

Ok. So now a common law divorce is recognized as a divorce, but the common law marriage wasn't? This doesn't make sense to me. Is it the court proceeding that made this divorce valid?

233455[/snapback]

I'll tell you my thought. .but this could be totally wrong..

 

USCIS does not recognize the CLM because it is not federally observed, it is a state by state issue. The footnote might be suggesting that the federal oversight occurs at the court order (they noted all states must do it by court order), rendering the previously unrecognized marriage , now a divorce... that waiting period is the time in which they start recognizing the marriage as valid and putting someone as "not free to marry"... May sound good but could be all wrong.

[Guest pushbrk]

I've been looking for a USCIS link I once read talking about processing of the K3 in light of the 'pending' I-130 (where's Ty when one needs him)...  I cannot find the exact one...

 

Maybe someone like don, frank, lee, knows this regulation issue...

 

I'm not sure that you can pursue the I-129F/K3 if the I-130/CR1 is denied...  If it went forward to interview (maybe because they approve it prior to the I-130 getting rejected), the VO would surely know the I-130 is denied and on what grounds.. and there's a lot of time wasted to see the I-129F/k3 denied at post. 

 

(If it miraculously produced a K3 visa, then you could submit another I-130 as part of AOS--but this is getting into really naive speculation on my part... all sorts of examples to ask a lawyer about)

 

If the I-130 petition got approved somehow (oversight), I'm not sure it's worth the risk to find out if the visa gets approved (for either case)... 

 

Although technically, consular officers don't have authority to approve petitions, only extend them...  but I would think they can submit it back to USCIS for revocation if they notice a problem, and ask questions to produce an inconsistency in the petition and your statements.  (So one cannot fully count on 'what DHS giveth the consulate cannot taketh'...).

 

In the end, there feels like lots of risk trying to move forward with the cases...    It could be better to back track, pull petitions (before denials occur), clean up the chinese based marriage.. and then decide what to do (marry again or file fiancee -- after proper waiting).

 

I'm not trying to give advice, only talking through a few possible paths of pro/cons (maybe some of it is even wrongly thought out)...  All of this should be discussed with a competent divorce and immigration lawyer...

233457[/snapback]

I went through pretty much the same thought process, David and came to pretty much the same conclusions.

 

1. Risk shutting up and waiting to see if the petitions are both approved. If they are, I don't really see problems down the road. The I-130 is really iffy though. If there was a way to get an early indication from USCIS on how they would deal with such a case, I'd get on it.

 

2. Withdraw both petitions. Get the marriage date adjusted and new certificate of marriage and start again.

 

3. Withdraw both petitions, divorce, remarry and start again.

[MRMC]

I may be biased as a lawyer but remember that a man who represents himself has a fool for a client and a fool for a lawyer.

[olemanoman1950]

My opinion is that if everyone at the county level all the way up to the Secretary of State that signed and sealed your proof of being single then so be it. You were single!! No if and's or Buts. Stay Married to your SO and let things take their course..

[david_dawei]

My opinion is that if everyone at the county level all the way up to the Secretary of State that signed and sealed your proof of being single then so be it. You were single!! No if and's or Buts. Stay Married to your SO and let things take their course..

233467[/snapback]

Except:

1) he sent to USCIS the divorce decree to be included into the I-130 packet..

2) the USCIS person on the phone noted a change to his I-130 case, from the applicable box on the form, marked originally as 'single' with a change to 'divorced'...

 

In a phone call, he verbally conveyed the information to an NVC case worker on the I-129F, but no paperwork copy (decree) was official sent to NVC... (Being at NVC implies the I-129F PETITION is already approved by USCIS-- but could be inferred at some point as documentarily "misrepresented"... this is not a good thing... akin to concealing the truth.)

 

I don't like all the risk I am seeing.. but I'm a nobody in regards to his visa process...

Edited July 25, 2006 by DavidZixuan (see edit history)

[Guest pushbrk]

My opinion is that if everyone at the county level all the way up to the Secretary of State that signed and sealed your proof of being single then so be it. You were single!! No if and's or Buts. Stay Married to your SO and let things take their course..

233467[/snapback]

Steve got his single certificate at the US Consulate in Guangzhou. There were no County or State officials involved. This is his first "marriage". That said, I think his marriage is valid.

[NewDay2006]

I say unless you reported this to someone in the USCIS, how would they know? I would simply be quiet and stop thinking about it. Even if there is a Divorce decree, they don't need to see it, because you were never married.

