where's the outrage?

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

Too much emphasis is put on the Chinese party being the scammer.  Perhaps more often it is her that gets the short end of the stick.  Men will lie about their income, living conditions, debts, and beliefs just to get them over here.  The sweet loving attentive man in China may well turn out to be a domineering slave driver who wants to control the womans every move.  I know of women who's new husbands turn out to be abusive drunks.  One woman I  know, her husband hid her passport from her so she couldn't leave the country.  .  Jany's case is the most extreme.  She was lured here by a convicted sex offender who only wanted to molest her little girl.

166883[/snapback]

Yes Carl, this does indeed occur and it's most unfortunate when it does. It's important to emphasize however that while tragic, these cases fall heavily within the minority.

 

There are many travelling Americans that are both rude and disrepectful of the Chinese people in general. Because a few dumb-ass Americans behave like this makes is more difficult for those of us that are in fact kind, caring, and respectful of the Chinese people and their culture.

 

Out of desperation some women in China make poor decisions for the partners they pick. Some of the decisions are made out of naivety, while others may think that coming to America will just be a better life.

 

edit...

 

I however don't want to see Congress or the US government get involved with making more beauracracy to add protection to those that make bad decisions. We are a free country and I want to keep it that way. I don't think it's necessary to have someone in government say what is or is not going to be a good relationship.

Edited November 7, 2005 by ShaQuaNew (see edit history)

[david_dawei]

Considering the number of marriages our group has had in that same time frame I would have to conclude that we are above the norm in succesfull marriages. 

166772[/snapback]

I've came to the same thought in my brief time here...

 

Jesse posted an interesting link , which had:

 

 

"It is interesting to note that, based largely on data provided by the agencies themselves (along with the Commission on Filipinos Overseas report cited above), marriages arranged through these services would appear to have a lower divorce rate than the nation as a whole, fully 80 percent of these marriages having lasted over the years for which reports are available."

Edited November 7, 2005 by DavidZixuan (see edit history)

[warpedbored]

Too much emphasis is put on the Chinese party being the scammer.  Perhaps more often it is her that gets the short end of the stick.  Men will lie about their income, living conditions, debts, and beliefs just to get them over here.  The sweet loving attentive man in China may well turn out to be a domineering slave driver who wants to control the womans every move.  I know of women who's new husbands turn out to be abusive drunks.  One woman I  know, her husband hid her passport from her so she couldn't leave the country.  .  Jany's case is the most extreme.  She was lured here by a convicted sex offender who only wanted to molest her little girl.

166883[/snapback]

Yes Carl, this does indeed occur and it's most unfortunate when it does. It's important to emphasize however that while tragic, these cases fall heavily within the minority.

 

There are many travelling Americans that are both rude and disrepectful of the Chinese people in general. Because a few dumb-ass Americans behave like this makes is more difficult for those of us that are in fact kind, caring, and respectful of the Chinese people and their culture.

 

Out of desperation some women in China make poor decisions for the partners they pick. Some of the decisions are made out of naivety, while others may think that coming to America will just be a better life.

 

edit...

 

I however don't want to see Congress or the US government get involved with making more beauracracy to add protection to those that make bad decisions. We are a free country and I want to keep it that way. I don't think it's necessary to have someone in government say what is or is not going to be a good relationship.

166886[/snapback]

Perhaps but I see nothing wrong with making prior conviction records available to beneficiaries. It would have made a big difference to Jany's daughter I'm sure.

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

Perhaps but I see nothing wrong with making prior conviction records available to beneficiaries. It would have made a big difference to Jany's daughter I'm sure.

166927[/snapback]

Carl, these records are available to anyone that requests them. There are several third party companies in the US that do background checks on anyone you like for a fee.

 

Where I begin having a problem is when the US starts saying that it will provide this information to anyone that is immigrating to the US using a marriage based Visa. I think it begins infringing upon our rights as US citizens to have the government begin providing this as a service.

 

I don't believe that this will EVER pass legislation because if it does it would mean that every American man and every American woman would also be eligible to receive government funded background checks on their partners before marriage.

 

These third party background checking companies are big business here in the US these days, with many companies using them to screen potential employees. Also, many women are using these same services to screen men they have met online before they date them.

 

One could argue that they have nothing to hide so they therefore wouldn't mind the invasion by our government. It's not the responsibility of our government to keep people from doing stupid things. We all know that smoking and drinking are harmful, but yet many still do both everyday. Are these bad people? Many think so, and also believe that the government should keep them from doing these things.

 

My partner in China knows all about me. She asked me when she got her police report about getting one for me. I told her that the immigration service screens all applicants but that the results are secret. She knows that she could get a background check if she wanted one for me. She chooses not to. I have one for her anyway.

 

STOP GOVERNMENT REGULATION....there is already enough....