 

It is possible to married in 20 states and unless someone goes and tells the govt and shows proof, who cares? they don't. They just want to make sure no one can make claims on you after they allow your chinese wife into the country and make them liable by way of allowing her into the country.... I say you don't have anything to worry about dude.

Edited July 25, 2006 by NewDay2006 (see edit history)

[Guest pushbrk]

I say unless you reported this to someone in the USCIS, how would they know?  I would simply be quiet and stop thinking about it. Even if there is a Divorce decree, they don't need to see it, because you were never married.

 

It is possible to married in 20 states and unless someone goes and tells the govt and shows proof, who cares? they don't. They just want to make sure no one can make claims on you after they allow your chinese wife into the country and make them liable by way of allowing her into the country.... I say you don't have anything to worry about dude.

233474[/snapback]

Steve HAS reported this to the USCIS and sent a copy of the divorce decree. That's the problem.

[david_dawei]

My opinion is that if everyone at the county level all the way up to the Secretary of State that signed and sealed your proof of being single then so be it. You were single!! No if and's or Buts. Stay Married to your SO and let things take their course..

233467[/snapback]

Steve got his single certificate at the US Consulate in Guangzhou. There were no County or State officials involved. This is his first "marriage". That said, I think his marriage is valid.

233473[/snapback]

A divorce decree was issued for the CLM.. If it was done properly by court order [as the links mentioned]... then I'd probably disagree that the chinese marriage is the "first one"..

 

None of our opinions really matter.. maybe even a lawyers won't; only USCIS's decision will matter... but trust the lawyer over us

[Guest pushbrk]

My opinion is that if everyone at the county level all the way up to the Secretary of State that signed and sealed your proof of being single then so be it. You were single!! No if and's or Buts. Stay Married to your SO and let things take their course..

233467[/snapback]

Steve got his single certificate at the US Consulate in Guangzhou. There were no County or State officials involved. This is his first "marriage". That said, I think his marriage is valid.

233473[/snapback]

A divorce decree was issued for the CLM.. If it was done properly by court order [as the links mentioned]... then I'd probably disagree that the chinese marriage is the "first one"..

 

None of our opinions really matter.. maybe even a lawyers won't; only USCIS's decision will matter... but trust the lawyer over us

233478[/snapback]

I don't interpret the information at the link the same way but as you astutely point out, the interpretation that matters is that of the USCIS adjudicator.

 

It does seem to be a chicken and egg thing. They weren't "married" in the eyes of the USCIS until they were divorced.

[Randy W]

From the link:

 

Among those states that permit a common-law marriage to be contracted, the elements of a common-law marriage vary slightly from state to state. The indispensable elements are (1) cohabitation and (2) "holding out." "Holding out" means that the parties tell the world that they are husband and wife through their conduct, such as the woman's assumption of the man's surname, filing a joint federal income tax return, etc.

 

By this, the marriage was "contracted" when she (the ex) made him (her "husband") her beneficiary. UNLESS - he was added simply as a beneficiary, and no mention was made of marriage until she had to get him off.

 

What I'm thinking is that he was added as either a "husband", or as a friend. And then a life-changing event was needed to get him off, so she came up with the idea of a divorce.

 

So is it possible that the only time they were represented as a married couple was for the divorce?

 

This is complicated!!

[david_dawei]

From the link:

 

Among those states that permit a common-law marriage to be contracted, the elements of a common-law marriage vary slightly from state to state. The indispensable elements are (1) cohabitation and (2) "holding out." "Holding out" means that the parties tell the world that they are husband and wife through their conduct, such as the woman's assumption of the man's surname, filing a joint federal income tax return, etc.

 

By this, the marriage was "contracted" when she (the ex) made him (her "husband") her beneficiary. UNLESS - he was added simply as a beneficiary, and no mention was made of marriage until she had to get him off.

 

What I'm thinking is that he was added as either a "husband", or as a friend. And then a life-changing event was needed to get him off, so she came up with the idea of a divorce.

 

So is it possible that the only time they were represented as a married couple was for the divorce?

 

This is complicated!!

233484[/snapback]

you mean The World according to USCIS...

 

to the state of colorado, they were married.. uh..when married...

 

Interesting to note that the federal taxes would possibly have accepted them as married...

 

Wonder how they filed taxes?

 

I feel if I am batting even .200 on this thread.. I'd be happily embarrassed..