[warpedbored]

No one's rights would be violated since a criminal record is a matter of public record. Unlike their American counterparts however your Chinese fiancee/wife has no direct access to these records. She cant just go down to the county courthouse and request them. She could probably obtain them through the internet but would probably not have a clue as to where to start. Would you have an inkling on how to do the same on her in China?

[Guest ShaQuaNew]

No one's rights would be violated since a criminal record is a matter of public record.

 

Unlike their American counterparts however your Chinese fiancee/wife has no direct access to these records.

166937[/snapback]

You've misunderstood my point. As I previously mentioned, where I begin having a problem is when OUR government funds and provides this information to US citizens. This information is indeed available to anyone in the world, including China that pays the third party fee for doing the search for them.

 

Now, what would be more acceptable is to include a checkbox on the visa form that authorizes OUR government to either provide or NOT provide background information to the alien immigrant.

 

I would have no problem at that point of the VO alerting the Chinese partner by saying:

 

"your fiancee checked the box on your petition that states he / she does not want us to provide you the information contained in their background check." Would you care to pay $XX.00 to have a third party company procure and provide this information to you?

 

By giving the American citizen the option then you will not violate....

 

Bill of Rights; Amendment IV

 

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

[Guest Charmhuang]

I am also making no excuses for the gold diggers who lied their ass off for the single purpose of getting to the US and a green card. There is no excuse for this and these women should be sent back to China!

152987[/snapback]

Therein lies the problem- it's just too easy, once you meet a few sypathethic Americans with resources - to stay here after leaving the person who petitioned for you. The government is not interested at all in going after these women - they are too far down the priority list.

I think that these women know that if they can get across the border, they are here to stay. (By these women, I mean the small percentage that are only here for visas)

153004[/snapback]

Hi Chinadave,

 

I am Charm, Daniel's wife, I have been here for over 2 years, I remember Sarah got visa two months earlier than me.

 

I have not visited here for long, and today I found you are back again. How have you been since you separated with Sarah?

 

Just want to know how are things with you and hope all the best for you.

Charm

[Yuanyang]

I think along the same line as Carl does more specifically in the case he mentioned. A previously convicted child sex-offender should be not be allowed to bring a child over with his new wife. If that is understood by the convict then he (or rarely she) would know to not seek someone with a child (or that wants children).

[silly sick sad]

emm, i think if that happened, guys really need to calm down and think about why. as most of them maybe just want to marry a much younger chinese women with different culture background. properly have that daydream chinese women are quite tamely and quiet and will say yes to whatever the husbands say. and most of those guys just get married quite soon without knowing each other too well. so it is reasonable what happens next. and once you start seeking that kind of asian fantasy, you must prepare to taking the risk. what is your personality, what that your wife wants from you, does she love you as a real person or just a green card permition. and all i want to say is it is the fault from both the husband and wife, as from the very begining, this marriage is set on a werid situation which is not healthy for a real exellent couple life.

[Frank_a]

I am somewhat startled by the lack of outrage at what has happened to Mark, myself, and many others. We were suckered by women who wanted only one thing - an American green card. They promised anything and everything, said all the right things, slept with us, and then, once the goal was in sight and the border successfully navigated, quickly turned and looked for a better deal. Hell, my ex was handing out her email address on the goddamned airplane ride over here!

All I am saying is that when this stuff happens, there is a very muted response. If an American guy did this to a Chinese girl, you guys would be all over him. Imagine the response, if an American guy married the Chinese girl, and then, after a year or two, said " Get out and go home. I want a different, better, younger, prettier, richer ,etc., chinese girl. You did not fulfill my expectations." You guys would be all over him condemning him and offering help.

It seems to me that there is a double standard here.

Just my thoughts.

CD

152982[/snapback]

Prevention is always the best cure........for the rest of the men who are trying to find chinese wives.......what would you say are the warning signs, if any? How does one see through it all?

 

Good luck to you in the future !

 

 

Warning Signs:

1) She is in poverty and so are her children

2) She eagerly agrees that she should keep her working income and you pay all expenses.

3) She doesn't show any fear about moving to the USA

4) She is evasive when you ask questions about what she does.

5) She tells you she loves you quickly, but won't admit that she really wants to immigrate. Wanting to immigrate would be normal, if unhappy with current opportunities, but not admitting this is where the deceit started for me.

6) You find that answers she gives are not candid, but very carefully said, so as not to get you upset or concerned.

 

 

These would have to be the biggest warning signs I saw, but chose to exuse away.... if it smells like the toast are burning, they probably are!

 

I married a woman that was 49. Didn't marry to get someone younger. It might be a good idea to give those of us who have had a bad experience a little more benefit of the doubt.

[NewDay2006]

I am somewhat startled by the lack of outrage at what has happened to Mark, myself, and many others. We were suckered by women who wanted only one thing - an American green card. They promised anything and everything, said all the right things, slept with us, and then, once the goal was in sight and the border successfully navigated, quickly turned and looked for a better deal. Hell, my ex was handing out her email address on the goddamned airplane ride over here!

All I am saying is that when this stuff happens, there is a very muted response. If an American guy did this to a Chinese girl, you guys would be all over him. Imagine the response, if an American guy married the Chinese girl, and then, after a year or two, said " Get out and go home. I want a different, better, younger, prettier, richer ,etc., chinese girl. You did not fulfill my expectations." You guys would be all over him condemning him and offering help.

It seems to me that there is a double standard here.

Just my thoughts.

CD

152982[/snapback]

Prevention is always the best cure........for the rest of the men who are trying to find chinese wives.......what would you say are the warning signs, if any? How does one see through it all?

 

Good luck to you in the future !

 

 

Warning Signs:

1) She is in poverty and so are her children

2) She eagerly agrees that she should keep her working income and you pay all expenses.

3) She doesn't show any fear about moving to the USA

4) She is evasive when you ask questions about what she does.

5) She tells you she loves you quickly, but won't admit that she really wants to immigrate. Wanting to immigrate would be normal, if unhappy with current opportunities, but not admitting this is where the deceit started for me.

6) You find that answers she gives are not candid, but very carefully said, so as not to get you upset or concerned.

 

 

These would have to be the biggest warning signs I saw, but chose to exuse away.... if it smells like the toast are burning, they probably are!

 

I married a woman that was 49. Didn't marry to get someone younger. It might be a good idea to give those of us who have had a bad experience a little more benefit of the doubt.

I would say I had warning signs, but I was so darn "in love" and I wanted my new relationship to happen so much I ignored the warning signs. I guess in the long run I got what I let myself get. It was almost 2 years ago and the pain of it doesn't die, you just don't think about it as much. I feel lucky that I have my wife now, I don't have any of the warning signs like I did before. Is my current relationship perfect? No, but I love my woman and I don't doubt that she loves me. I also don't feel she will change over night as was the last case.

 

Again, I know your pain. Hang in there.

[Rakkasan]

Warning Signs:

1) She is in poverty and so are her children

2) She eagerly agrees that she should keep her working income and you pay all expenses.

3) She doesn't show any fear about moving to the USA

4) She is evasive when you ask questions about what she does.

5) She tells you she loves you quickly, but won't admit that she really wants to immigrate. Wanting to immigrate would be normal, if unhappy with current opportunities, but not admitting this is where the deceit started for me.

6) You find that answers she gives are not candid, but very carefully said, so as not to get you upset or concerned.

1) Most in China live in poverty by our standards so this warning sign is of little help.

2) My fiance' is eager to work so she can contribute to the household income. I do not need her income, but she feels it is important to contribute. This one was obvious and you should have noticed a problem.

3) Zhen has no fear of moving to the US, although she know little about life here. She has always stated that she is adventurous and this fits with those comments.

4) Zhen has never been evasive about work or anything that she does. If fact that is one of the things that attracted me to her was her openess.

5) She has always been prepared to immigrate to the US.

6) No an issue. We have had some disagreements in the past over things said or not said. We are both straight forward when talking and will deal with any problems created as a result after the fact.

 

Based on your posts, I think your lady probably gave you plenty of warning signs and you might have turned a blind eye to them hoping that you misunderstood her somehow. As I said before, I would let her return to China, but do not send her money. If I recall corerectly she has been working but not contributing to the household accounts. If this is the case then she has money available to live off of while in China and will not need your money. I don't know if she is truly taking you to the cleaners or not, but I would step back and try to review your relationship without passing judgment, but still being careful. Some things that you have stated seem odd for a Chinese lady. I understand her devotion to her son, but she should also have a devotion to you and based on your statements that does not appear to be present.

 

Good luck!!!

 

JMHO

[Dan R]

If you are swept away by love you wont recognize warnings as you trip over them. Those are clear only too late. You might also do the same because you want to take a chance on major change to your life.

 

Everyone tries things. Chinese tend to be more opportunistic, but don't we convince ourselves as much as anything.

 

You give it a try and if it doesn't work you try something else. The rest is emotional baggage. Sounds harsh but it works out that way over time no matter how you look at it.

 

If it works that's fantastic, no need to try again.

[NewDay2006]

If you are swept away by love you wont recognize warnings as you trip over them. Those are clear only too late. You might also do the same because you want to take a chance on major change to your life.

 

Everyone tries things. Chinese tend to be more opportunistic, but don't we convince ourselves as much as anything.

 

You give it a try and if it doesn't work you try something else. The rest is emotional baggage. Sounds harsh but it works out that way over time no matter how you look at it.

 

If it works that's fantastic, no need to try again.

Life is just a moment, so enjoy it.

 

We Live,we love.... just try to be smart.

[izus]

Life is just a moment, so enjoy it.

 

We Live,we love.... just try to be smart.

i agree Charles,

its better to regret something you have done then to regret something you havent